iangoeswest
Scholar
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2013
- Messages
- 80
The purpose of this thread is to discuss the legislative action and constitutional framework which undergirds the growing revelations of the intelligence-gathering actions of the NSA in the US.
There is no small amount of essentially partisan argument over where the "blame" lies for the undisputed increase in domestic intelligence gathering. I want to tease out what happened at the legal level to bring us to this pass.
Initial disclaimers / assumptions: intelligence-gathering on the part of the US government has been increasing. Reasonable minds may disagree as to whether this is a good or bad thing, but there is some amount of reasonable concern as to the scope of the intelligence gathering and its potential uses beyond those stated. Some intelligence gathering is both extra-legal and extra-constitutional and isn't susceptible to ready analysis. As to that intelligence-gathering happening within the legal and constitutional framework, our knowledge is hampered because those reporting it on the government side have not always been honest in their reporting of what they're doing.
We cannot know with certitude what information "they" are gathering, and we cannot know with certitude what "they" are doing with it. What we can know is what Congress authorized the Executive Branch to do, and it is those milestones that I seek to discuss.
I pick up my argument at the point where I think we went off the rails. This is of course a judgment call on my part. The passage of the Foreign Intellligence Surveillance Act, and the "secret" court it created, was viewed at the time as a remedial measure, as a check upon the intelligence gathering (and more nefarious) activities which occurred by the Executive in the years preceding it as revealed by the Church Committee. What is good and bad about the whole FISA structure may emerge from the discussion, but hindsight is 20/20 and that is not where I start the discussion.
My assertion is as follows: There were two significant legislative actions that brought us to this pass.
The first was the passage of the USA PATRIOT Act in October 2001, which 1) expanded the reach of "foreign intelligence information" to incude US citizens, 2) lessened the standard under which such information could be sought, by making the gathering of foreign intelligence a "significant" rather than the "primary" purpose of such intelligence gathering, and 3) expanded the reach of surveillance orders - "wiretaps," so to speak - to include packet-switched networks - instead of listening to phone lines, the government could now sniff packets, and a "wiretap" necessarily caught not just its target and whomever she talked to on the phone, but its target and ALL of her internet contacts, websites visited, etc.
The second was the passage of the FISA Amendments Act, passed in July 2008, which 1) provided legal immunity for telecom companies who assist the NSA in their intelligence gathering activities, 2) lessened the requirements of specificity for authorization of intelligence-gathering, and 3) permitted the Executive Branch to authorize warrantless electronic surveillance for one-year periods for non-Americans abroad.
Caveats: there were other significant amendments to surveillance law in 2006-2007. I have selected those amendments which I believe, based on the information I've seen, to be most relevant to the recent dustup. The FISA Amendments Act was staunchly defended by the incoming Obama administration, which pushed for and received its reauthrization in December of 2012 just prior to its sunsetting. I voted for Obama, but am critical of much of his policy in this area.
There is a necessarily partisan cast to some of this discussion, and I will reveal my bias frankly: I believe that while this President is to be held accountable for the actions which occurred during his watch, the legal framework for the intelligence gathering currently in the news was put in place during the predecessor administration. It is good that folks are complaining about it now. One has more credibility if they were also complaining about it then, when the actual laws were passed that birthed the chickens which have now come home to roost.
But I do not wish for THIS thread to be a discussion about how good and bad this president is; I want to discuss the legal framework which brought us to this pass.
There is no small amount of essentially partisan argument over where the "blame" lies for the undisputed increase in domestic intelligence gathering. I want to tease out what happened at the legal level to bring us to this pass.
Initial disclaimers / assumptions: intelligence-gathering on the part of the US government has been increasing. Reasonable minds may disagree as to whether this is a good or bad thing, but there is some amount of reasonable concern as to the scope of the intelligence gathering and its potential uses beyond those stated. Some intelligence gathering is both extra-legal and extra-constitutional and isn't susceptible to ready analysis. As to that intelligence-gathering happening within the legal and constitutional framework, our knowledge is hampered because those reporting it on the government side have not always been honest in their reporting of what they're doing.
We cannot know with certitude what information "they" are gathering, and we cannot know with certitude what "they" are doing with it. What we can know is what Congress authorized the Executive Branch to do, and it is those milestones that I seek to discuss.
I pick up my argument at the point where I think we went off the rails. This is of course a judgment call on my part. The passage of the Foreign Intellligence Surveillance Act, and the "secret" court it created, was viewed at the time as a remedial measure, as a check upon the intelligence gathering (and more nefarious) activities which occurred by the Executive in the years preceding it as revealed by the Church Committee. What is good and bad about the whole FISA structure may emerge from the discussion, but hindsight is 20/20 and that is not where I start the discussion.
My assertion is as follows: There were two significant legislative actions that brought us to this pass.
The first was the passage of the USA PATRIOT Act in October 2001, which 1) expanded the reach of "foreign intelligence information" to incude US citizens, 2) lessened the standard under which such information could be sought, by making the gathering of foreign intelligence a "significant" rather than the "primary" purpose of such intelligence gathering, and 3) expanded the reach of surveillance orders - "wiretaps," so to speak - to include packet-switched networks - instead of listening to phone lines, the government could now sniff packets, and a "wiretap" necessarily caught not just its target and whomever she talked to on the phone, but its target and ALL of her internet contacts, websites visited, etc.
The second was the passage of the FISA Amendments Act, passed in July 2008, which 1) provided legal immunity for telecom companies who assist the NSA in their intelligence gathering activities, 2) lessened the requirements of specificity for authorization of intelligence-gathering, and 3) permitted the Executive Branch to authorize warrantless electronic surveillance for one-year periods for non-Americans abroad.
Caveats: there were other significant amendments to surveillance law in 2006-2007. I have selected those amendments which I believe, based on the information I've seen, to be most relevant to the recent dustup. The FISA Amendments Act was staunchly defended by the incoming Obama administration, which pushed for and received its reauthrization in December of 2012 just prior to its sunsetting. I voted for Obama, but am critical of much of his policy in this area.
There is a necessarily partisan cast to some of this discussion, and I will reveal my bias frankly: I believe that while this President is to be held accountable for the actions which occurred during his watch, the legal framework for the intelligence gathering currently in the news was put in place during the predecessor administration. It is good that folks are complaining about it now. One has more credibility if they were also complaining about it then, when the actual laws were passed that birthed the chickens which have now come home to roost.
But I do not wish for THIS thread to be a discussion about how good and bad this president is; I want to discuss the legal framework which brought us to this pass.