Is there a domestic violence consensus?

[HipNixon]

I'm trying to get to the bottom of the current understanding of the cause of domestic violence.

The researcher I talked to worked with Dr. Murray Strauss and is under the impression that:

*Domestic abusers are distributed pretty evenly among gender, sexual orientation and racial groups

*There are multiple causes

*The "Duluth Model" of power and control used by shelters today was based on feminist guesswork and interviewing less than 10 victims.

*Most domestic violence involves both partners hitting one another


This is a serious issue for the skeptical community. We researchers saying our current understanding of an emotional subject is wrong. I wrote to the JREF to see if this has been adressed by skeptics and the reply I received said it hasn't, but the forum has a lot of experts.

I also wrote to one of my old sociology professors and was told she doesn't know, but her collegues said the consensus is on the side of the feminists. This is the opposite of what the researcher I talked to said.

I don't know who to believe. I find the arguments put forward by Strauss and other researchers compelling, and the reaction by social activists in the domestic violence shelter to be lacking and combative. Still, I need to withold judgment and let the science trickle in.

Is there anyone who knows much about this topic?

 

[Bikewer]

I can't contribute anything in the nature of academic studies. However, I've been in law enforcement for a long time, and for the first 10 years on the street in an area where domestic violence was a constant.

In general, from what I witnessed and handled, alcohol was a causative (or contributing) factor in the vast majority of these incidents. The typical scenario was that hubby would come home drunk, an argument would ensue, and an assault would take place.

These were invariably male-on-female incidents; I don't recall ever seeing a case where there was evidence of mutual fighting. It may happen, but it would seem to be rare.

As to cutting across income lines, I will confirm that. When I was moved from my original (lower middle class) patrol sector to a much more affluent area, we still took many reports. Still on weekends, still involving alcohol.
In one case, one of our own lieutenants...

Most all of these incidents were "common assaults", that is, with fists/hands alone. I handled one shooting incident. No homicides. (we had a few in the county during this period, but they were rare)
Homicides as a result of domestic disturbance were much more common in the city, with it's generally lower-income population. Again, alcohol (or drugs) being a common factor.

One thing that's different now is the legal structure and the response of the legal system. Back when I was "on the street", our county was not legally a "First Class" county. As a result, the police did not have the power to arrest on suspicion of a misdemeanor crime. We had to apply for warrants.
Since almost all these domestic assaults were misdemeanors, involving no weapons and no severe injuries, we had to take the victim to the prosecutor's office (after a "cooling off" period of several days) to apply for warrants for hubby's arrest.
In the ten years I was in that situation, with literally dozens of cases, I never had a single prosecution....

Much different now, of course, with reforms of domestic violence laws requiring mandatory arrests.
Working in "campus" law enforcement now, we see far fewer of these. We get the occasional break-up fight among contract employees (food service and housekeeping).
In the 26 years I've been here, I think I've handled two incidents among students that would fall under the domestic violence area...

 

[Professor Yaffle]

I don't know the literature that well, but from what I have read it seems to be conflicting. Some surveys seem to show that levels of spousal abuse is similar between males and females, but at the same time levels of reported crime seem to show that men are more often the perpetrators, and homicide figures show men more often being the perperators in spousal killings. I put this down to 2 factors. One is that men are much less likely to report spousal abuse, and also it may be that the surveys that report equal levels are not taking into account the amount and severity of violence (unfortunately I haven't read them, so this is just supposition). It may be that where levels are being recorded as equal, it may be in answer to the question "Have you ever been struck by your partner?". Now this would basically equate the person who has been slapped a couple of times with the person who has been beaten severely on a regular basis and live in fear of their life. If there were a difference in severity of violence between the genders, this might go some way to explaining the disparity.

You will find some references to the relevant literature in this wiki (tough note the disputed neutrality status of the article):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_violence

Here is something I posted to another thread about gender differences in violence.



http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/intimates.htm

 

[fuelair]

Weirdly, this is a field where I don't really care why (like child-abuse). Just want the assaulters unable to assault, including a (physically) appropriate demonstration of why it it not a good thing to do (in the case of child abuse I prefer the demonstration be terminal).

 

[Dancing David]

I'm trying to get to the bottom of the current understanding of the cause of domestic violence.

The researcher I talked to worked with Dr. Murray Strauss and is under the impression that:

*Domestic abusers are distributed pretty evenly among gender, sexual orientation and racial groups

True.

*There are multiple causes

True but the main issue is NOT anger management.

The main issue is anger permission. One person gives themselves permission to be violent.

*The "Duluth Model" of power and control used by shelters today was based on feminist guesswork and interviewing less than 10 victims.

Interesting, it is still true any way. Interview a thousand victims and power and control by the perp is still the commonality.

*Most domestic violence involves both partners hitting one another

Yes, true.

say that yoru partners is building up during the escalation phase, they are yelling at you for three hours straight and have destroyed your record collection. From past experience you know this could gone on for days before the huge blow up happens.

They grab your arm to keep you from leaving and you shove or strike them.

Victims strike first often to get the poop over.

Statistically in fact victims strike first more than the abuser. Of course one beats the crap out of the other and the victim has to have facial reconstruction while the perp has a scratch.


Both people are violent frequently.

This is a serious issue for the skeptical community. We researchers saying our current understanding of an emotional subject is wrong. I wrote to the JREF to see if this has been adressed by skeptics and the reply I received said it hasn't, but the forum has a lot of experts.

I also wrote to one of my old sociology professors and was told she doesn't know, but her collegues said the consensus is on the side of the feminists. This is the opposite of what the researcher I talked to said.

Why not interview the thousands of people who seek help?

Don't rely on a single researcher.

2,000 people killed every year in domestic violence, the USA.

There is also the bullcrap, feel sorry for the perpetrators movement, which is like the creationism of DV.

I don't know who to believe. I find the arguments put forward by Strauss and other researchers compelling, and the reaction by social activists in the domestic violence shelter to be lacking and combative.

Well instead of an over the top approach, try volunteering, especially to help the childrens program. Open your mind by becoming involved. I will warn you, it is shameful.

You patch em up, prop em up and shove em out the door.

You become staturated from the trauma after a while.

Don't fight with them, learn , experience, gio into the trenches and work. Answer a hotline for five hours a week.

Still, I need to withold judgment and let the science trickle in.

Don't sit in your Ivory Tower, go out and get involved. Volunteer, if you are male you will have to develop some thick skinn and get used to the generalization of anger.

But if you spend time with the victims and earn their trust, then you might learn something.

Is there anyone who knows much about this topic?

Worked in a shelter for three years.

Did about 1,000 phone calls and about sevety interviews, worked with about 150 victims and about 400 kids.

Well the feminist perspective may or may not be accurate but here is the deal: DV is about power and control of the victim.

It doesn't matter what race , gender, socio-economic status the perpetrator or victim are. Domestic violence as opposed to just random violece that occurs between people in based upon two things an intimate or family relationship and pwoer and control.

When you interview someone who is a possible victims what do you ask?

1. Have they tried to islolate you from your family and friends?

2. Do they tell you how you are supoposed to act, what cloths to wear and punish you if you don't meet that standard?

3. Did they ever deny you access to motion, communications and liberty?

4. Did they denigrate your values and try to undermine your self esteem.

Now the other issue is that besides the physical, emotional and sexual violence is the sheer quantity of what happens. these are rarely isolated incidents, they are usually parts of a persistant and repetitive pattersn

So yes there is violence that is mind boggling, especially when you consider that the victims grow used to it and minmise it.

In an interview you have to be very gentle, patient and concrete as all get out.

Did theye ever strike you? the first answer is almost always no. And you have to be patient, kind and non-judgemental. Did they every push or shove you? Yes. Did they ever grab you and hold you? Yes. Did they leave bruises. Yes. Did they ever slap you? yes. Did they ever punch you. Yes.

And you also have to listen to them vomit up all the pain and anguish once they do begin to face the truth.

They will almost always say no when you ask the first time.

 

[Loss Leader]

As a family law attorney, I can tell you that the current CW on domestic abuse is that it is a narcisistic trait of the abuser. The abuser believes that he has some sort of inherent right to make himself feel better by subjugating the ego of the victim. The vast majority if domestic violence is male-to-female. All domestic abuse is underreported but there is a belief that violence in the gay community is disproportionately underreported.

Anger management is no longer the usual family court solution. In addition, the family courts generally will not try to keep the "family" together and will make it easy for victims to escape abuse.

 

[fuelair]

As a family law attorney, I can tell you that the current CW on domestic abuse is that it is a narcisistic trait of the abuser. The abuser believes that he has some sort of inherent right to make himself feel better by subjugating the ego of the victim. The vast majority if domestic violence is male-to-female. All domestic abuse is underreported but there is a belief that violence in the gay community is disproportionately underreported.

Anger management is no longer the usual family court solution. In addition, the family courts generally will not try to keep the "family" together and will make it easy for victims to escape abuse.

Glad to hear that last part - because I have heard nowhere that 'anger management programs work. Any chance external interested parties could use that "inherent right to make (ourselves) feel better " thing by subjugating the abuser in a dark alley and pounding his sorry butt?