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Journalist Lies About Iraq

What's the thing with "Catholic", here. There's a great story - "Journalist Cops to Making Up BS, but Offers Strange Dodges".

Don't know how much traction it'll get as a thread, as it's pretty cut and dried and apparent that he's been flouting crap. I don't recall any previous threads or discussions with anyone supporting his claims.
 
Man, this is just brutal. Fox News Howie Kurtz:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...ied-about-his-copter-being-shot-down-in-iraq/

Brian Williams, the nation’s top-rated news anchor, has admitted fabricating a tale of being shot down in a helicopter over Iraq a dozen years ago.

Williams apologized on the air Wednesday evening, saying: “I made a mistake in recalling the events of 12 years ago.”

Whether he fabricated it or misremembered it, those are two different things.

How is saying he misremembered the same as "admitted fabricating"? He also uses the word "lie".
 
That wouldn't be the kind of thing you'd "misremember" unless you had, in fact, been in several -- or many -- other helicopters that got shot down, and it was merely a question of which one.

That seems unlikely.

Human memory is fallible, but not like that, unless you have serious neurological issues, or dementia -- which again is unlikely in this case.

Nor was this something that happened when he was a small child.

I don't remember everything I post, but I remember the broad outlines of every car accident I've been in.

Another possibility is if you're a habitual boaster, and begin to mix up your boasts and your memories. (L. Ron Hubbard may have believed his own lies, because he always made stuff up.)

eta: I've read his explanation. It's as convincing as any flimsy explanation you could make up.
 
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Misremembered being in a helicopter that was shot down? riiiight.
 
Human memory is fallible, but not like that,

I think it is more fallible than you imagine.
OK, here's just one thing to consider:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_implantation

In memory implantation studies researchers make people believe that they remember an event that actually never happened. The false memories that have been successfully implanted in people’s memories include remembering being lost in a mall as a child, taking a hot air balloon ride, and putting slime in a teacher’s desk in primary school.[1][2][3]

Now, probably nobody intentionally implanted a false memory in Brian Williams, but we also know that these things can easily happen naturally as well.

I don't remember everything I post, but I remember the broad outlines of every car accident I've been in.
How do you know that your memories are correct?
 
Misremembered being in a helicopter that was shot down? riiiight.

Yes. I suppose he could have either heard the story from someone else or made it up and then repeated the story so many time that he has come to believe it is true.

[anecdote]We were at a friend's garden party a few years ago and Mrs. Don saw the host's black lab snaffle a Cornish pasty from a plate and then go back for the ketchup. She told me the story and then I repeatedly recounted it as my own (having seen the dog and all) before Mrs. Don corrected me and said that it was she that saw the incident. Despite me knowing that I never saw the incident, I have a distinct memory of the dog eating the pasty and ketchup and can picture it in my mind's eye[/anecdote]
 
I think it is more fallible than you imagine.
OK, here's just one thing to consider:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_implantation



Now, probably nobody intentionally implanted a false memory in Brian Williams, but we also know that these things can easily happen naturally as well.


How do you know that your memories are correct?

This is a complicated question, and I've thought about it. It's really hard to give a pithy answer. I'm aware of those studies.

Basically, you remember what you attended to and believed at the time, and told yourself at the time, and afterward. Not so much sensory details.

If you constantly tell a story to be entertaining -- say, in a bar to your pals -- it will start to acquire distortions stemming from your desire to be entertaining. This can be accounted for.

The way you know whether your memories are basically accurate is by confirmation with recorded media and by other people, and by understanding your own motives.

Another way is by attending to what was utterly novel at the time. Genuine memories often don't particularly add to the shape of the narrative.

Example: When I was abducted at gunpoint by a child molester, he had Band of Gypsies by Jimi Hendrix on his turntable. This was something I attended to at the time, which doesn't "make sense" -- it doesn't support any point about the narrative. In fact, it's still one of my favorite records.

I place a high value on basic honesty, and I'm very often ashamed. Shame is one way to confirm. I don't tell stories to be entertaining. I'm not entertaining. The force of shame of memories can be confirmation.

Implanting memories requires a conscious effort on someone's part. Either it's part of an experiment, or it's ideologically driven, or fear-driven, or process-driven. (Therapy, interrogation, barroom story-telling, lying, posturing.)

It's possible that our journalist is constantly telling stories and hearing stories and is constantly preoccupied with appearance, with how he's going over with his audience. This would be socially-driven confabulation.

Another general way we confirm the accuracy of our memories is by the daily effort of getting along in the world. As I've gotten older, in the last few years, I can observe my own failings and slips. (Here I'm only arguing against the radical possibility that everything's misremembered or made up.) If your memory is completely unreliable, you can't function. (Which is why Memento is fiction. No one with radical memory loss can survive unless someone else takes care of them .)

I remember the car accidents, but I don't remember what color the cars were, because I don't pay attention to that kind of stuff. Nor do I remember when exactly they happened. I only remember the basic narrative. If I was reasonably perceptive and honest with myself at the time, and I haven't been interrogated or coached, that basic narrative is true.
 
The end comes for Brian Williams and his "conflating" the fact that he was actually NOT on a helicopter hit by an RPG.

What he meant was that someone threw a Dungeons and Dragons Player's Handbook at him.
 
Good heavens, has someone accused Brian Williams of being a journalist? I thought he was just a walking warning against artificial tanning.
 
....
Don't know how much traction it'll get as a thread, as it's pretty cut and dried and apparent that he's been flouting crap. I don't recall any previous threads or discussions with anyone supporting his claims.

Apparently the fact is that he was flying in a helicopter in a combat zone following another one that was hit, and both landed. What he remembered most was being exposed on hostile turf. It's a fine line between "I was hit" and "We were hit." Reagan used to claim to have done things that he only portrayed in the movies, and Hillary Clinton claimed to have come under fire when she was only hustled into a car at a potentially dangerous airport. Williams wasn't trying to sell anything; he was just clumsily trying to pay tribute to the soldiers he was with. Memory really is tricky, as anyone who has had a "who did what when" argument with relatives knows.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/05/b...es-for-saying-he-was-shot-down-over-iraq.html
 
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If Brian Williams was flying at 100 knots minimum 30 minutes (low end of reported "following") behind the helicopter that got hit, then he was over 50 miles from the helicopter that actually took fire. This is the difference between being t-boned, seeing the car in front of you get t-boned, and driving past the scene of an accident where someone got t-boned an hour afterwards. Taking fire is not something that you forget - you may misremember who else was there, but not if you were. The Costanza defense won't work here.
 
According to some sources, Williams didn't just start telling this story about an event that happened 12 years ago; he was talking about it shortly after it happened. Which means it's a trifle hard to chalk it up to fallible memory.
 
Yes. I suppose he could have either heard the story from someone else or made it up and then repeated the story so many time that he has come to believe it is true.

[anecdote]We were at a friend's garden party a few years ago and Mrs. Don saw the host's black lab snaffle a Cornish pasty from a plate and then go back for the ketchup. She told me the story and then I repeatedly recounted it as my own (having seen the dog and all) before Mrs. Don corrected me and said that it was she that saw the incident. Despite me knowing that I never saw the incident, I have a distinct memory of the dog eating the pasty and ketchup and can picture it in my mind's eye[/anecdote]

Wait...how did he open the bottle?
 
Me too. Makes me wonder how many of my war stories actually happened the way I tell them.


Yeah, exaggratation is expected when veterine soldiers get together to swap stories over a beer;i'st part of the fun, a variation of the old American custom of "the Tall Tale".
As the joke goes, "What is the difference between a War Story and a Fairy Tale?
One beings "Once Upon A time", the Other begins "No ****, I was there".

But for a major journalist to make something up out of whole cloth is another matter entirely. One is a accepted form of humor, the other is a deliberate attempt to deceive.
 
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