Law Suit

[materia3]

I am not sure where to post this message so I would understand if the moderators move it somewhere more appropriate but here seems about right. As many of you may remember this forum was visited recently by a man named Roger Cogshill (sp?) who was promoting devices to protect people against stray EM radiation and cel phones, tout magnet therapy, magic coasters and harmonizers and so forth. He had an offer on his website asking if anyone who disagreed with him would place their infant(s) in the line of EM exposure. This discussion went on for quite some time and many may have questionned Mr. Cogshill's motivations for coming to this particular forum and engaging its members. I myself briefly defended Mr. Cogshill's quoting of a prominent entomologist who discovered that some insects can detect and even quantify infra red radiation, not that this had much if anything to do with the primary thrust of Cogshill's claims.

Someone sent me the URL of a website which contains a legal action launched in Maine against American and British critics of the same sorts of devices and theories that Mr. Cogshill promotes. The filing can be found at:

http://www.ivanfraser.ukf.net/Complaint.htm


This filing is interesting and instructive as it helps to reveal the kind of blow-back skeptics might expect to receive for their efforts in exposing quack theories and therapies. I don't know where this lawsuit has gone, there doesn't seem to be a docket number on this copy of it; however, the British defendents seem to be gearing up to defend it.

 

[NoZed Avenger]

As an aside, without a docket number and actual district (1 District Court in Maine? Maybe, but doubtful -- at any rate, it would have a district number), I doubt the existence of any lawsuit at all.

Quacks and alleged quacks may feel that a lawsuit can help to intimidate detractors and silence questions, but they overlook the wonderful opportunity that such a suit offers in the way of discovery. The defendants have a wonderful opportunity, if they so desire, to obtain any and all documents related to the foundation and its devices, for example. Depositions can be compelled. Bringing a suit in Maine to harass people in New Jersey is all fun -- but a change of venue to New Jersey means you and your attorneys are going to be the one traveling in order to prosecute your suit.

This is simply an intimidation tactic by the organization -- whether the lawsuit exists or not.

 

[richardm]

Suppose you had a product that you claimed cured cancer, and I claimed that it didn't cure cancer but was quite good for blacking boots, and you decided to sue.

In order to prove that you'd been wronged, wouldn't you have to prove that your product could cure cancer?

Since the woo products in question don't do what they claim to do, it seems unlikely that any court case would ever be brought successfully. At best, you might hope to frighten skeptics off with the treat of it. IMHO we should be the ones out suing the woos, not the other way around.


(Edited to add apologies to Princhester for speculating on matters legal without being a trained lawyer)

 

[crimresearch]

Within the First Circuit, the district court is simply, 'District of Maine'

http://www.med.uscourts.gov/

I suppose that it is possible for such a suit to proceed, but the chances of actually meeting the burden of proving that the respondent's claims were false, and that they knew or should have know that, are next to zero.

 

[NoZed Avenger]

Within the First Circuit, the district court is simply, 'District of Maine'

Excellent. Then we can simply call the district clerk for that court and ask about any filings - using the names of the parties.

If no one does it today, I'll try to make the call tomorrow morning. I am about to leave the office for a bit.

N/A

 

[materia3]

Thanks NoZed. This would be excellent if you can find out if this suit was actually filed.

In the meantime, I just received and reviewed more to this controversy which can be found here:

http://www.truthcampaign.ukf.net/articles/conspiracies/GWP_Lawsuit.htm

 

[crimresearch]

Oh, I suspect that it may have been *filed*...that really isn't much of a hurdle.

Here is one party's motion to dismiss, I doubt if there has been enough time to proceed much further.


http://www.rickross.com/reference/gentlewind/gentlewind3.pdf


and it lists a docket number of 04-CV-103

 

[Rob Lister]

I'm at a complete loss here. Maybe its because of all the pollen in the air today.

I can't seem to figure out who is the most woo.

They both seem double-dipped in woo, breaded in elf-dust, and deep-fried in is a bullsh@t. What am I missing?

 

[crimresearch]

'Both' who? Rick Ross appears to be a scam busting website.

 

[Michael Redman]

That complaint really tells you everything you need to know about the Gentle Wind Project, doesn't it?

 

[Rob Lister]

'Both' who? Rick Ross appears to be a scam busting website.

Possibly, I haven't gotten that far. LIke I said, I'm a bit confused.

Defendant Ivan Fraser appears to be a Woo of the First Order.

Plaintiff Gentle Wind appears to be a Woo of the First Order.

Something's fishy.

Edit: most seem to be woo. Some are boarderline woo. I'm not sure about Rick Ross. Fishy ain't the word for this. We need a Dane to enlighten us.

 

[Rob Lister]

That complaint really tells you everything you need to know about the Gentle Wind Project, doesn't it?

Yes but what it may not be telling you is everything you need to know about why the lawsuit was filed.

There's an old adage in hollywood: It regards publicity.

 

[crimresearch]

Interesting indeed...Ivan Fraser appears to be a competitor who has 'defamed' Gentle Wind by comparing their stuff unfavorably to his own aura reading, etc.
Rick Ross appears to be debunking all the woos...and they are both named in the lawsuit....