If Bush wins, I'll join the NRA

daenku32

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Dec 27, 2002
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Because after Bush and Co. prohibits the courts from protecting my constitutional rights, I'll just resort to my 2nd amendment means of protecting my rights.

If I can't get courts to see my way, I'll just shoot my way through.

And when you ask "But you don't have rights to it", I'll just quote the vice-president:
We believe our nation is "one nation under God." (Applause.) And we believe Americans ought to be able to say so when we pledge allegiance to the flag. (Applause.)
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http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2004/10/20041020-11.html

I believe our's is "one nation NOT under God." And I believe Americans like ought to be able to say so when we pledge allegiance to the flag.
 
Yup, watch it. You're threatening to kill members of the government. Seriously bad mojo, negative karma, etc. You'll have the FBI & Secret Service & 'Homeland Security' taking turns kicking your door down for your flippant comment.

First they get a warrant for Randi.org and get your IP address, then they get a warrant for your ISP to find out who had that IP at that time (they do log it), and then they go pay you a little visit.

They do take this sort of remark very seriously. You could be the next Timmy McVeigh for all they know.
 
With the Patriot Act, they don't need warrants, or even to inform you that you're being searched and your assets seized. Heck, they can arrest you and hold you indefinitely without due process.
 
thaiboxerken said:
With the Patriot Act, they don't need warrants, or even to inform you that you're being searched and your assets seized. Heck, they can arrest you and hold you indefinitely without due process.
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I'm wondering if I'll experience any NSA fallout for my previous assertion that I think a trained chimp in a diaper would make an excellent president? For all they know, I may have "Candidate X Mr Cheepers" in hiding, all ready to take the helm after the uprising. They're probably tapping my phone now.
 
thaiboxerken said:
With the Patriot Act, they don't need warrants, or even to inform you that you're being searched and your assets seized. Heck, they can arrest you and hold you indefinitely without due process.
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You don't have a section of the Act that says that handy for citation, do you? I opriginally assumed this is ironic hyperbole, but I have heard people seriously saying the same type of thing while relying on internet sites, so I thouight I'd ask.
 
evildave said:
Yup, watch it. You're threatening to kill members of the government. Seriously bad mojo, negative karma, etc. You'll have the FBI & Secret Service & 'Homeland Security' taking turns kicking your door down for your flippant comment.

First they get a warrant for Randi.org and get your IP address, then they get a warrant for your ISP to find out who had that IP at that time (they do log it), and then they go pay you a little visit.

They do take this sort of remark very seriously. You could be the next Timmy McVeigh for all they know.
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Sure sure. But with what the NRA preaches, I should be a-OK.

It's not the cruel realities of life, just the feeling.
 
TragicMonkey said:
I'm wondering if I'll experience any NSA fallout for my previous assertion that I think a trained chimp in a diaper would make an excellent president?
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Yes, in about 200 years, when they get through sifting through all the similar messages they've interecepted recently.
 
daenku32 said:
Sure sure. But with what the NRA preaches, I should be a-OK.
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In light of your posts thus far, I'm unconvinced you know anything about what the NRA does, and does not, preach.
 
Section 213 eliminates the prior requirement that law enforcement provide a person subject to a search warrant with contemporaneous notice of the search.

Section 215 grants the FBI the authority to request an order "requiring the production of any tangible things (including books, records, papers, documents, and other items)" relevant to an investigation of international terrorism or clandestine intelligence activities. Although the amendment is entitled "Access to Certain Business Records for Foreign Intelligence and International Terrorism Investigations," the scope of the authority is far broader and applies to any records relevant to the individual. This amendment, which overrides state library confidentiality laws, permits the FBI to compel production of business records, medical records, educational records and library records without a showing of "probable cause" (the existence of specific facts to support the belief that a crime has been committed or that the items sought are evidence of a crime).

* Congress Approves Expansion of FBI Powers. Congress has added a provision to the Intelligence Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2004 that grants the FBI greater authority to seize records in terrorism investigations. The provision permits the FBI to obtain records without judicial approval from car dealers, pawnbrokers, travel agents, casinos, and other businesses. (Nov. 19, 2003)

http://www.epic.org/privacy/terrorism/usapatriot/#overview

Permits non-citizens to be jailed based on mere suspicion and to be denied re-admission to the US for engaging in free speech.

American citizens suspected of terrorism are being held
indefinitely in military custody without being charged and without access to lawyers.

http://www.aclu.org/Files/OpenFile.cfm?id=11812
 
Kodiak said:
In light of your posts thus far, I'm unconvinced you know anything about what the NRA does, and does not, preach.
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I do know that NRA preaches that we have the right to protect ourselves from excessive government; That 2nd amendment is for hunting politicians; That even if 99% of americans decided to BAN guns, the 1% would STILL have their rights to arms.

Quite frankly, all those above reasons would apply to me.

But on the other hand, speaking of what the NRA preaches:

Amendment 36 on November 2. Amendment 36 would destroy the tried and true Electoral College system created by our Founding Fathers, by cutting the winner of Colorado`s electoral votes from nine to five.
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http://www.nraila.org/CurrentLegislation/Read.aspx?ID=1264

This is FALSE.

Electoral College votes were divided in the first few elections and are still divided in some states.

So maybe I don't want to join an organization that is so biased on the total political spectrum.

I'll just 'hunt politicians' without the NRA after all.
 
I'm sure there are plenty of politicians that enjoy hunting. ;)

Seriously, though, I do believe that part of the reason for the 2nd ammendment was to keep power within the people of the USA, and not just the government. If firearms are taken away from citizens and banned, then the only "power" we have over the government is a vote, which is basically a trust that the government won't rig the election system. I think the election in 2000 showed us that such trust is not earned by our government.
 
daenku32 said:

So maybe I don't want to join an organization that is so biased on the total political spectrum.

I'll just 'hunt politicians' without the NRA after all.
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Same reason I won't join. I'm all for gun rights, but won't join the NRA unless they stop acting like a leg of the Republican Party.
 
thaiboxerken said:
Section 213 eliminates the prior requirement that law enforcement provide a person subject to a search warrant with contemporaneous notice of the search.

Section 215 grants the FBI the authority to request an order "requiring the production of any tangible things (including books, records, papers, documents, and other items)" relevant to an investigation of international terrorism or clandestine intelligence activities.
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I thought I recognized the web sites at issue. I apprecdiate the time taken to quote the citations. I have 4 trials scheduled now within the next 6-7 weeks, so I am in no position to get into a substantive discussion at the moment. My criticisms of the warrant portions of the Act have been made several times before on the board; I am not ebtering into a general defense of it.

Your original statement, however, talked abouit warrants -- those sections do not eliminate the requirement that a warrant be issued by an appropriate court. Under the Orders at issue, an application still needs to be made to the Court and the request justified. The majority of information would be considered public domain and entitled to less protection than other forms of personal data. I may have misread your post orr it may have been unclear as written. At the moment, the misunderstanding may well be at my end - I am so burned out at the moment that I doubt any of my pleadings are making sense, either.

N/A
 
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