Consensus of Stromfront

[Jono]

It's a good list of suggestions, but honestly, if they were capable of doing those things(thinking, avoiding hypocracy), they wouldn't be antis.

Honestly, though, I'd love to see some smart, articulate antis who think for themselves(instead of parroting the same old arguments that were discounted decades ago). One of the reasons I like the Opposing Views forum is the ammuntion it gives me for arguments in the real world. I like seeing pro-White views presented in new ways that I hadn't thought of, so that the next time I'm talking to an actual White person, I can really open their eyes. Seeing debates with antis provides a lot of helpful information, but unfortunaltly, when the antis are as dense as they almost always are, it stops being useful.

There must be some smart antis out there. In my life, I can think of maybe one that I've met. Debating the pathetic antis that come here is a battle of wits with unarmed opponents.

Sadly the are very few "antis" on Stormfront with an education to be able to counter argue their take on IQ, eugenics, politics, general science, WW2 and the Holocaust, general history, philosohpy, Gandhi etc etc.

There are also a lot of "fence sitters" therein who, as the WN themselves, see little argument from the vast majority of the "antis" posting there.

I percieve this nuissance as more derogitory to this world than the common "woo".

 

[WildCat]

Like many other message boards w/ a woo agenda, they are quick to ban anyone from posting who doesn't agree w/ them. So don't expect to see many "anti" postings there. Luke T used to post there quite a bit (under the name tekul), but IIRC he couldn't be too critical, or risk being banned. I don't know if he still does, that kind of thing can take a lot out of you.

 

[Jono]

Like many other message boards w/ a woo agenda, they are quick to ban anyone from posting who doesn't agree w/ them. So don't expect to see many "anti" postings there. Luke T used to post there quite a bit (under the name tekul), but IIRC he couldn't be too critical, or risk being banned. I don't know if he still does, that kind of thing can take a lot out of you

Well sure enough though in my experience this is somewhat of an exageration.
I've been a member there since about march this year and have poster highly critical posts.

I've been warned quite a few times for use though not banned as of yet heh

Well, if one keeps the argument to facts, giving sources and sharing personal experience it is not alarm.
There are rules that are to be followed by all in those forums and I've seen WN's being banned as well.

Avoiding slander, ad hominems etc one should be able to hack their arguments, given one has the proper knowledge, education in the matter of course.

 

[plindboe]

I haven't been there a while as I haven't got the time or interest for the moment. I also prefer to read the Bell Curve, the Mismeasure of man and other such books before I return, otherwise there are some of them I can't engage in debating.

But it would be nice with some more good "antis" there, and I can only recommend people to check the place out. Just remember to express yourself carefully, and your posts will not be censured. There's a doublestandard though as the wn's are allowed to call you just about anything, but that only makes it challeging and takes some skill and practice to master.

 

[RandFan]

Too much for me. I've tried woo-woo sites and I just don't have the patience. It's not impossible but damn hard. Further somethings are just too disturbing for me.

 

[Roadtoad]

I read through the Stormfront site, and was going to join Luke there, but frankly, the more I read, the more it scared the absolute f*** out of me. That crowd is far beyond "woo." They're not even borderline; they're flat out psychotic.

 

[Jono]

I haven't been there a while as I haven't got the time or interest for the moment. I also prefer to read the Bell Curve, the Mismeasure of man and other such books before I return, otherwise there are some of them I can't engage in debating.

Yes, I havent recieved the Gould book yet. Want to get a hold of some of Dawkins and Lewontin's books as well.

The swedish affiliates of Mensa doesn't hold The Bell Curve to be very precise or scientific by todays standars as so... at least that is what they told me... though I haven't read it as of yet.

But it would be nice with some more good "antis" there, and I can only recommend people to check the place out. Just remember to express yourself carefully, and your posts will not be censured. There's a doublestandard though as the wn's are allowed to call you just about anything, but that only makes it challeging and takes some skill and practice to master.

Yes I completely agree. Rough seas make for good sailors.

And indeed there is a doublestandard, though I've seen WN's getting banned for being too "full of it".

 

[geni]

Other than keeping a vague eye on them to cheack if they are planning any off site activities I see nothing to be gaining by going there.

 

[Dr Adequate]

There must be some smart antis out there.

I wonder if there are any statistics on the relationship between IQ and racism. Perhaps you could ask.

 

[Chaos]

Other than keeping a vague eye on them to cheack if they are planning any off site activities I see nothing to be gaining by going there.

True. Might as well talk to a wall - except that the wall doesn´t insult you for it.

 

[Jono]

From Dr Adequate: I wonder if there are any statistics on the relationship between IQ and racism. Perhaps you could ask.

Good question
I will try to insert it somewhere in a topic or in chat.
Though for the question not to digress I think it has to be formulated with "WN" instead of racism.

But the KKK and IQ in my experience is prone to become a contridiction within terms, that is if one assumes that there is any abundance of IQ in the KKK heywork (southern comprehension of network).
lol

 

[plindboe]

Other than keeping a vague eye on them to cheack if they are planning any off site activities I see nothing to be gaining by going there.

I think it's important, because it's not only a fight against irrationality but also against hate. As skeptics we usually just deal with the first issue, but when combined with a perhaps even more important issue, then it's certainly worth the time. Sure there are the ones whose minds can never be changed, but like with any belief system, there are the fencesitters, most probably just lurking the boards.

 

[Luke T.]

I read through the Stormfront site, and was going to join Luke there, but frankly, the more I read, the more it scared the absolute f*** out of me. That crowd is far beyond "woo." They're not even borderline; they're flat out psychotic.

The WNs who debate in the Opposing Views section of the forum (which is the only place "Antis" are allowed to post) are of a higher order than the usual racist psycho. And the Moderator/Admin team is extremely careful to weed out the real psychos. I have seen them ban just as many fellow rascists as antis.

I have not posted there in over a year, but I stopped in this past weekend to take a look around and see if my account is still active. It is.

There is an announcement there that the Associated Press has informed Stormfront that they (Stormfront) are not to post a single sentence from any AP story or else face a lawsuit. Seems like a violation of "fair use" to me.

Because of this alleged notice, any Anti who posts anything from the AP is subject to immediate banning.

Don't be afraid to post there. It is an outstanding exercise in debating skills. A good way to test your meddle and see if you are a skeptic who posts from emotion or reason. Nowhere else do you have to keep your cool more than at Stormfront.

Their complaint about not encountering any intelligent antis is an old one, and they are full of crap. I am not that smart and knocked a few out of the ballpark in my first few posts. When they encounter anyone of intelligence, the moderator MuadDib begins to look for excuses to ban them.

Like I said. An outstanding exercise.

Frankly, I think if a slew of halfway intelligent antis showed up all at once on Stormfront, they would be so overwhelmed, they would probably shut down the Opposing Views section forever. Just to maintain their belief there are no smart antis out there.

 

[Luke T.]

I wonder if there are any statistics on the relationship between IQ and racism. Perhaps you could ask.

Don't make any assumptions about WNs. Some of the WNs who post in Opposing Views are not stupid by any means. The smarter ones rarely display hatred or any emotion at all and will give you a run for your money.

Look folks, if you are really all about "education", then you will certainly learn a lot at Stormfront. A lot about yourself, and a lot about White Nationalism. Don't assume your preconceived notions are correct. Just think about what some people think when they hear the word "skeptic," or "atheist."

 

[plindboe]

Don't make any assumptions about WNs. Some of the WNs who post in Opposing Views are not stupid by any means. The smarter ones rarely display hatred or any emotion at all and will give you a run for your money.

Look folks, if you are really all about "education", then you will certainly learn a lot at Stormfront. A lot about yourself, and a lot about White Nationalism. Don't assume your preconceived notions are correct. Just think about what some people think when they hear the word "skeptic," or "atheist."

I agree completely. Some of them are in fact quite intelligent, and it's certainly more difficult debating there than on a supernatural board, as some of them can provide good arguments and point out logical fallacies. But that's what makes it the more interesting, as it's not simply providing a single link or pointing out a flaw and saying "debunked" as can be done on many supernatural boards. Highly recommended, but only when you are in the right mood.

 

[Jono]

From plindboe: I agree completely. Some of them are in fact quite intelligent, and it's certainly more difficult debating there than on a supernatural board, as some of them can provide good arguments and point out logical fallacies. But that's what makes it the more interesting, as it's not simply providing a single link or pointing out a flaw and saying "debunked" as can be done on many supernatural boards. Highly recommended, but only when you are in the right mood.

Indeed plindboe, my sentiments as well.

I'm practicly always on discussion forums of various sorts.
I've learned a lot about the conduct of my thought process and especially in others.
Patterns of such are newer few or far between.

Also as Luke.T and plindboe pointed out it is a rough storm that make for good sailors, honing your debating skills like nothing of the sort.
There are several WN's there that are very intellectual and well educated.

Naturally, the WN's make their lifetime effort in routing out weaknesses and flaws in the arguments/facts of their opposition.
Many of them have years and years of experience in this manner... not that many regular people who engage in debate with them have had a counter equal effort.
Therefore a lot of "fencesitters" there becomes easily pursuaded by the enormous floura of WN argument/literature/facts on debunking history, politics and fields of science... even people such as Gandhi, Martin Luther King etc.

I have much experience of debating with hardcore christians, as a result I learned a lot about christianity but also much on irrational thought and as well as hate/fear and prejudice.

Though at Stormfront it is different, it's vastly more difficult but more important!

What if these were efforts that could slowly stop a new "reich" from creeping up from the past again?

Though one wants to debate safely and more swiftly, then supernatural boards are the ideal.

Furthermore there is a huge variety of WN's there, generally unified by their subjective 14 Words dogma:

"We must secure the existance of our people and a future for white children -- David Lane"

 

[Luke T.]

Therefore a lot of "fencesitters" there becomes easily pursuaded by the enormous floura of WN argument/literature/facts on debunking history, politics and fields of science... even people such as Gandhi, Martin Luther King etc.

Fencesitters are tabula rasa. Blank slates. Makes the need for the Anti voice all the more urgent.

Though one wants to debate safely and more swiftly, then supernatural boards are the ideal.

After Stormfront, supernatural boards feel like nursery school.

Furthermore there is a huge variety of WN's there, generally unified by their subjective 14 Words dogma:

"We must secure the existance of our people and a future for white children -- David Lane"

Right. I learned a lot of symbolism and catchphrases which I now see in everyday real life that I never noticed before. Tatoos. Choice of clothing. Hiding in plain sight. A real eye opener.

You should see some of the stuff the neo-nazis broadcast on our local cable access channel. Unbelievable.