Germans may need licence to watch TV on computers
asthmatic camel
Illuminator
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Claus dwarling, have you ever considered becoming a BBC TV presenter so that everyone with a TV or PC contributes towards your living expenses, whether or not they are interested in anything that you have to say?
I could go on but I won't.
I could go on but I won't.
Rob Lister
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CFLarsen said:
I suppose my American mindset prevents me from understanding the rationale behind requiring a license for watching television. I understand the revenue stream/scheme/scam but what I don't understand is why the public in such countries put up with. I don't see how it benefits them.
Here, the average person indirectly pays about $.01 dollars (that's a guess) per year in taxes that go to our national and state Public Broadcasting System (PBS) and even at that, many people bitch. I couldn't imagine what they'd do (or I'd do) if I had to pay 10's or 100's of dollars.
I guess the theory goes that the license system allows for more educational/artistic/documentery programming but here most people see that as a code-speak for government sponsered propaganda.
We like our propaganda privately funded, more often than not.
Let the market decide is my take.
asthmatic camel
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CFLarsen said:No. But I am sure that TV as we know it would be fundamentally changed, if I did become a TV presenter....
Bong, bong etc. etc., Here is the six o'clock news as read by Claus Flodin Larsen.
Headlines
Claus Flodin Larsen has a website.
Claus Flodin Larsen is extremely clever.
Claus Flodin Larsen is able to explain the inexplicable.
Claus Flodin Larsen is a smug Dane.
Claus Flodin Larsen might just be in love with Interesting Ian.
Claus Flodin Larsen may be a plastic surgeon with the ability to reduce the length of Cleopatra's nose.
Today, in a shocking revelation written by Reginald in an inarticulate article in the Boozer's Daily often known as The Sun, a certain Mr. Claus Flodin Larsen, was vilified and damned to the seventh level of Hell by a lunatic. Mr Carlos Swett (accompanied, as ever, by his incredible flying hat of doom), told the Sun reporter that, "Claus Flodin Larsen is next, tell the world that my hat is after him".
The Sun reporter asked Mr. Swett if he had the slightest shred of evidence to support his claims.
"Evidence?", replied Mr. Swett, "I don't need no stinking evidence. I have my hat; it's like the one in the James Bond film that cuts off people's heads and gets me electrocuted."
The Sun reporter replies " Great story, I'll try to get it fitted underneath a nipple somewhere"
Earthborn
Terrestrial Intelligence
Actually a well designed public media licensing system is meant to reduce the possibility of government propaganda. Payment is mandatory, but the money goes in a seperate fund that is not under political control. That way it is ensured that the system is financed, but at the same time the government is unable to use it for propaganda and corporate influence of the media is reduced.
Well, that's the theory anyway. Of course there usually is some government influence. For example in many countries there are regulations that regulate how much educational/artistic/documentary programming there needs to be. Usually however, the government cannot define these things for broadcasting foundations, so these foundations may try to follow the regulation by the letter but not the spirit. Here in the Netherlands there are many different broadcasting foundations (that share 3 public channels) representing different political or religious movements. One foundation however seems primarily interested in showing entertainment. The managed to follow the regulations for a percentage of art by buying art documentaries from other countries and broadcasting them under the title "Art - Because We Have To". They probably bought them cheaply, because they often were old. But they still managed to put out some good television this way.
Other foundations are often a bit more creative. They make for example entertaining game shows with an artsy touch and label it as 'art' instead of entertainment. A knowledge quiz is of course 'education'.
Up until a few years ago the Dutch public broadcasting was also financed by television licenses. It always appeared a bit silly to me, and I was glad when they simply started to pay for it directly by the government. I think I changed my mind on it though as the government now seems to feel a bit freer to dictate how much money is spend on public television and how the broadcasting system needs to do its job. It's not nearly state television, but it is a bit closer.
But if the market decides it is a good idea that the information people get is controlled by a few large corporations that don't want anyone to think negatively of them, or that a good interview is impossible because it must be interrupted every 5 minutes for commercials, then you've also lost something valuable, IMHO.
What Earthborn said.
Plus, its the TV-tuner that counts so if you have a graphics card with a tuner you should pay license today in Sweden. But its not like its hard to evade paying, just refuse letting that pesky person in your house who wants to check on you. It's not like he'l call the police and let them bulldozer down your front door.
The license covers PBS-radio as well but you don't need the license if you don't have a TV but listen to radio.
Plus, its the TV-tuner that counts so if you have a graphics card with a tuner you should pay license today in Sweden. But its not like its hard to evade paying, just refuse letting that pesky person in your house who wants to check on you. It's not like he'l call the police and let them bulldozer down your front door.
The license covers PBS-radio as well but you don't need the license if you don't have a TV but listen to radio.
Wudang
BOFH
Re: Re: Germans may need licence to watch TV on computers
When I worked in US I'd often find that a program that took 30-40 minutes to watch on the BBC took an hour in the US because of the incessant ad breaks usually at the most dramatic points.
Rob Lister said:
When I worked in US I'd often find that a program that took 30-40 minutes to watch on the BBC took an hour in the US because of the incessant ad breaks usually at the most dramatic points.
Re: Re: Germans may need licence to watch TV on computers
Well the BBC is pretty far departed from government propaganda!
Maybe if the money from the license went purely to production companies to produce the programming you describe, and the outlets were mandated to give them slots we might see intellectual and/or minority interest content. As it is the BBC has to 'compete' with the commercial channels in spite of being entirely tax supported.
It creates some very bizarre editorial decisions.
A lot of people are unhappy with the license fee. I wouldn't mind if there was something different we got for it, but the BBC is not really any different to our other channels. And certainly shows no impartiality or integrity.
Trouble is, we are talking a media outlet, and media sticks together. Whenever the license fee is threatened they kick up one hell of a fuss and governments usually decide it isn't worth the risk.
I find adverts annoying, but then I suspect pay per view would be even more irritating.
Rob Lister said:
Well the BBC is pretty far departed from government propaganda!
Maybe if the money from the license went purely to production companies to produce the programming you describe, and the outlets were mandated to give them slots we might see intellectual and/or minority interest content. As it is the BBC has to 'compete' with the commercial channels in spite of being entirely tax supported.
It creates some very bizarre editorial decisions.
A lot of people are unhappy with the license fee. I wouldn't mind if there was something different we got for it, but the BBC is not really any different to our other channels. And certainly shows no impartiality or integrity.
Trouble is, we are talking a media outlet, and media sticks together. Whenever the license fee is threatened they kick up one hell of a fuss and governments usually decide it isn't worth the risk.
I find adverts annoying, but then I suspect pay per view would be even more irritating.
I think the BBC services in the UK are an example of showing how public funding of a service can offer a much better deal then a "free market" alternative.
From the BBC website:
All the above is provided for an average of £9.67 a month.
Compare that to the only significant other subscriber offering in the UK, BSKYB, their cheapest package is £13.50 (plus a £60 installation fee) and they offer:
One entertainment channel and one news channel, plus providing you with access to a couple of other channels.
From the BBC website:
All the above is provided for an average of £9.67 a month.
Compare that to the only significant other subscriber offering in the UK, BSKYB, their cheapest package is £13.50 (plus a £60 installation fee) and they offer:
One entertainment channel and one news channel, plus providing you with access to a couple of other channels.
In fairness, Monty Python, Fawlty Towers, The Office, and more.
And also in fairness, their news website is the best around even if the editorial is a bit weird.
It could be argued that their influence maintains the standard of our other channels, though I don't how one could ever prove it.
I'd probably not be opposed to the license approach if I had more say in what they produce. But then that's both a selfish and impossible demand!
And also in fairness, their news website is the best around even if the editorial is a bit weird.
It could be argued that their influence maintains the standard of our other channels, though I don't how one could ever prove it.
I'd probably not be opposed to the license approach if I had more say in what they produce. But then that's both a selfish and impossible demand!
Rob Lister
Unregistered
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- 8,504
Okay, I understand a little better now. I guess your setup isn't so bad after all. I'm still not sure I'd perfer it but all-in-all it looks like you get your money's worth.
I think we're paying about $30 a month for our expanded cable package. Broadcast TV is free but around here I would only get about ten channels and reception on some sucks. Here's the line-up (mostly accurate) for my cable (the number to the right is the channel)
ABC Family - Family Programming 19
A&E (Arts & Entertainment) 28
AMC (American Movie Classics) 55
Animal Planet - Nature 43
BET (Black Entertainment Television) 36
Bravo - Movies, dance & theater 61
Cartoon Network 17
Cinemax (MAX) - Movies 51
CMT (Country Music Television) 33
CNBC (Consumer News & Business) 25
CNN 8
CNN Headline News 26
Comcast SportsNet 35
Comedy Central - original & classic comedy 32
Court TV 57
C-SPAN, C-SPAN 2 - US Government 44, 45
Discovery Channel - Educational 31
Discovery Health 58
Disney Channel - Family programming 38
E! (Entertainment Television) 41
Educational Access 47
Encore - A Great Movie Every Night 53
ESPN, ESPN 2 12, 60
Food Network 68
Fox News Channel 64
fX - Fox on Cable 16
Government Access - City Government 46, 48
HBO, HBO2 - Movies 20, 21
HGTV - (Home & Garden Television) 27
The History Channel - Documentaries 59
HSN (Home Shopping Network) 65
ITV - Religious Programming 39
The Learning Channel (TLC) 30
Lifetime - Women’s Programming 9
LNC 5 5
MoreMAX - More Cinemax Choices 52
MSNBC - News and On-line Service 23
MTV (Music Television) 22
The Movie Channel (TMC) 70
Nickelodeon - Children’s & Classics 29
Outdoor Life Network - Environmental 34
Pay-Per-View 99
QVC - 24-hour Home Shopping 50
Sci-Fi Channel - Science Fiction 40
ShopAtHome 77
Showtime - Movies & Sports 69
Speed Channel - World’s Fastest Sports 63
Spike TV - Men’s Programming 56
STARZ! - Movies, movies, movies. 54
TBS (WTBS - Atlanta) 42
TNT (Turner Network Television) 66
Travel Channel - Travel Shows 62
TV Guide Channel - TV Listings 1, 75
TV Land - Classic Programs 37
Univision - Spanish Programming 73
USA - Variety & Original Programs 18
UNC-TV 6
VH-1 - Video Hits 67
WAVY, NBC 10
WCOX - Local Programming 11
The Weather Channel 24
WGN - Sports & Variety 72
WGNT, UPN 7
WHRO, PBS 15
WPXV - PAX 49
WSKY 4
WTKR,CBS 3
WTVZ, WB 2
WVEC, ABC 13
I think we're paying about $30 a month for our expanded cable package. Broadcast TV is free but around here I would only get about ten channels and reception on some sucks. Here's the line-up (mostly accurate) for my cable (the number to the right is the channel)
ABC Family - Family Programming 19
A&E (Arts & Entertainment) 28
AMC (American Movie Classics) 55
Animal Planet - Nature 43
BET (Black Entertainment Television) 36
Bravo - Movies, dance & theater 61
Cartoon Network 17
Cinemax (MAX) - Movies 51
CMT (Country Music Television) 33
CNBC (Consumer News & Business) 25
CNN 8
CNN Headline News 26
Comcast SportsNet 35
Comedy Central - original & classic comedy 32
Court TV 57
C-SPAN, C-SPAN 2 - US Government 44, 45
Discovery Channel - Educational 31
Discovery Health 58
Disney Channel - Family programming 38
E! (Entertainment Television) 41
Educational Access 47
Encore - A Great Movie Every Night 53
ESPN, ESPN 2 12, 60
Food Network 68
Fox News Channel 64
fX - Fox on Cable 16
Government Access - City Government 46, 48
HBO, HBO2 - Movies 20, 21
HGTV - (Home & Garden Television) 27
The History Channel - Documentaries 59
HSN (Home Shopping Network) 65
ITV - Religious Programming 39
The Learning Channel (TLC) 30
Lifetime - Women’s Programming 9
LNC 5 5
MoreMAX - More Cinemax Choices 52
MSNBC - News and On-line Service 23
MTV (Music Television) 22
The Movie Channel (TMC) 70
Nickelodeon - Children’s & Classics 29
Outdoor Life Network - Environmental 34
Pay-Per-View 99
QVC - 24-hour Home Shopping 50
Sci-Fi Channel - Science Fiction 40
ShopAtHome 77
Showtime - Movies & Sports 69
Speed Channel - World’s Fastest Sports 63
Spike TV - Men’s Programming 56
STARZ! - Movies, movies, movies. 54
TBS (WTBS - Atlanta) 42
TNT (Turner Network Television) 66
Travel Channel - Travel Shows 62
TV Guide Channel - TV Listings 1, 75
TV Land - Classic Programs 37
Univision - Spanish Programming 73
USA - Variety & Original Programs 18
UNC-TV 6
VH-1 - Video Hits 67
WAVY, NBC 10
WCOX - Local Programming 11
The Weather Channel 24
WGN - Sports & Variety 72
WGNT, UPN 7
WHRO, PBS 15
WPXV - PAX 49
WSKY 4
WTKR,CBS 3
WTVZ, WB 2
WVEC, ABC 13
Claus.
I live in the UK.
I have not owned a TV set since about 1980, as I refuse to pay a tax on EM radiation which comes through my wall, whether I want it to or not.
I have been to some pains to ensure that any pc I own is not fitted with any TV hardware.
As I now have an ADSL connection, I can receive radio from the Internet.(I don't. I have a perfectly good radio). I have deliberately not researched whether or not I can also download TV signals, but common sense tells me it must be possible.
I do not own a TV license, which as I'm sure you know is required in the UK to operate any TV receiver.
As it is the policy of the authorities to presume guilt until innocence is proven in this matter, I assume I will eventually be prosecuted and fined on this issue. I will refuse to pay any such fine and ultimately , I expect I will be jailed.
Watch this space...
I live in the UK.
I have not owned a TV set since about 1980, as I refuse to pay a tax on EM radiation which comes through my wall, whether I want it to or not.
I have been to some pains to ensure that any pc I own is not fitted with any TV hardware.
As I now have an ADSL connection, I can receive radio from the Internet.(I don't. I have a perfectly good radio). I have deliberately not researched whether or not I can also download TV signals, but common sense tells me it must be possible.
I do not own a TV license, which as I'm sure you know is required in the UK to operate any TV receiver.
As it is the policy of the authorities to presume guilt until innocence is proven in this matter, I assume I will eventually be prosecuted and fined on this issue. I will refuse to pay any such fine and ultimately , I expect I will be jailed.
Watch this space...
Underemployed
Muse
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2003
- Messages
- 764
I would like to know more details about this German 'Law'. For one thing, how do they plan to enforce it? Put packet filters on every ISP to see who is downloading video-on-demand? The TV detector vans in the UK work on emissions from CRT sets, but not on LCD screens.
How will they tell who has a PC? Will shops selling computers be obliged to tell the authorities every time they sell one? I know that in the UK, we are supposed to report whenever someone buys a TV card (but nobody does). Will PC current owners have to 'fess up and put themselves on a list?
What about someone buying a monitor? Or a motherboard? Will every PC component sale be reported, or will only people who buy ready-made boxes be counted (which would be great for the DIY market)?
Sureley the only way to do this fairly and efficiently is to add it to the cost of the ISP in the form of a new tax.
Any Germans here? In the UK, you get one license per household, so that would cover any PCs you have. Do you have to pay per device there?
How will they tell who has a PC? Will shops selling computers be obliged to tell the authorities every time they sell one? I know that in the UK, we are supposed to report whenever someone buys a TV card (but nobody does). Will PC current owners have to 'fess up and put themselves on a list?
What about someone buying a monitor? Or a motherboard? Will every PC component sale be reported, or will only people who buy ready-made boxes be counted (which would be great for the DIY market)?
Sureley the only way to do this fairly and efficiently is to add it to the cost of the ISP in the form of a new tax.
Any Germans here? In the UK, you get one license per household, so that would cover any PCs you have. Do you have to pay per device there?
asthmatic camel
Illuminator
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- Apr 23, 2003
- Messages
- 4,510
That information is incorrect, Underemployed. Basically, if you're a member of the family, the householder's licence covers you. If you are not, (say you're a lodger) you need to get your own licence.
Pedantic, I know, but potentially a great money saver.
http://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/