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Neo-Cons, the Dream is Over

a_unique_person

Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
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http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/09/16/1063625030945.html

The high-water mark for Washington's neo-cons may already have passed, writes Scott Burchill.

If events in Iraq continue on their present trajectory, the window of opportunity that neo-conservatives in Washington seized after the September 11 attacks will soon close.

The two-year window - which enabled Washington and its loyal allies to invade two countries and dispatch both governments (Afghanistan, Iraq), reconfigure US strategic doctrine from deterrence to pre-emption, ratchet up pressure on "rogue states" and "evil" regimes (Iran, North Korea, Syria), and declare war on terrorism - is closing for two reasons.

First, on the ground in occupied Iraq, Washington is slowly realising the limits of its power. For all its technological sophistication and military superiority, the Bush Administration is learning a painful lesson about the historical fate of colonialists in the Middle East.

Second, with opinion polls turning and George Bush putting his mind to the campaign for the presidential election in November next year, it is highly unlikely he will risk opening a new front in the "war against terrorism".


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Things have not gone according to plan for the neo-cons and their colleagues.

In Afghanistan, the Government of Hamid Karzai struggles to extend its power beyond the fringes of the capital Kabul, while warlords, the Taliban and the poppy growers resume their nefarious activities. Donors who pledged billions for rebuilding the state have reneged or gone missing, Washington has lost interest and been distracted by Iraq, while Karzai himself needs US bodyguards to forestall his assassination by political rivals.

...........

One effect of the war has been to encourage nuclear proliferation in Iran and North Korea, which now understand that only nuclear weapons will deter a US attack. Hardly the desired result.

Have to agree with the last bit, NK is sitting pretty at the moment, making the US dance to it's tune.
 
This was all predicted by wiser heads leading up to the various invasions. And history is crammed with such lessons as well, from time immemorial.

Again, the question needs to be asked: Was anyone actually listening in the war-bunkers of Washington?
 
neo-convservative:

worst buzz-word created with the intent of making a bad connotation and thereby dismissal by association....... ever
 
corplinx said:
neo-convservative:

worst buzz-word created with the intent of making a bad connotation and thereby dismissal by association....... ever

Dunno. "progressive" for screaming liberal commie picko comes close
 
corplinx said:
neo-convservative:

worst buzz-word created with the intent of making a bad connotation and thereby dismissal by association....... ever
You think so? I thought it was coined by conservatives themselves to make themselves look like "new and improved conservatives". Certainly there is nothing in the term itself that connotates badness. Admittedly, many liberals spit out the word "neo-conservative" the way some conservatives spit out the word "liberal". Still, you have to admit it's better than "war monger" or "hate merchant".
 
i think usage of the term "neo" is most likely a sly attempt to bring to mind another "neo" group, in other words another attempt to associate people who believe in a flat tax with racial superiority and anti-semitism
 
corplinx said:
i think usage of the term "neo" is most likely a sly attempt to bring to mind another "neo" group, in other words another attempt to associate people who believe in a flat tax with racial superiority and anti-semitism

Neo is just a general prefix, meaning new, IIRC. I have seen it used in other contexts besides Neo-Nazi.
 
Re: Re: Neo-Cons, the Dream is Over

Grammatron said:


Curious, what was so bad about invading Afghanistan?

I think that everyone knew that America was going to take one swipe at someone for 9/11. However, they now have a country that is still inherently unstable and run by warlords who have no interest other than defending their own turf.

The US got it's revenge for 9/11, but the result of that revenge is not all that worthwhile for the people living there, nor the US which as it's prestige at stake.
 
Re: Re: Re: Neo-Cons, the Dream is Over

a_unique_person said:


I think that everyone knew that America was going to take one swipe at someone for 9/11. However, they now have a country that is still inherently unstable and run by warlords who have no interest other than defending their own turf.

The US got it's revenge for 9/11, but the result of that revenge is not all that worthwhile for the people living there, nor the US which as it's prestige at stake.

Well, first of all we are not done there the country needs to be rebuilt it's going to take long, long time for that to happen. USA is not the only country who is involved there nor is anyone claiming we were wrong to invade Afghanistan, aside from you and some people who were on the "other side" (not to imply you are a terrorist or anything). That place is in bad shape, yet it's still better off now than it was during Taliban.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Neo-Cons, the Dream is Over

Grammatron said:


Well, first of all we are not done there the country needs to be rebuilt it's going to take long, long time for that to happen. USA is not the only country who is involved there nor is anyone claiming we were wrong to invade Afghanistan, aside from you and some people who were on the "other side" (not to imply you are a terrorist or anything). That place is in bad shape, yet it's still better off now than it was during Taliban.

Given that Kabul itself is the only area under any form of control, and that even there the PM has to have body guards protecting him all the time from attempts on his life, I don't know that those living in the rest of the country would find much difference between the Taliban and a warlord.
 
corplinx said:
neo-convservative:

worst buzz-word created with the intent of making a bad connotation and thereby dismissal by association....... ever

Croplinx, can you please stop posting on matters you know absolutely nothing about? (In such an ideal world you would average maybe one message per month.)

Have you ever heard of a guy by the name of Irving Kristol?

Hint: He's Bill Kristol's father. Bill Kristol, of course, is the editor of the most important neo-conservative publication, _The Weekly Standard_.

Um, yeah.
 
The term "neo-conservative" was coined as a bad attempt at relevance riding on the popularity of the Matrix movies. It was better than some alternatives, most particularly the idea of renaming the movement "The Back Street Boys":D
 

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