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LDS-fundie "prophet" ordered to stand trial

Mephisto

Philosopher
Mephisto
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Apr 10, 2005
Messages
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Hmmmm, I wonder if he prophesized this? ;)

Polygamist 'prophet' ordered to stand trial

POSTED: 8:37 a.m. EST, December 15, 2006

ST. GEORGE, Utah (AP) -- Polygamist sect leader Warren Jeffs is either a heartless autocrat or benevolent marriage counselor, depending on who you ask.

Those starkly different assessments were offered Thursday in a courtroom where Jeffs was ordered to stand trial on two counts of rape as an accomplice. He is accused of forcing a 14-year-old girl to marry and have sex with an older cousin.

Jeffs, 51, pleaded not guilty to the felony charges that could send him to prison for life. A trial was set for April 23. (Watch Warren Jeffs in court )

Defense attorney Walter F. Bugden argues that Jeffs only presided over the 2001 wedding, urged the unhappy girl to accept her assigned husband and perhaps find love by having children.

Bugden contends that Jeffs, leader of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, is being prosecuted for his peculiar religion, which holds that polygamy will bring men and their wives glory in heaven.

Prosecutors say Jeffs held the hope of salvation over the woman, using his position of trust as a prophet and former religious schoolteacher to arrange a marriage with a 19-year-old cousin she says she always disliked.

"She didn't have a choice," deputy county attorney Ryan Shaum said. "The prophet, God's voice on earth, is telling her what to do."

District Judge James Shumate ruled that Jeffs could be held for trial, citing evidence the girl "expressed her disdain, reluctance, opposition and total dislike of sexual relations" with the cousin.

The woman, now 20, was not in the courtroom. She testified last month that she felt "completely trapped and defeated" during a ceremony at a Nevada motel -- the "darkest time of my entire life."

http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/12/15/polygamist.leader.ap/index.html
 
If the charges are true, he certainly deserves punishment.

But in general, I see no reason why polygamy (either polygyny or polyandry) should not be legal, as long as all parties are of age and consenting.
 
In case anyone's interested, HBO's series Big Love features a polygamous community that's based on the FLDS. Harry Dean Stanon's character, Roman Grant, is the Warren Jeffs-like Prophet.
 
Cleon said:
In case anyone's interested, HBO's series Big Love features a polygamous community that's based on the FLDS. Harry Dean Stanon's character, Roman Grant, is the Warren Jeffs-like Prophet.
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I knew it was about multiple-marriage couples, but I didn't realize that. Still, I hate to get caught up in series like this. I've had HBO forever and have only watched two Sopranos. :)

I am a Bill Paxton fan though (Well why don't we put HER in charge?).
 
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Vorticity said:
If the charges are true, he certainly deserves punishment.

But in general, I see no reason why polygamy (either polygyny or polyandry) should not be legal, as long as all parties are of age and consenting.
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Well divorce gets complicated. How much of Husband 1's assets is Husband 2 entitled to when he divorces husband 1, and wifes 1 and 2? Or does he just get a portion of Wife 1 and 2's assets?

It is not an an unsolveable problem, but it is very much more complex than modern divorces.

There are also issues of which wife has final say on medical issues.
 
Mephisto said:
I knew it was about multiple-marriage couples, but I didn't realize that. Still, I hate to get caught up in series like this. I've had HBO forever and have only watched two Sopranos. :)
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Well, the nice thing about HBO series is that they're made in short runs. Season one was only 12 episodes, and IMDB only shows 8 for season 2. First season's all out on DVD--you can probably find it at Blockbuster or Hollywood Video. Netflix has it, too.

But yeah...The show is loaded with references to FLDS. If you listen to recordings of Jeffs preaching, it's very similar to the way Roman Grant speaks in the series. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Stanton listened to Jeffs' sermons in order to build the Grant character. The main location of the polygamous compound is called "Juniper Creek," a reference to Short Creek, the original name for Colorado City (a town pretty much run by FLDS--i.e., Jeffs). The United Effort Brotherhood, the unnamed sect's tax shelter, is named for FLDS' United Effort Plan.

Once I started getting into the series, I started reading Wikipedia articles and other sites about the FLDS. It's been interesting reading, if nothing else.
 
ponderingturtle said:
Well divorce gets complicated. How much of Husband 1's assets is Husband 2 entitled to when he divorces husband 1, and wifes 1 and 2? Or does he just get a portion of Wife 1 and 2's assets?

It is not an an unsolveable problem, but it is very much more complex than modern divorces.

There are also issues of which wife has final say on medical issues.
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True enough.

However, I find complexity of paperwork to be an unconvincing argument for making an activity illegal.
 
Vorticity said:
True enough.

However, I find complexity of paperwork to be an unconvincing argument for making an activity illegal.
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I am not disagreeing with you, but it would need certain fundamental changes to marriage to broaden it to more than two individuals. We would need to answer such questions as are your wives married to each other?
 
Cleon said:
In case anyone's interested, HBO's series Big Love features a polygamous community that's based on the FLDS. Harry Dean Stanon's character, Roman Grant, is the Warren Jeffs-like Prophet.
Click to expand...
I have no problem with adults having relations with as many adults as they want. So long as they are all consenting adults and can support their offspring.

FWIW, Jeffs is in trouble for facilitating the rape of an adolescent. These sick pervs diddle young girls (12 - 14) in the name of god. If there were a god I would pray that Jeffs would be raped in jail. I'll pray just in case.
 
Just to be contrary today, I'm going to predict that Jeffs will walk.

I have a couple newspaper articles around somewhere citing several examples of the prosecution not treating the lead witness very well. One had something to do with transporting her under duress to Las Vegas from Salt Lake in the late stages of a pregnancy.

The women are generally very afraid.
 
(AP, September 24, 2006)

Kingman, USA - The key witness in the trial of an alleged polygamist from Colorado City wrote a letter to the judge in the case complaining of her treatment by prosecutors and anger at being used to help bring down polygamist leader Warren Jeffs...

...Shapley also has been called a key witness in the Mohave County prosecution of Jeffs,

...Shapley, 20, refused to testify against Barlow when his trial started on Aug. 29, and Mohave County Judge Steven Conn held her in contempt of court and ordered her confined to a battered women's shelter for a month. She was released after about two weeks at the prosecutor's request.

Before the trial, Shapley wrote a letter to Conn explaining her reluctance to testify. The letter was obtained by the Kingman Daily Miner newspaper last week.

In the letter, Shapley said she felt mistreated by Mohave County Attorney Matt Smith and investigators. She cited her grand jury testimony in June, when she was flown from Salt Lake City to Kingman while her baby was ill and awaiting brain surgery.

She wrote that she told the grand jury ‘‘whatever they wanted me to say'' in order to go back to her baby.

She complained that after being promised her testimony would be secret it was immediately disclosed to the media. She said that put her in the spotlight, and media started to chase her around...

http://www.wwrn.org/article.php?idd=22834&sec=26&cont=all
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...
 
Let's see how we are doing!

-Dec 19th

...Mohave County Superior Court Judge James Chavez sentenced David R. Bateman to nine months in prison on two counts of sexual conduct with a minor and conspiracy to engage in sexual conduct with a minor. The judge agreed to let Bateman serve the terms concurrently.

Bateman, who also must register as a sex offender, was taken into custody immediately.

...Warren S. Jeffs, the sect's leader, is scheduled to stand trial in Utah in April on charges of being an accomplice to rape for a 2001 marriage involving a 14-year-old girl and a 19-year-old man.

...Jessop, 47, will receive three years' supervised probation with no jail time. Judge Steven Conn also will decide in January whether to require Jessop to register as a sex offender.

...Kelly Fischer was convicted and sentenced to 45 days in jail in August.

...Donald Barlow was acquitted in September after the county prosecutor failed to prove the crime took place in Arizona.

...The county dropped its case against Terry D. Barlow in October after Barlow proved his marriage took place in Canada.

...Charges are still pending against Rodney Holm, Randy Barlow and Dale Barlow.

http://www.wwrn.org/article.php?idd=23738&con=4&sec=26
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Humm, not too good so far. Being registered as a sex offender in Colorado City must come with a sense of the surreal.
 
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