Captain_Snort
Muse
but as M$ has stopped magazines cover discs carrying security updates, and its bound to be yet another huge download to fix, its just yet another reason to ditch M$ and use a decent OS.
(either that or go broadband)
(either that or go broadband)
Thanks RC. I have auto update off (along with most other so-called "services", so I tend to forget about security patches. I just looked.
I'm due a 21.9MB download.
I remember when the whole damn OS came on 1 floppy!
(Exits , dribbling into long grey beard.)
I'm due a 21.9MB download.
I remember when the whole damn OS came on 1 floppy!
(Exits , dribbling into long grey beard.)
TillEulenspiegel
Master Poster
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It's effects are so pervasive that it seems this would be a source code level hack to exploit. I'm not happy with MS's response, but I wonder how many people really know enough code at that level (besides MS code drones ) to exploit it. That SHtuff is like the secret coca cola formula, not commonly available.
Bottle or the Gun
Muse
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- 890
I read somewhere that the next MS OS won't give free patches. Is this Anti-Bill propoganda? Are we expected to pay for fixes for buggy software or remain vulnerable?
a_unique_person
Director of Hatcheries and Conditioning
Soapy Sam said:
I remember when you had to type it in.
TillEulenspiegel
Master Poster
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Well after I* created the universe on the 7th day I* took a breather. I* was musing how the laws of the universe should be written. Should I* eccode the laws in software or hardware?. I* tried both. One effort produced spoken word which looking at how creation myths and the bible ( hehe thats a good one ) turned out was a poor idea , the other is ..... well you know Pi and e and there's others out there . Guess I*should never 2nd guess myself.
---God (well thats my avatar's name anyway)
*(he who shall not be named, tm.)
---God (well thats my avatar's name anyway)
*(he who shall not be named, tm.)
teddygrahams
Critical Thinker
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- Nov 25, 2001
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richardm said:
Some Army recruiting ads invited you to "learn computer programming" on the Eniac, using patch cords !
TillEulenspiegel
Master Poster
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Evedently my thoughts on the hack being source code level was correct , seems Micro$oft is looking for a mole.
(theres a similar thread)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/3485545.stm
(theres a similar thread)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/3485545.stm
TillEulenspiegel said:
What are you talking about?
A) What does it mean to say a hack is "source code level?"
B) Does the article have anything to do with any critical flaws in Windows? No.
Is anyone other than you drawing this connection?
jimlintott
Master Poster
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I'm not sure that the source code leak represents a big security problem for Windows users in the future. I suppose it is possible that there are some glaring back doors in it that could be exploited but most MS exploits are buffer overflows and social engineering. If some bugs are going to be obvious in the source you would think that MS coders would have fixed them already.
The problem for MS is that this is another blotch on an already weak security record. They are losing trust amongst their customers. That is a business killer.
The problem for MS is that this is another blotch on an already weak security record. They are losing trust amongst their customers. That is a business killer.
TillEulenspiegel
Master Poster
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A) What does it mean to say a hack is "source code level?"
Sorce code is the human level programming language used to write a program a computer I.E C++, Basic,COBAL,FORTRAN. This is a high level language that shows the structure of what the programmer is attempting to accomplish, normally it will include labels that give a programmer an intuitive grasp of a highly complex programming ideas and convenient management of I/O processes and interrupts.
The program then is converted either directly to machine language or thru an intermediate processes to assembler language then machine code. Machine code is nothing but 0 and 1s, it in its finished form exclude all comments and structures that make high level languages easy for humans to use.
"Hack" is a loose term like Kluge and has various meanings , the usage in this case meant ( which dates me ) ..to cobble together a small program or just some lines of code that take advantage of the structure of Windows OS. The level of the knowledge of the person who could do this demonstrates an understanding of the source code of Windows, which is one of the most closely guarded secrets since pythagorean theorem.
B) Does the article have anything to do with any critical flaws in Windows? No.
Well perhaps I responded with more latitude to the thread topic then You would allow,but the truth is there is no flaw, just an intimate knowledge on someone's part that they sought to expose to a wide audience. Well consider it a rebuttal to the idea of a flaw and not an OOT response.
Is anyone other than you drawing this connection?
Umm Yes..........
http://news.independent.co.uk/digital/news/story.jsp?story=491183
http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2004/Feb04/02-12windowssource.asp
http://msnbc.msn.com/ID/4253584/
Personally I preferred the brevity of my other post, like a joke , if you have to explain it...
edit to add:
Agree Jim, thats why the open source model (Linux) is better. It's subject to the most brutal examination and debugging process that ensures robustness because it is not profit driven and fixes bugs on the fly and when there is a security flaw ( or more normally a driver flaw =) ) it is addresed and not sat upon.
Sorce code is the human level programming language used to write a program a computer I.E C++, Basic,COBAL,FORTRAN. This is a high level language that shows the structure of what the programmer is attempting to accomplish, normally it will include labels that give a programmer an intuitive grasp of a highly complex programming ideas and convenient management of I/O processes and interrupts.
The program then is converted either directly to machine language or thru an intermediate processes to assembler language then machine code. Machine code is nothing but 0 and 1s, it in its finished form exclude all comments and structures that make high level languages easy for humans to use.
"Hack" is a loose term like Kluge and has various meanings , the usage in this case meant ( which dates me ) ..to cobble together a small program or just some lines of code that take advantage of the structure of Windows OS. The level of the knowledge of the person who could do this demonstrates an understanding of the source code of Windows, which is one of the most closely guarded secrets since pythagorean theorem.
B) Does the article have anything to do with any critical flaws in Windows? No.
Well perhaps I responded with more latitude to the thread topic then You would allow,but the truth is there is no flaw, just an intimate knowledge on someone's part that they sought to expose to a wide audience. Well consider it a rebuttal to the idea of a flaw and not an OOT response.
Is anyone other than you drawing this connection?
Umm Yes..........
http://news.independent.co.uk/digital/news/story.jsp?story=491183
http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2004/Feb04/02-12windowssource.asp
http://msnbc.msn.com/ID/4253584/
Personally I preferred the brevity of my other post, like a joke , if you have to explain it...
edit to add:
Agree Jim, thats why the open source model (Linux) is better. It's subject to the most brutal examination and debugging process that ensures robustness because it is not profit driven and fixes bugs on the fly and when there is a security flaw ( or more normally a driver flaw =) ) it is addresed and not sat upon.
TillEulenspiegel said:
Thanks, I'm a professional programmer. What I'm asking is what you meant by using those words together. It reads like nonsense.
For the record, I imagine most people in the industry would read "souce code level hack" to mean a hack that has been inserted into the source code for the target project, which is not at all how the Windows security flaws are taken advantage of (*).
This is what I suspected you probably meant, but it's simply untrue. If you'd care to support that statement, I'd love to hear your support.
I wasted my time looking at all three of these links, none of which draws any connection between the latest hacks to effect Windows and the release of the source code, which is what you are claiming.
(Emphasis mine)
Untrue. Many, many contributors to the Linux source code are *completely* profit driven. You need look no further than mods submitted by developers of Linux distributions.
Even if it were true, you're the only person I know who claims profit motive makes Linux better. Why do you feel that is so?
What meaning does "on the fly" have in this context?
I'd insert "more likely to be" - but otherwise very true.
-Chris
(*) We don't know of any "hacks" in the Windows code like this, but it is well known that one of the major arguments for open source is that it makes this kind of "hack" less likely to succeed.