Human Invisibility Phenomena

[prander]

Hi.

I've got a question for the JREF (representatives) about a specific phenomena claim for the US $1,000,000.00 Paranormal Challenge.

I'm wanting to ask about 'human invisibility'? That is, to not be seen by other people with naked eye. To go a bit further, to get tested without needing the use of cameras or video equipment, but with the naked eye and actual observers.

I've read through the FAQ, Randi's Personal FAQ, the Challenge Rules, and everything else. I've not seen any mention of this specific phenomena. I didn't see it in Question # 2.2, 2.3, 2.4, 2.5 in the FAQ, where the types of claims are mentioned.

As I understand it, it should fall within the 'realm' of

Dowsing. ESP. Precognition. Remote Viewing. Communicating with the Dead and/or "Channeling". Violations of Newton's Laws of Motion (Perpetual Motion Devices). Homeopathy. Chiropractic Healing (beyond back/joint problems). Faith Healing. Psychic Surgery. Astrology. Therapeutic Touch (aka "TT"). Qi Gong. Psychokinesis (aka "PK"). The Existence of Ghosts. Precognition & Prophecy. Levitation. Physiognomy. Psychometry. Pyramid Power. Reflexology. Acupuncture. Applied Kinesiology (aka "AK"). Clairvoyance. The Existence of Auras. Graphology. Numerology. Palmistry. Phrenology.

as it's not inherently detrimental to the health of anyone and it's not a religious or spiritual claim. I would think that it could be properly tested for as it's an either / or scenario. Either the cliamant can do it or they can't.

I'm not proposing anything, just wondering if this would be an acceptable phenomena for testing.

Apologies if this should've been sent through email or a letter. I figured this would be quicker and I would get input (positive or negative) from the people on this forum.


Thanks much all.

 

[Ashles]

I would have thought this would absolutely eligible for the prize.

The FAQ isn't meant to exhaustively list every paranomal ability imaginable - merely as a epresentative list.

But why do you ask if not for any particular reason?

 

[alfaniner]

Does everyone else have to have their backs turned?

 

[Ashles]

You would also need to conduct a double blind... oh hang on, how would that work...?

 

[Bronze Dog]

You would also need to conduct a double blind... oh hang on, how would that work...?

I can imagine a protocol would be pretty tricky. This might just fall into the category of "it'll be obvious", along with people who say they can fly by flapping their arms or glow in the dark.

 

[prander]

But why do you ask if not for any particular reason?

Well, I have seen this done a couple of times and I KNOW I've done it once. But, I don't claim to be able to do this, just that I have done this once. So, I'm basically asking out of curiousity and if I ever think that I can do it 'at will', it would be good to know that the option would be there.

Does everyone else have to have their backs turned?

Obviously this forum is for skeptics and I consider myself to be no less than a skeptic. I don't believe hardly any paranormal claims any person makes, at least not without getting personally involved with research.

However, like I said, I have experienced this once and I've seen it a couple of times. My experience was corroborated by the people around me and it's still NOT easy for me to explain it in terms of paranormal stuff.

But, I can't just dismiss it and if I ever think it could be a practical thing, it would be great to be able to go through with this and show that it's a real thing.

I would NOT even entertain the idea, as I assume very few here will, if I had not had been a direct witness and experienced it myself.

You would also need to conduct a double blind... oh hang on, how would that work...?

Yeah, LOL. That joke crossed my mind a long time ago.

 

[MRC_Hans]

It would be easy to test. The "invisible" person (IP) is in room 1, observers are in room 2, the rooms are connected by an open passageway, but the IP is positioned so he cannot be seen by the observers, invisible or not. Loud noise is played, to mask audible clues. One observer is in room 1 to ensure the IP does not cheat. A signal lamp operable by the IP and visible for the observers is rigged. The IP now flips a coin. If heads he writes "go" on a list, signals with the lamp and walks into room 2, turns and walks back to his original position. If tails, he writes "stay" on the list, signals with the lamp, and stays where he is.

This is repeated an appropriate number of times. Observers note on similar lists whether they see him enter room 2 or not. If the lists mathc, he fails. If they don't see him, he wins.

There will be details, of course.


Hans

 

[MRC_Hans]

*snip*However, like I said, I have experienced this once and I've seen it a couple of times. My experience was corroborated by the people around me and it's still NOT easy for me to explain it in terms of paranormal stuff.

*snip*

You have seen invisible people. .... I see.....

Hans

 

[BPSCG]

What's paranormal about it? I get invisible a couple of times every day. Can't do it on demand; in fact, it happens at the most inopportune times, to wit:

• When I need help at Home Depot. I believe many people have been invisible this way.
• When I'm getting off the subway; mobs of people just fight their way past me, whereas if they could see me, they'd instantly realize it would be much easier for them to get on the train after I get off. This happens on elevators, also.
• I'm invisible to tourists. A herd of them will be walking towards me, holding hands the entire breadth of the sidewalk. Either I'm invisible or they think I can magically fly over their heads as our paths intersect.
• They get off the escalator and stop, when, if they could see me, they would realize that the escalator is going to push me right into them.
• My car gets invisible, too. How else to explain the fact that when I'm backing up out of a parking spot and my backup lights are on, people walk right behind my car?
• I also get invisible in the grocery store. If I weren't, that fat tub of goo behind the shopping cart blocking the aisle would move out of the way as I approach.
• I'm invisible to my cats whenever they're not hungry.
• I get invisible when I noisily stumble into the house at 2:00 am after last call, hop into bed, and suggest to Mrs. BPSCG that now would be a great time to have some fun.

So I don't think being invisible is, per se, paranormal. Being able to turn it on and off at will, on the other hand...

 

[Rob Lister]

I'm wanting to ask about 'human invisibility'? That is, to not be seen by other people with naked eye. To go a bit further, to get tested without needing the use of cameras or video equipment, but with the naked eye and actual observers.

Not to derail the thread but there are interesting literary examples of this. The earliest I know of dates back to Jesus and the lastest to Carlos Castanada's Don Juan.

Not that I believe it but many years ago I was a supervisor for a production workcenter. Several of my subordinates were very adept in this particular art. I can't call it paranormal but it was certainly skillful.

 

[prander]

I can imagine a protocol would be pretty tricky. This might just fall into the category of "it'll be obvious", along with people who say they can fly by flapping their arms or glow in the dark.

If I were to actually propose something like this (and send in an application), I would not demand any special conditions or set up, just bring me in and if I can do it, I can and if I can't, I can't...

The only one thing I would request is that the human be the judge of the invisibility, not a camera or other video recording / sensing equipment. I would definitely not mind the use of video equipment and cameras, but I would not want them to be used as a criteria for whether the invisibility actually worked or not. (if you want to hear my thoughts on why, just ask)

If I ever thought I could do this, I would, of course, be willing to be tested however was deemed necessary.

You have seen invisible people. .... I see.....

No, I have not seen invisible people, I have seen someone "just dissappear"... in front of my eyes...


BPSCG:
Yes, I'm aware of people who talk about 'social invisibility' and the like. I'm not referring to any of that, I was actually standing in front of a group of people and none could literally see me, at all.

My situation included me coming into a room where people were already at, they were expecting me to come in and their direct attention would have been focused on me. So, I came in and none could literally see me, at all.


I'm still skeptical of these things and I've been through all these different explanations and trying to rationalize it, but it was too lucid, too corroborative to deny.

Again, of course this sounds cooky and crazy. It goes against common sense and one person claiming something like this doesn't mean much. I'm not claiming I can do it, just that I have had a personal experience (and witnessed it a couple of times) with this that I can't explain at all.

 

[Spindrift]

Can you give us a little more detail as to what it is you experienced?

What did you have to do to make yourself invisible?

Do your clothes become invisible too? Or do you have to do this naked?

How about if you are carrying something? Does it appear to float or does it somehow become invisible as well?

Could everyone in the room not see you? Or just certain people?

Have you tried it with a different group of people?

Is it not possible that the people in the room were pulling your leg?

 

[BPSCG]

Re: Re: Human Invisibility Phenomena

Not that I believe it but many years ago I was a supervisor for a production workcenter. Several of my subordinates were very adept in this particular art. I can't call it paranormal but it was certainly skillful.

Anyone named Pulver in that bunch?

 

[Squidd]

Okay, I'll bite. Why wouldn't you want to rely on the videotape?

I like the protocol Hans suggests, and I'll bet Randi would, too. He's said on a number of occasions that a test should be set up so that no one needs to "judge" the outcome.

 

[prander]

Can you give us a little more detail as to what it is you experienced?

Well, not a whole lot. I was wearing clothes; shoes, shirt, pants and socks, that's about all that anyone would see. I was just going into the room and they couldn't see me. I can't explain it, I won't try to explain it, it just happened. I wouldn't say that there was anything 'out of the ordinary' going on (before or after), I wasn't trying or hoping to do anything and I wasn't thinking about it.

What did you have to do to make yourself invisible?

Nothing. I didn't try to, I wasn't wanting to, I didn't do anything. It just happened.

Do your clothes become invisible too? Or do you have to do this naked?

I would have to say that they did as well. I certainly wasn't naked, this was a casual event, just kind of hanging out with people.

Could everyone in the room not see you? Or just certain people?

I would assume that no one could. I asked one person, who I wouldn't think would think I was crazy if I asked him about this, and he told me that I never came in (the first time).

Have you tried it with a different group of people?

Unfortunately, no.

Is it not possible that the people in the room were pulling your leg?

Of course, it's always a possibility. I didn't start touching people or anything to make sure they weren't pulling my leg, but they would not react to me at all, not to anything I said, nothing. None of these people have ever done anything like that before or after.


Again, I'm not trying to make the claim that I can do this. I don't have some other motive and I'm not trying to prove this to anyone. I'm just trying to recount a very bizarre experience that I had, to the best of my ability.

 

[Pup]

Of course, it's always a possibility. I didn't start touching people or anything to make sure they weren't pulling my leg, but they would not react to me at all, not to anything I said, nothing. None of these people have ever done anything like that before or after.

That adds another twist. It wasn't just invisibility; they couldn't hear you either?

 

[Beleth]

This might be one of those cases that fall under the "get three people to vouch that they have seen you do this" rule too.

The best way to find out if this qualifies is to fill out the application form and submit it.

 

[KentR]

Were you visible to yourself?
At what point did you become visible. Could they have been discussing something interesting and simply not notice you?

 

[prander]

That adds another twist. It wasn't just invisibility; they couldn't hear you either?

Yeah, I suppose it does. I wasn't yelling or screaming, but I was talking and they didn't seem to notice.

This might be one of those cases that fall under the "get three people to vouch that they have seen you do this" rule too.

I initially thought that too. I know a handful of the law enforcement in this city and some family members are law enforcement, I guess they would work.

The best way to find out if this qualifies is to fill out the application form and submit it.

Yeah, I imagine that's the only way. But, again, I'm not claiming that I can do anything, just that it did happen and that I've seen it with someone who claimed they could do it 'at will'.

Okay, I'll bite. Why wouldn't you want to rely on the videotape?

The person who I initially saw do this explained it as being a perceptual thing and that it only effects people and animals, living beings (soul-bearers as he calls them).

Please understand, this is not my explanation, it's not my theory. This person demonstrated this to me and then explained it this way. So, as a precaution, as I've never been able to try this with any video recording / sensing equipment, I wouldn't want to make it mandatory for a video camera (or whatever) to pick it up and have that as the minimal evidence needed. I wouldn't mind video equipment being used at all, I just don't know how this works or if any video equipment would pick it up or not.


Thanks again all.

 

[SpaceFluffer]

I'm not trying to make the claim that I can do this.

I KNOW I've done it once.

Whaaa?

And how supremely arrogant of you, when faced with the possibility that either your ability to find an explanation for a single event is lacking, or that well tested, well understood laws of physics are lacking, that you would choose to assume that it is the physics, and not you.