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Luke T: Drug Dealer or Cold Sufferer?

Luke T.

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May 2, 2003
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The thing about having three toddlers is that somebody always has a cold, and often, the whole family. Currently, it is my and our girl twin's turn.

So I stopped at a pharmacy on my way in to work to get some Robitussin CF. That is the only medicine that works for me when I have a head cold.

The shelves were stocked with the umpteem varieties of Robitussin, but no CF. So I asked the pharmacist what's up with that.

Apparently, since the last time I had a head cold, the laws of my state have changed. Any medication which has the ingredient pseudophedrine is now a controlled substance. This is a key ingredient for meth, and our state has a serious meth lab problem. Hell, there was a meth lab just down the street from where I work, in a very nice neighborhood, in a town of less than 5,000.

I was worried I'd have to get a prescription for this cough syrup, but instead all that was required was that I show some ID, and the pharmacist had to log my personal information down.

I guess that means I'm going into some database now as a potential meth cook. I don't know what the limit is before the authorities start bugging my phone, but I wonder when my kids are old enough where I can give them CF, too, and I'm buying the stuff by the case, if I'm going to have to dodge a gauntlet of billy clubs on my way to the counter.
 
This is all part of our extremely successful "war on drugs". Who needs rights or privacy when we have this "war on drugs" that is ripping at the fabric of our society.

Charlie (along with gay marriage) Monoxide
 
Oh goody. My favorite subject. I know more than I ever wanted to know about meth.

It appears that possesion of ingredients used to make meth, along with "intent" are all that is needed to make one a felon in some states...

Many cold medicines, Heet, Coleman fuel, coffee filters, matchboxes... even a hot plate or empty soda botle or some rubber tubes...

Those are three ingredients/tools used to make meth, and under most state's meth laws all that is needed now is proof that you "intended" to make meth.

Now, since "intent" is a mental state and to date we lack the technology for a brain scan, "intent" is determined from other evidence. In practice this means if someone looks poor or a cop doesn't like this person, goodbye. Once the jury hears the words "methamphetamine" and sees a shred of evidence, hairs are not going to be split these days...

Meth is IMO the true moment of absurdity w/r/t the drug war. It can be made with common household items, so aggressive legislation intending to keep people from making plus public panic leads to criminalization of household items if the cops don't like you.

There are few people reading this for whom the only thing seperating them from being a felon is this hazy idea of "intent."


To me, aggressive prevention of meth labs is a question of which problem is worse, cleaning up the toxic labs or dealing with drug dealer turf wars. A lab crackdown reduces supply without touching demand. Price goes up and suppliers lessen to where import of the drug becomes profitible. Since those in this business can't go to the law or the courts to settle disputes...

Not to mention the increase in property crimes when the price of meth goes up...

Meth... the latest Evil That Must Be Stopped from those that brought you past hits like "Reefer Madness," "Crack," and that golden oldie, Prohibition....
 
NyQuill is on the list too. I've also read that walmart has a cap on how many lithium batteries you can buy for the same reasons.

What can we expect in the future? Carded for such items as plastic baggies1, Honey Bears2, KY Jelly3. Sometimes I wish the libertarians would meet me half way. I'm not asking that they give up crazy completely, just meet me halfway for here to crazytown.


1. They transport drugs in those you know.

2. Those hippy kids make bongs out of those.

3. Ass-sex is still illegal in many a state.
 
The great meth-war started with just limiting the number of packages of cold medicine one could buy at one time, at one drug store. Obviously, that didn't work, since even a meth-head could figure out "go to many stores." Then, the government ramped up the big brother act to "you must show ID and only buy two (2) packages at a time." Next, it will probably be, show ID, buy only 2 packages, get fingerprinted and supply a DNA swab.

BTW, Luke--Triaminic Nighttime Cough and Cold is pretty good for the little ones. Knocks 'em right out.
 
Lisa Simpson said:
BTW, Luke--Triaminic Nighttime Cough and Cold is pretty good for the little ones. Knocks 'em right out.
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Is that a good thing? I worry about drugging my kids. If they have a runny nose, that's one thing. Ain't gonna drug 'em. But if they are suffering, I want to relieve their pain but not do any brain or other major organ damage.

I feel terrible inside when they are drugged and groggy laying motionless on the couch under a blanket, and not their usual home furnishing destroying selves.
 
Well, I only give my kids cold medicine at night, so they (and I) can sleep. During the day, they have to suffer like everyone else here. Because I don't want them drugged up when all they have is a cold.
 
Okay. I'll make a note about Triaminic. Thanks, Lisa.

I guess giving them meth is out of the question.
 
My opinion on the whole pseudoephedrine thing has changed. At first, I thought it was just another stupid increase in the drug war. But since then (about a year ago) I've read every article I happen to run across and my opinion has changed.

It's true, keeping the home labs from cooking up their own meth doesn't reduce supply. From what I understand, most meth is made in Mexico or in labs close to the Mexican border.

But what it does do is keep the children that are present in these home meth labs from getting exposed to the chemicals involved.

No, this isn't a "think of the children" type post. I was truly against these stupid restrictions. However, after reading articles in several different places, interviewing lots of people who are actually dealing with it, I do believe its at least a step to protect those who really don't have anyone to protect them. Their meth addict parents certainly aren't going to.
 
Luke T. said:
Okay. I'll make a note about Triaminic. Thanks, Lisa.

I guess giving them meth is out of the question.
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I'm guessing, yeah. Out of the question. But hooking them up to the McDonald's/Disney pipeline--perfectly acceptable.
 
gethane said:
My opinion on the whole pseudoephedrine thing has changed. At first, I thought it was just another stupid increase in the drug war. But since then (about a year ago) I've read every article I happen to run across and my opinion has changed.

It's true, keeping the home labs from cooking up their own meth doesn't reduce supply. From what I understand, most meth is made in Mexico or in labs close to the Mexican border.

But what it does do is keep the children that are present in these home meth labs from getting exposed to the chemicals involved.

No, this isn't a "think of the children" type post. I was truly against these stupid restrictions. However, after reading articles in several different places, interviewing lots of people who are actually dealing with it, I do believe its at least a step to protect those who really don't have anyone to protect them. Their meth addict parents certainly aren't going to.
Click to expand...

As a volunteer in prisons for the last ten years, I've come in contact with every kind of criminal there is, and the meth heads' thought processes scare me second only to the thought processes of child molestors.

There has been many a time I have had spiders crawling in my head for days after talking to a meth head in prison.

And boy do they like guns!
 
gethane said:
But what it does do is keep the children that are present in these home meth labs from getting exposed to the chemicals involved.
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Aren't we then simply "outsourcing" the social and environmental costs of meth production to other countries? Is that a morally tenable position?
 
Well, I don't think its being made in mexican HOMES though, I can't recall a specific article that talked about it. I know there are some bigger labs out west near the border (from what I've read).

It isn't the meth USE this legislation is trying to change, but keeping these dangerous small HOME labs (with children) from operating.

So, no, I don't think its outsourcing the risk in that way.
 
gethane said:
Well, I don't think its being made in mexican HOMES though, I can't recall a specific article that talked about it. I know there are some bigger labs out west near the border (from what I've read).

It isn't the meth USE this legislation is trying to change, but keeping these dangerous small HOME labs (with children) from operating.

So, no, I don't think its outsourcing the risk in that way.
Click to expand...
It's probably true that this particular problem won't travel with production, but I seriously doubt that Mexican meth labs will be responsibly disposing of toxic by-products, which means that children (and adults) are going to be coming into contact with them. Given Mexico's relatively lax environmental policy, it might happen to an even greater extent.

I understand that the legislation isn't targeting demand, and I'm arguing that maybe it should be.
 
Luke T. said:
As a volunteer in prisons for the last ten years, I've come in contact with every kind of criminal there is, and the meth heads' thought processes scare me second only to the thought processes of child molestors.
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Luke, if it's not to much trouble, could you expand on this? We've seen some coverage down South here on meth, but it's still 'under the radar' of many, but the more I read on it the more I think this is like crack cocaine, working away at the poor/underclass (and of course we don't see such things) until it surfaces--with a vengance--in all of society.

And this sounds particulary nasty-reasonably easy to make, distribute, and some rather nasty side effects, IIRC.

Frankly, it worries me--both the drug and the response, such as you show in your OP, to date.

We shall see.
 
The problem with Methamphetamine is that it is such a simple molecule that you could make it difficult to get pretty much any precusor and a chemist would still be able to make it up via a different rout.
 
Think of the children. Won't someone think of (Luke T's sniffing, sneezing) children?

BTW, be happy you don't llive in Oregon. To get pseudofed in Oregon, you need to get a prescription from a doctor. In other words, to get relief you will need to take half a day off, spend $90 on a doctor's visit and sit next to dozen of sneezing, sniffling people. Or you can drive to Washington and be considered a drug dealer when you try to by 5 packages to ensure you have enough for the winter.

Also, there is a movement to ban pseudofed altogether. The claim is that there are alternative so there is no reason for anyone to use it. No reason except that it is the only cold medicine I can take and still have a clear head.

99.9% of the people who buy pseudofed have a cold. But f*** 'em. A few people want to feel better in another way. F*** 'em, to.

CBL
 
CBL4 said:
Think of the children. Won't someone think of (Luke T's sniffing, sneezing) children?

BTW, be happy you don't llive in Oregon. To get pseudofed in Oregon, you need to get a prescription from a doctor. In other words, to get relief you will need to take half a day off, spend $90 on a doctor's visit and sit next to dozen of sneezing, sniffling people. Or you can drive to Washington and be considered a drug dealer when you try to by 5 packages to ensure you have enough for the winter.
Click to expand...

Not true. I live in Oregon. I just bought Robitussin CF this morning as I described in my OP. I just had to show my driver's license and the pharmacist had to log the information on it.
 
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