How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

[El Greco]

What are the latest opinions about the diameter of pores in condoms vs the diameter of the HIV ? I've read various arguments and counter arguments but I think there's no consensus. And just saying that a condom merely "reduces the danger" isn't exactly reassuring.

 

[Anders]

What are the latest opinions about the diameter of pores in condoms vs the diameter of the HIV ? I've read various arguments and counter arguments but I think there's no consensus. And just saying that a condom merely "reduces the danger" isn't exactly reassuring.

BS! One reason: Take a condom, fill it with ordinary tap water. Does it leek? no. A virus has a molecular weight of millions of daltons. If water doesn't get thorugh, virusis won't.

There are loads of sites on the intenet about this.

 

[Zep]

100% safe. Why?

1) Put condom over own head (i.e. skull).
2) Partner laughs so hard that sex is impossible.
3) Retire wilting and in a sulk.

See?!

 

[richardm]

It seems to me that there's a lot of disinformation about regarding the safety of condoms. I suspect that the Catholic Church has something to do with it.

 

[exarch]

Re: Re: How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

Originally posted by Anders
BS! One reason: Take a condom, fill it with ordinary tap water. Does it leek? no. A virus has a molecular weight of millions of daltons. If water doesn't get thorugh, virusis won't.

There are loads of sites on the intenet about this.

I think the risk is not of the virus getting through the latex, but of the chances that the latex is damaged and has imperfections that might make the condom leak.

Condoms are still the surest means of birth control, but even so, you do hear lots of rumors about condoms sometimes leaking and not being 100% safe. Most likely due to improper use I suppose.

 

[Kumar]

May be: as much as it is safer for fertilization.

 

[El Greco]

Re: Re: How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

BS! One reason: Take a condom, fill it with ordinary tap water. Does it leek? no. A virus has a molecular weight of millions of daltons. If water doesn't get thorugh, virusis won't.

There are loads of sites on the intenet about this.

I've read that too and it makes sense. In any case, what I'm trying to find out is the diameter of the pores in condoms. Eg., from this page:

Condoms have tiny pores in them and some people think these leak viruses, but this is not the case. Studies by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control have shown that the AIDS virus does not pass through latex condoms. This is in part due to the need of a virus to attach to another particle such as a cell, and fluid dynamics including surface tension.

Notice how it says that the virus can't pass due to need for attachment and fluid dynamics. It doesn't mention "pore size"...

And yes, I guess Catholic church would be very happy if this were true...

 

[Benguin]

It seems to me that there's a lot of disinformation about regarding the safety of condoms. I suspect that the Catholic Church has something to do with it.

It's the usual woo false dichetomy about not knowing the difference between some risk and 50/50.

I think the figure normally quoted is that condoms are 99% effective, but I don't know if that is properly backed up.

I do remember reading that a study was conducted on Haemophiliac HIV patients in the US some years back that established condoms were very effective in keeping the other partner free of infection.

 

[Anders]

Re: Re: Re: How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

I've read that too and it makes sense. In any case, what I'm trying to find out is the diameter of the pores in condoms. Eg., from this page:



Notice how it says that the virus can't pass due to need for attachment and fluid dynamics. It doesn't mention "pore size"...

And yes, I guess Catholic church would be very happy if this were true...

Still again, Water, approx 18 daltons, compared to an molecular weight of HIV at about a few millions (my estimate, might be wrong) daltons.

I just don't see how a HIV virus would get through these pores when water dosen't. It's physicaly impossible. Unless the condom is damaged, which was correctly pointed out by exarch above.

dalton: g/mol

 

[El Greco]

Re: Re: Re: Re: How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

I just don't see how a HIV virus would get through these pores when water dosen't. It's physicaly impossible. Unless the condom is damaged, which was correctly pointed out by exarch above.

Don't quote me on this, but apparently it has to do with the surface tension of water ?

Furthermore, is it possible that condoms will actually leak water, but really slowly ? Like baloons that lose their air ?

 

[Anders]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

Don't quote me on this, but apparently it has to do with the surface tension of water ?

Furthermore, is it possible that condoms will actually leak water, but really slowly ? Like baloons that lose their air ?

OK, if air slowly gets out of a condom, how would even one virus about a 100'000 times bigger get through. A HIV virus is not smaller then any other viruse, not much anyway, and so much research shows that condoms help against STDs. If condoms help against other STDs it help against HIV.

The catholic church, however, has always tried to spread lies that servers their own purposes.(I’m not gonna back that up its common knowledge )

 

[MRC_Hans]

I don't know if latex is water-tight. Oh sure, water does not atrually drip through it, but probably, there is some diffusion. Surprisingly few polymers are diffusion-tight to water (in fact, it is only some of the epoxys).

Hans

 

[Anders]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How effective are condoms against AIDS ?

Don't quote me on this, but apparently it has to do with the surface tension of water ?

Furthermore, is it possible that condoms will actually leak water, but really slowly ? Like baloons that lose their air ?

If it has to do with surface tension, the viruses would be stoped as well.

 

[Anders]

I don't know if latex is water-tight. Oh sure, water does not atrually drip through it, but probably, there is some diffusion. Surprisingly few polymers are diffusion-tight to water (in fact, it is only some of the epoxys).

Hans

well, we are not talking about water, but of viruses and sperms. If water get through, fine. But if a virus, any virus, get thorugh, people get sick and sometimes die. Thats why medical personal wares latex gloves, and they don't get sick.

 

[Deetee]

There is a lot of disinformation on this subject on the net, and as was pointed out, the catholic church has an agenda to show up condoms as being ineffective.

Believe none of it - they are effective cf benguin and anders.

 

[exarch]

Originally posted by MRC_Hans
I don't know if latex is water-tight. Oh sure, water does not atrually drip through it, but probably, there is some diffusion. Surprisingly few polymers are diffusion-tight to water (in fact, it is only some of the epoxys).

Untreated latex (i.e. not coated with something to protect it) is not very resistant to contact with water, heat or UV light. The latex degrades, it will literally start to rot away. Accidents despite the use of condoms are, most likely, due to people using condoms that have expired (i.e. the manufacturer has printed a "use before" date, after which they can no longer guarantee the quality of the latex), or people handled the condom inappropriately (so they nicked it with a fingernail or something). Not to mention the fact many guys apparently keep a condom in their wallet (probably squashed up in their back pocket), which, apart from being convenient I suppose, is not the safest place to keep something that's not as sturdy as you would expect.

 

[toddjh]

The general consensus is that the wide range of condom efficacy estimates is due to improper usage. There's good evidence that condoms, when used properly and consistently, are very good at preventing transmission of HIV. For example,

In a study of discordant couples in Europe, among 123 couples who reported consistent condom use, none of the uninfected partners became infected. In contrast, among the 122 couples who used condoms inconsistently, 12 of the uninfected partners became infected.

Also of note is the fact that not a single legal prostitute working in Nevada has been found to be HIV+. Condom use is required for all sex acts there, and if anyone knows how to use them properly, it's them.

You'd think there wouldn't be much trouble using a condom properly, but it's more than just knowing how to put it on. If you use a condom that's too big or too small, you increase the chances of slippage or breakage. Ditto if you use too much or too little lube. And there are actually some men who will surreptitiously try to take the thing off in mid-act.

Jeremy

 

[MRC_Hans]

well, we are not talking about water, but of viruses and sperms. If water get through, fine. But if a virus, any virus, get thorugh, people get sick and sometimes die. Thats why medical personal wares latex gloves, and they don't get sick.

Of course, but your argument was "since water cannot get through, neither can vira". .

Hans

 

[Capsid]

Also note that scientists culturing HIV in the lab at many times the concentration found in body fluids wear latex gloves.

 

[pgwenthold]

quote:
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In a study of discordant couples in Europe, among 123 couples who reported consistent condom use, none of the uninfected partners became infected. In contrast, among the 122 couples who used condoms inconsistently, 12 of the uninfected partners became infected.
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Actually, the bigger question is whether there is ANY evidence of ANY HIV transmission when using a condom properly? I haven't looked into it a lot, but in the studies I have heard about, the transmission rate has always been zero when a condom is used.

As noted early on, the problem with condoms is that they break, or fall off.

Pore size has nothing to with it.