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God Kills Girl

wolfgirl

Graduate Poster
wolfgirl
Joined
Apr 24, 2002
Messages
1,375
We've discussed something kinda like this here before...the way that people will say that anything good is because of their god. This typically happens when there's a disaster and someone is hurt but not killed. "God was looking out for them." Oh, really? Why did their god fling them across the field with a tornado, breaking their legs, but then decide to "save" them by not letting them die? If he had that power, why didn't he just keep the tornado from flinging them in the first place?

Anyways, my new observation is kind of the opposite of that. I was listening to a radio story on the anniversary of 9/11, where they were talking to the mother of one of the Pennsylvania plane crash victims. She told how her daughter had only been on stand-by for that flight and only got on at the last minute. It made me think how, if it had been the other way around, and she hadn't gotten on, everyone would be saying that God had protected her (though saying nothing about why he didn't protect all the other people on board). Can't you just hear the "Wow, God kept her from getting on that flight. He is so great and amazing. Praise God."? Yet in this case, you don't hear anyone saying, "Wow, God really must not like your daughter to have put her on that flight that she wasn't even supposed to be on."

Let me be very clear that I am not advocating that anybody should say such an awful thing. It's just that the very concept doesn't even occur to these people as an inconsitency in their thought process. These are the same people who would be convinced that their god had worked a miracle and saved the girl if she had missed the flight, and who would be telling the story as "proof" of their god's existence and benificence, yet her getting on the flight is, apparently, just a tragic accident.

How do they live like that?
 
wolfgirl said:
How do they live like that?
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Faith.

Reason doesn't enter into it. People manage to shut off that part of their mind, when it comes to their sky buddy. It's no problem for them; they do it automatically.
 
When God does save someone, they cherish it.
When God fails to save someone, they come up with a million reasons for why He shouldn't save that person in the first place (shoehorning free will is their favorite ploy, and also the most annoying one).

It's an ancient paradox of the "God is great because He saves _______ from ______" line - for every person He saves, He neglects hundreds of thousands.

If I saved one person from drowning and let ten others drown on ten other occasions, I wouldn't be a good person.

I've been close to attributing a survival to some sort of power, too, but the above still stands.
 
Reminds of my boss (whom I like, I have to add).
His son was rolled over by a truck. He nearly died. In fact, he had only a very small chance to survive, and he used it. My boss said, the surviving of his son was god´s work. Since I do not know how well his son is today, I think I won´t ask him about that piece of cognitive dissonance, but believe me, it is hard not to.
 
Face it, wolfgirl... God kills everybody. It's only a matter of when.
 
Reminds of my boss (whom I like, I have to add).
His son was rolled over by a truck. He nearly died. In fact, he had only a very small chance to survive, and he used it. My boss said, the surviving of his son was god´s work. Since I do not know how well his son is today, I think I won´t ask him about that piece of cognitive dissonance, but believe me, it is hard not to.
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That's the second way of justifying it... it could always be worse.

Not hurt: Thank God I didn't get hurt in that car crash! Must've been the Lord protecting me!
Light injury: An SUV hit me, totaled by car and broke my leg. Thank God for watching over me so I didn't get seriously hurt!
Serious injury: OK, so my back got broken when my car got rammed by that other vehicle, but so what? At least I'm not dead! What would the world do without God?
Fatality: That could've been so much worse! What if a car full of people had been hit? Or... holy me, imagine a pile-up! Thank God He's watching over us and made the accident happen on a quiet day!
 
Safe-Keeper said:
That's the second way of justifying it... it could always be worse.
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This is really no different than standard optimism, except for the insertion of magical sky daddy beliefs. Many of us who don't believe in God do the same thing -- "I was lucky, it could have been worse," because dwelling on the negative is a good way to slip into depression, indecision, paralysis, and death. I suspect our ancestors who did so didn't reproduce as much as those who chose to "Always look on the bright side of life," so here we are.

There was a train wreck last week, on the route my wife takes to and from work. The accident happened to an earlier train than the one she takes, and it happened after the stop where she gets off the train. Sitting around watching the news unfold over the weekend, she tried to play the "lucky me" card, but I gently kidded her out of it.

"If I'd gotten off work early, and come home on that train..."

"You'd still have gotten off the train before it was hit."

This morning, as I was taking her to the train, there was news on the radio about another train that derailed after striking a bus, with injuries but apparently no fatalities. We started talking about the accidents. She always took the last car before (I'm not sure why); now, after the engine was telescoped into the first car of last week's train, lots of people are opting for the last car, and she has to stand for part of the ride. It's not completely superstitious, but I still scoff, and I joked about how I watch the people getting off the train and note the "real men" who still ride in the first car.

And then, even though she knows I'm an unbeliever, she smiled and said, "Well, pray for me."

"I don't think God needs my advice to decide which train to wreck."

"God doesn't wreck trains, it was human error."

"In that case, praying isn't going to do any good anyway, is it?"

"Shut up." We're both laughing, of course, but I think deep down she's also acknowledging that, even with a belief in God, the idea of intercessory prayer is kind of silly.

I don't expect her to stop believing, and I'm not even sure I want her to, but it does make for some interesting conversations.
 
juryjone said:
Faith.

Reason doesn't enter into it. People manage to shut off that part of their mind, when it comes to their sky buddy. It's no problem for them; they do it automatically.
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Ditto.

Faith makes it easy to deal with everything. Except, perhaps, secular knowledge.
 
Such nonsense when people talk like that about God, dont get me wrong here I myself do believe in God but to say that God saved one person yet so many others die in such a way in my opinion is blasphamy.

If I sound like Im trying to preach to you people I do apologise, but I do agree that it does not make sense!

I say IF anything it would have been the been the work of either satan or a bunch of pissed off people who did not like the u.s.
 
cannotthinkofaname said:
Such nonsense when people talk like that about God, dont get me wrong here I myself do believe in God but to say that God saved one person yet so many others die in such a way in my opinion is blasphamy.

If I sound like Im trying to preach to you people I do apologise, but I do agree that it does not make sense!

I say IF anything it would have been the been the work of either satan or a bunch of pissed off people who did not like the u.s.
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It's okay, I actually think what you said makes a lot of sense, even though I don't believe in God myself. Within a religious context, the people who attempt to dictate how God thinks, acts, and judges, especially when it comes to his role in tragic events, are the ones who are truly doing him a disservice. It would seem to me that the more sensible thing for believers to say would be that we don't know and can't make such judgments, for that is up to God.
 
Silentknight said:
Within a religious context, the people who attempt to dictate how God thinks, acts, and judges, especially when it comes to his role in tragic events, are the ones who are truly doing him a disservice. It would seem to me that the more sensible thing for believers to say would be that we don't know and can't make such judgments, for that is up to God.
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Thats it mate I could not have said it better myself mate, personally I cannot understand how people can get that overly religious that they say that God will save one person but will kill a bunch more people just for the sake of it
 
juryjone said:
Faith.

Reason doesn't enter into it. People manage to shut off that part of their mind, when it comes to their sky buddy. It's no problem for them; they do it automatically.
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I have to disagree here mate, even though Im not shy in saying that I believe in God I don't automatically say that it is a miracle when 1 person out of a plane full of people survived when the rest died.
IF the plane crashed and all of the people survived in my opinion that would be a miracle or Gods work.

And as I said earler if I sound like Im trying to force my beliefs on anyone I do apologise, no offence intended.
 
Please hang around. We need more believers here:).

There was this YouTube vid showing a pastor's sermon/lecture on the tsunami that I really liked. I don't remember his name, though, but I'll look for him and post the sermon here. Edit, here:


If the embed doesn't work, try this.
 
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Even Jesus didn't buy into that theology:

Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. Jesus answered, "Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? I tell you, no! .... Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them — do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? I tell you, no!
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So it's not exactly Christian to believe that when bad things happen to you which are caused by humans or nature, it's God's punishment. Therefore, it is also not Christian to believe that when good things happen to you which are caused by humans or nature, it's God's blessing.
 
cannotthinkofaname said:
I have to disagree here mate, even though Im not shy in saying that I believe in God I don't automatically say that it is a miracle when 1 person out of a plane full of people survived when the rest died.
IF the plane crashed and all of the people survived in my opinion that would be a miracle or Gods work.

And as I said earler if I sound like Im trying to force my beliefs on anyone I do apologise, no offence intended.
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Thank you for replying; as I said it seems that too few people actually think about their faith and the logical consequences.

I'm having some trouble, though, seeing where you draw the line between what is a natural occurrence that God doesn't involve himself in and miracles where he does. If one person survives, it's not a miracle. If they all do, it is a miracle. What if all but one survives?

Believing that intercessory prayer works is problematic, IMO, because it's not obvious where natural occurrences end and the results of prayer start.

Piggy certainly said it well:

Piggy said:
So it's not exactly Christian to believe that when bad things happen to you which are caused by humans or nature, it's God's punishment. Therefore, it is also not Christian to believe that when good things happen to you which are caused by humans or nature, it's God's blessing.
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cannotthinkofaname said:
Such nonsense when people talk like that about God, dont get me wrong here I myself do believe in God but to say that God saved one person yet so many others die in such a way in my opinion is blasphamy.

If I sound like Im trying to preach to you people I do apologise, but I do agree that it does not make sense!

I say IF anything it would have been the been the work of either satan or a bunch of pissed off people who did not like the u.s.
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With there being so many gods around why cant they get together and save one each, maybe according to allegiance or just because it would be a nice thing to do.
 
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learner said:
With there being so many gods around why cant they get together and save one each, maybe according to allegiance or just because it would be a nice thing to do.
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Well I see your point but another way of looking at it is same God different faces, meaning that the way I see it is all the different religions are just different ways of viewing God. I hope you see what I mean
 
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