Creationism in my home town

[Ipecac]

Not surprising, really. This is conservative Indiana. But very depressing.

Front Page Article on Creationism and Evolution

Some great quotes from science teachers:

Amy Charlwood, biology teacher at Fairfield High School, said her interpretation of the state science standards is she can teach creationism in addition to evolution as long as she presents them both in a scientific manner.

Bruce Horein, science teacher at Jimtown Junior High, said he teaches evolution because it's in the state standards, and students are tested on these standards.

"But the way I present it to my students is, just because it is in the textbook doesn't mean it's the gospel truth," Horein said. "I am a Christian, and many of my kids are Christians. They will share their beliefs, and I will share my opinion. We do it as a discussion. I am not saying 'this is right or wrong.' I tell the kids you can believe whatever you want."

What an amazing thing for a science teacher to say.

But Larry Nafziger, principal of Wakarusa Elementary School, said when the subject of the world's origin does come up, his teachers teach creationism.

"We don't teach evolution at all," Nafziger reported. "It doesn't come up in our textbooks. Our teachers are conservative. When the subject does come up, they teach creationism, not evolution.

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

I hope Mr Horein doesn't take the same approach to chemistry class. "You know children, some scientists advise not mixing chlorine and ammonia, but you can believe whatever you want."

 

[Yaotl]

They should just rename textbooks with a subtitle "the Gospel Truth (so far as we know)" or something.

 

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

She urges them to talk to their parents. "I think it is natural for sixth-graders to start asking questions, but it is the job of the family to teach the theory that they believe," she said.

And that, my friends, is the unassailable state of affairs.

~~ Paul

 

[Gestahl]

Amy Charlwood, biology teacher at Fairfield High School, said her interpretation of the state science standards is she can teach creationism in addition to evolution as long as she presents them both in a scientific manner.

And how, exactly, would you teach creationism in a scientific manner? What falsifiable hypothesis that makes specific predicitons do we use?

That science teacher needs to be fired, simply because she obviously doesn't seem to even know what science *is*.

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

And how, exactly, would you teach creationism in a scientific manner? What falsifiable hypothesis that makes specific predicitons do we use?

Here's your scientific creationist experiment. Get a pile of dirt. Leave it on a lab table. Wait and see if God breathes life into it and makes a human.

 

[Ipecac]

And that, my friends, is the unassailable state of affairs.

~~ Paul

It's too bad more fundamentalists don't take this to heart, instead feeling compelled to push the public schools to teach the "theory" their religion chooses.

 

[Ipecac]

And how, exactly, would you teach creationism in a scientific manner?

I considered that maybe she was being clever and insinuating that creationism wouldn't stand up under such a comparison, but I think you're probably right in your analysis.

 

[tc399]

We of the religious right choose to believe the Bible.

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=4140&hl=

I had a student ask me, "Could the savior you believe in save Osama bin Laden?"
Of course. We know the blood of Jesus Christ can save him, and then he must be executed.
-- Rev. Jerry Falwell


The "wall of separation between church and state" is a metaphor based on bad history,
a metaphor which has proved useless as a guide to judging.
It should be frankly and explicitly abandoned.
-- William Rehnquist, Supreme Court


I want you to just let a wave of intolerance wash over you. I want you to let a wave of hatred wash over you.
Yes, hate is good.... Our goal is a Christian nation. We have a Biblical duty, we are called by God,
to conquer this country. We don't want equal time. We don't want pluralism."
--Randall Terry, quoted in The News-Sentinel, Fort Wayne, Indiana, August 16, 1993


We have no king but Jesus.
--John Ashcroft, May 8, 1999


We're going to bring back God and the Bible and drive the gods of secular
humanism right out of the public schools of America.
--Pat Buchanan, at an anti-gay rally in Des Moines, Iowa, February 11, 1996


The idea that religion and politics don't mix was invented by
the Devil to keep Christians from running their own country.
-- Rev. Jerry Falwell


After the Christian majority takes control, pluralism will be seen as immoral and evil
and the state will not permit anybody the right to practice evil.
--Gary Potter, president of catlicks for Christian Political Action


The Christian community has a golden opportunity to train an army of dedicated teachers
who can invade the public school classrooms and use them to influence the nation for Christ.
--D. James Kennedy, Coral Ridge Ministries, 1993


The Constitution of the United States, for instance, is a marvelous document for self-government by the Christian people.
But the minute you turn the document into the hands of non-Christian people and atheistic people they can use it to
destroy the very foundation of our society. And that's what's been happening.
--Pat Robertson


The feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is about a socialist, anti-family political movement that
encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism, and become lesbians.
--Pat Robertson


I think we ought to close Halloween down. Do you want your children to dress up as witches?
The Druids used to dress up like this when they were doing human sacrifice...
[Your children] are acting out Satanic rituals and participating in it, and don't even realize it.
--Pat Robertson


Get the few liberals out. If you don't do it, it ain't gonna be done.
You will be doing the Lord's work, and he will richly bless you for it.
--Sen. James Inhofe, R-Oklahoma, Christian Coalition's Road to Victory Conference, 2002, Washington D.C


If I do not return to the pulpit this weekend, millions of people will go to hell.
-- Jimmy Swaggart

 

[IIRichard]

I hope Mr Horein doesn't take the same approach to chemistry class. "You know children, some scientists advise not mixing chlorine and ammonia, but you can believe whatever you want."

When I mix chlorine and ammonia, I get ammonium chloride, white smoke. What do you get?

 

[tc399]

What happens when

you mix bottled chlorine bleach in equal parts with chlorine pool tablets?

 

[Marquis de Carabas]

When I mix chlorine and ammonia, I get ammonium chloride, white smoke. What do you get?

Pardon my imprecision, but I believed the correct implication was there. I should have said "You know children, some scientists advise not inhaling or swallowing a mix of chlorine and ammonia, but you can believe whatever you want."

Better?

 

[Renfield]

"Amy Charlwood, biology teacher at Fairfield High School, said her interpretation of the state science standards is she can teach creationism in addition to evolution as long as she presents them both in a scientific manner."

this one gave me a good laugh. How do you teach that an all powerful being in the sky mystically conjured up life as we know it in a SCIENTIFIC way?

 

[Yahweh]

"Amy Charlwood, biology teacher at Fairfield High School, said her interpretation of the state science standards is she can teach creationism in addition to evolution as long as she presents them both in a scientific manner."

this one gave me a good laugh. How do you teach that an all powerful being in the sky mystically conjured up life as we know it in a SCIENTIFIC way?

Reminds me of the old Harris cartoon:

 

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

Renfield said:
this one gave me a good laugh. How do you teach that an all powerful being in the sky mystically conjured up life as we know it in a SCIENTIFIC way?

You do what Dembski does: You calculate the probabilities that life could have arisen by all possible naturalistic causes. If the probabilites are all less than 10^150, then life is "complex." Then you note that life is specified. Now you have complex specified information in life. So therefore it must have been designed.

You don't think any teachers would have problems teaching this, do you? Here's a sample teacher:

~~ Paul

 

[KillerBob]

"But the way I present it to my students is, just because it is in the textbook doesn't mean it's the gospel truth," Horein said.

I have to agree with him here. The theory of evolution isn't the gospel truth, it's much more reliable than that...

 

[Ralph]

I just recieved Penn & Tellers "Bulls##t" on DVD. When I got home from work last night I wound up watching the 1st 3 episodes ("Talking to the Dead---Medical Quackery--and Alien Abduction".

I loved it and it popped into my head that this would be a great thing to show high school students. My own kids have a few wooish ideas (as I did at that age) and I think a sceptics perspective on these things would be invaluable.

Of course with the profanity & the typical Penn & Teller showmanship----this would never happen.

Personally--I'd applaud a teacher who had the courage to show this to his students.

On the other hand--If they had a teacher who taught creation theory INSTEAD of evolution----we would be having a long & very serious talk about his teaching methods.

 

[spectacle]

I just recieved Penn & Tellers "Bulls##t" on DVD. When I got home from work last night I wound up watching the 1st 3 episodes ("Talking to the Dead---Medical Quackery--and Alien Abduction".

I loved it and it popped into my head that this would be a great thing to show high school students. My own kids have a few wooish ideas (as I did at that age) and I think a sceptics perspective on these things would be invaluable.

Of course with the profanity & the typical Penn & Teller showmanship----this would never happen.

Personally--I'd applaud a teacher who had the courage to show this to his students.

On the other hand--If they had a teacher who taught creation theory INSTEAD of evolution----we would be having a long & very serious talk about his teaching methods.

you could show it in private schools, or some teacher who has the balls to pass something like this along w/ simple permission slip forms... of course the teacher would have to lie on these, but if i were a teacher i would take the risk

 

[arthwollipot]

I've shown Bulls##t to a 12-year old, after talking to him and explaining what it was about. I also wouldn't hesitate to show it to my 9-year old kids.

Not episode 6 Sex, sex, sex though. I'd wait until they were about 15.