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Is music therapy woo?

CaptainManacles

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CaptainManacles
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Apr 21, 2005
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Is music therapy woo? I've looked around a bit, it certainly smells like woo, and most of the "studies" I see on it don't amount to proving much more then "music sounds nice" or non-confirming results that they simply decided to reject and pretend like they got a success.
 
It depends what claims people make about it. If they claim you can cure cancer by listening to Mozart then yes, very woo. If all they claim is that music can sound nice and help you to relax, there's really no woo involved. It's kind of like aromatherapy really. Something relaxing can help you relax, and as long as you don't claim any more than that there really isn't a problem.
 
According to websites, Music Therapy can:

promote wellness
manage stress
alleviate pain
express feelings
enhance memory
improve communication
promote physical rehabilitation

I'm gonna go with WOO! At least for some of these.
 
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Will it gives money to some people. Its all about the money. Is there even any real proof that it works?
 
Cuddles said:
It depends what claims people make about it. If they claim you can cure cancer by listening to Mozart then yes, very woo. If all they claim is that music can sound nice and help you to relax, there's really no woo involved. It's kind of like aromatherapy really. Something relaxing can help you relax, and as long as you don't claim any more than that there really isn't a problem.
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I agree -- almost anything can be "therapeutical" if you feel that it does you any good. It's a much misused and overused word.

Our kitty gives good pet "therapy." :)


M.
 
Lanzy said:
According to websites, Music Therapy can:

promote wellness
manage stress
alleviate pain
express feelings
enhance memory
improve communication
promote physical rehabilitation

I'm gonna go with WOO! At least for some of these.
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Actually, while being vague, none of these claims are all that absurd. I'm still very skeptical about its benefits but I don't see too much harm from it...except for possibly wasting money.

What I'm really doubtful about is Art Therapy.
 
I was under the impression that music therapy (and art therapy) consisted of doing music and art, not just listening or looking. It helps to improve dexterity (playing the guitar, flute, etc), helps people to re-learn how to concentrate, and opens the door to other skills. I know music therapists who work very hard along these lines. It's not just throwing a Mozart cd into the player and having everyone lean back and relax.
 
I once had Betar music therapy, you have to lie suspended in a sort of spherical structure surrounded by speakers, the brochure says:-

"During the BETAR session,excess bodily stress of all kinds is continually scavenged from the cells, tissues, vessels, organs and bones from the entire body and radiated away as harmless sound waves. BETAR specifically targets internal stress."

It was part of a relaxing girls' spa day, and at the time I was at my "sceptical but wanting to be polite" stage, so I just put up with it. Anyway, it's always good to get a short nap during the day.

Complete bunkum though, if I went again I'd have to tell them. Now that would be a good way of 'scavenging stress out of my bones'. Sheesh!
 
LibraryLady said:
I was under the impression that music therapy (and art therapy) consisted of doing music and art, not just listening or looking. It helps to improve dexterity (playing the guitar, flute, etc), helps people to re-learn how to concentrate, and opens the door to other skills. I know music therapists who work very hard along these lines. It's not just throwing a Mozart cd into the player and having everyone lean back and relax.
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That's definitely true. Well trained music and art therapists(yes, they do receive training in psychology and even neurology) are useful in getting patient's active and that can definitely help with certain rehab issues. However, all of this can be handled by well trained Physical and Occupational Therapists.

However, I've seen it really overused especially with Art therapy. A demented patient draws a sun and they conclude that they have rage or something.
 
carole_ said:
I once had Betar music therapy, you have to lie suspended in a sort of spherical structure surrounded by speakers, the brochure says:-

"During the BETAR session,excess bodily stress of all kinds is continually scavenged from the cells, tissues, vessels, organs and bones from the entire body and radiated away as harmless sound waves. BETAR specifically targets internal stress."

It was part of a relaxing girls' spa day, and at the time I was at my "sceptical but wanting to be polite" stage, so I just put up with it. Anyway, it's always good to get a short nap during the day.

Complete bunkum though, if I went again I'd have to tell them. Now that would be a good way of 'scavenging stress out of my bones'. Sheesh!
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I believe all of us are talking about different things.

Music and Art Therapy as used by the medical field involves trained therapists, some with actual degrees, to help with treatment and diagnosis of patients. It is mostly used in psychiatric and some physical rehabilitation cases.

What you are talking about is something claiming to be Music Therapy. Its similar to Homeopathy claiming to be medicine.
 
I did a paper once on the music therapy. It focused on the research conducted by a small group in South Africa that was using music therapy to help PTSD diagnosed individuals deal with trauma. Particularly post apartheid trauma.

The group met several times a week and played a variety of instruments that did not require any skill, just a sense of rhythm. They would jam out on these for a while and then have discussions over the issues that concerned them at the end.

The conclusions were anecdotal and based on the responses given by the participants, who all stated that the effects were beneficial to them in some degree, mostly by helping them come to terms as a group with the thing that had happened to them. The jam sessions just provided the emotional outlet.
 
Cuddles said:
It depends what claims people make about it. If they claim you can cure cancer by listening to Mozart then yes, very woo. If all they claim is that music can sound nice and help you to relax, there's really no woo involved. It's kind of like aromatherapy really. Something relaxing can help you relax, and as long as you don't claim any more than that there really isn't a problem.
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If you claim you need to be board certified to play people music and help then relax then there certainly is still a problem.

At best it seems to be a field that says you can diagnose and treat mental illness without even the equivalent of a BS in psychology. That's woo any way you cut it. At worst its associated with "treating" autism and other such nonsense, and some of this comes straight out of music therapy journals, so those claims aren't coming from outside mainstream music therapy. Even many of the claims of helping with pain management and physical therapy seem to be based on shoddy studies whose results clearly indicate that music therapy had no effect whatsoever, but they just decided to ignore that and conclude that it works based on anecdote. The whole field has woo written all over it.
 
CaptainManacles said:
If you claim you need to be board certified to play people music and help then relax then there certainly is still a problem.

At best it seems to be a field that says you can diagnose and treat mental illness without even the equivalent of a BS in psychology. That's woo any way you cut it. At worst its associated with "treating" autism and other such nonsense, and some of this comes straight out of music therapy journals, so those claims aren't coming from outside mainstream music therapy. Even many of the claims of helping with pain management and physical therapy seem to be based on shoddy studies whose results clearly indicate that music therapy had no effect whatsoever, but they just decided to ignore that and conclude that it works based on anecdote. The whole field has woo written all over it.
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I don't believe they diagnose illness. But many many Music Therapists have BSc. in Music Therapy.
http://www.musictherapy.org/handbook/schools.html
http://www.musictherapy.org/handbook/career.html#EDUCATION

I do have issues with it because I don't believe they have any real standardization in these degrees and many seem to be based from Music Departments instead of the Psychology Departments...that's a big warning for potential woo. However it looks like they have a Board Certification process which is good.
 
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A couple of months ago I read Oliver Sacks' Musicophelia. He's a clinical psychologist, and the book is primarily concerned with the way the brain processes music, and how that processing can go awry.
Still, he mentions a couple of things about "music therapy", pointing out that some patients who are severely debilitated by stroke or brain injury will still respond to music. Also, people who are suffering from aphasia (inability to speak) may yet be able to sing....
Likewise, people with severe stuttering can frequently sing.
 
The Cochrane review on autistic spectrum disorders said that it was "encouragingg" though the data was limited to 3 small studies with limited applicability to clinical practice, and that:

When applying the results of this review to practice, it is important to note that the application of music therapy requires specialised academic and clinical training.
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paximperium said:
I don't believe they diagnose illness.
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Okay, well, you already claimed they "helped" diagnose illness.

But many many Music Therapists have BSc. in Music Therapy.
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How is that different from what I said? I hardly see how it matters much if woo practitioners get woo degrees by taking woo classes and get woo certification from a bunch of woo-woo people on a woo board.
 
Here are some examples of Music Therapy courses in the UK where they are usually postgraduate and recognised as health professionals by the NHS

http://www.qmu.ac.uk/courses/PGCourse.cfm?c_id=189

http://www.anglia.ac.uk/ruskin/en/home/prospectus/pgft2008/music_therapy.html

http://www.rwcmd.ac.uk/postgraduate_courses/music_therapy.aspx

http://courses.uwe.ac.uk/b99942/2008

From the looks of it, music therapy done by properly qualified people is no more or less woo than most other areas of therapy.
 
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