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Edmund (Pseudo)Scientific at it Again: This Time They’re Selling an “ESP Lamp”

MattusMaximus

Intellectual Gladiator
MattusMaximus
Joined
Jan 26, 2006
Messages
15,948
Man oh man :rolleyes:

There is a science teaching outlet named Edmund Scientific which is starting to go off the rails. Back in 2009, they started to sell all manner of goofy things: ghost detectors (which are actually just electromagnetic field meters) and even DVDs on remote viewing. And all of this from a science teaching catalog – you might as well turn to the biology section and see creationist materials for sale!

Well, not to be outdone in their tumble down the rabbit hole, Edmund (Pseudo)Scientific now has for sale an “ESP Lamp”. I kid you not – they claim this thing can actually read your thoughts… as in extra-sensory perception… as in psychic woo-woo… and it only costs about $200!

I think this calls for a boycott, folks.

Read on for more info
 
I had these catalogs when I was a kid. There were often odd things in it, like the pyramid power thing to preserve fruit longer. But you could do the experiment to show it was BS.

Looking at the description:

Lead your own experiments in the mind’s possible influence on machines, PSI testing, and more with this colorful LED lamp. Four different color LEDs are lighted dependent upon a random number generated from a miniature Geiger counter included on the back. You may even figure out how to use it to tell the future. And, when you need a break from the lab, it makes a very interesting lamp too.
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It looks to me like they are not purporting there are real psi-powers. They say you can use it to conduct psi experiments, which is true. If it has a Geiger-counter random-number generator in it, that is one of the very best things you can base psi-experiments on since you can't pfutz with the sequence.

They say "it makes a very interesting lamp, too." I fail to be outraged.
 
You missed this claim:

You may even figure out how to use it to tell the future.
Click to expand...

Based upon their history of selling "ghost detectors" and "remote viewing DVDs" (did you even read the links?), I'd say it is pretty obvious what they're doing.
 
MattusMaximus said:
You missed this claim:

You may even figure out how to use it to tell the future.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

That is sufficiently weasle-worded not to be a claim. I have not looked at the other links, but it doesn't seem to be anything different than what they've done for decades.
 
Y'know, I disagree with the ad copy, but the product is kind of neat. It's a radioactive-decay-randomized mood lamp! Neat! Except for the price tag, that's terrible.

If you had a kid who was interested in ESP and wanted to conduct a test, this would be a neat tool. Kid tries to predict color. Lamp produces color. Repeat. Count up rights and wrongs, learn about the binomial distribution. Sure, you could do the same thing with a $0.5 pair of dice or a $0.01 penny, but that never stopped the educational-toy industry before. :)

(ETA: a miniature Geiger counter? No wonder it's $200. I bet I could get the same functionality out of a $0.10 photodiode.)
 
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"Four different color LEDs "... Four? It's got me sold. Where do I send my money?
 
Well, I guess they are caught between be true-blue and broke, and pandering to make a extra buck. One doesn't have to buy the froth, and if it doesn't sell it will eventually disappear. OTOH, if it does sell, then everyone needs to redouble efforts to educate those we can.

A boycott? Is the competition that you are driving their customers to have a better track record than Edmund in this issue?
 
shadron said:
Well, I guess they are caught between be true-blue and broke, and pandering to make a extra buck. One doesn't have to buy the froth, and if it doesn't sell it will eventually disappear. OTOH, if it does sell, then everyone needs to redouble efforts to educate those we can.
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Based upon the success of Edmund's efforts to sell their "ghost meter" (it has sold out multiple times, with the "not in stock" warning posted, since I reported on it in 2009), I think they're going to be sticking with the "sell b.s. pseudoscience to make a buck" angle. By the way, they are still marketing and selling the "ghost meter".

A boycott? Is the competition that you are driving their customers to have a better track record than Edmund in this issue?
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Yes. Last I checked, none of the other major science teaching equipment outlets had been marketing or selling "ghost detectors", remote viewing DVDs, "ESP lamps", or similar nonsense. But that was about a year ago when I last looked.
 
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Truly sad.

Back in the 60s when I was in grade school, they were a pretty good source of cool stuff. The founder died, and gradually things got flaky.
 
jayh said:
Truly sad.

Back in the 60s when I was in grade school, they were a pretty good source of cool stuff. The founder died, and gradually things got flaky.
Click to expand...

I used to go to sleep poring over Edmund's catalog, it really was a "dream book" for me.

As an evidently minority opinion, I see nothing wrong with their offering these items - is it not the true goal of Science to investigate ALL possibilities and sort out the truth from the dross? Wouldn't a truly skeptical person want to TEST such devices (random particle detector as a "number generator", etc.) to see if there were any truth to the claims of ESP influences on random processes? ISTR some prestigious university testing this very idea, using something called an "egg", many scattered around the world, and applying statistical analysis to find patterns.

Would it not be likely that students wishing to TEST for any truth in paranormal claims, so that the question could be put to rest, find it convenient to have ready-built devices, complete with descriptions of the CLAIMS made by the proponents?

I think these CAN serve a valuable purpose in the educational process, and that students could learn life-changing lessons. EVEN if someone starts out believing the claims have merit, Science will advance if they are forced to change their minds, in light of the negative results, and that IS part of Science - expecting one result, and finding that the Universe does not agree.

US$0.02

Cheers,

Dave
 
MattusMaximus said:
Man oh man :rolleyes:

There is a science teaching outlet named Edmund Scientific which is starting to go off the rails. Back in 2009, they started to sell all manner of goofy things: ghost detectors (which are actually just electromagnetic field meters) and even DVDs on remote viewing. And all of this from a science teaching catalog – you might as well turn to the biology section and see creationist materials for sale!

Well, not to be outdone in their tumble down the rabbit hole, Edmund (Pseudo)Scientific now has for sale an “ESP Lamp”. I kid you not – they claim this thing can actually read your thoughts… as in extra-sensory perception… as in psychic woo-woo… and it only costs about $200!

I think this calls for a boycott, folks.

Read on for more info
Click to expand...


When I travel to Chicago, I still visit their store.

As for ESP lamp and Ghost detector, meh. If your outrage meter is calibrated in such a way that these products make you call for a boycott, then I'd like to see a list of TV channels that are not on your boycott list.
 
Ladewig said:
When I travel to Chicago, I still visit their store.

As for ESP lamp and Ghost detector, meh. If your outrage meter is calibrated in such a way that these products make you call for a boycott, then I'd like to see a list of TV channels that are not on your boycott list.
Click to expand...

Ah! But that isn't Edmund Scientific here in Chicago!

Edmund is in NJ - Here we have American Science And Surplus which for many years had an agreement with Edmund to carry the whole Edmund catalog. AS&S is no longer affiliated with Edmund Scientific.

AS&S site; http://www.sciplus.com/
 
Ladewig said:
When I travel to Chicago, I still visit their store.

As for ESP lamp and Ghost detector, meh. If your outrage meter is calibrated in such a way that these products make you call for a boycott, then I'd like to see a list of TV channels that are not on your boycott list.
Click to expand...

The outrage is that it represents itself as, and indeed once was, a wonderful source of science education. It's the difference between the Enquirer publishing an article on ghosts, and Scientific American doing so.
 
jayh said:
The outrage is that it represents itself as, and indeed once was, a wonderful source of science education. It's the difference between the Enquirer publishing an article on ghosts, and Scientific American doing so.
Click to expand...

I re-read the EMF/ghost detector description again, and I will confess it is more irksome than I first thought. However, I still don't think it calls for a boycott.
 
jayh said:
The outrage is that it represents itself as, and indeed once was, a wonderful source of science education. It's the difference between the Enquirer publishing an article on ghosts, and Scientific American doing so.
Click to expand...

This ^

That is the key, right there. And that is why I recommend such a boycott.

Incidentally, some of the critics here make the mistake of assuming that I don’t actually show why it is that ghost meters detect nothing of the kind. I actually have lessons on why these things don’t detect ghosts, and I have, in fact, interacted with so called professional “ghost hunters” who – when I really put the hard questions to them – openly admit that there really isn’t any kind of scientific rigor behind their pseudoscience. In fact, you can read one of my detailed blog posts on the matter here – Convergence/Skepchicon Day 2: Ghost Hunting & Evidence Review

So I already show lessons on why ghost meters don't detect anything more than EMFs, AND I think people should boycott Edmund. That’s because there are responsible science catalogs out there who don’t give lip service to pseudoscience. Using the logic of some people here, we should be buying materials for biology class out of creationist catalogs because “it’ll show the students the creationists are wrong.” I’d rather show people the pseudoscientists/creationists are wrong AND not give them my money.
 
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