Ed Compulsory insurance for gun owners.

[Ranb]

https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/2546/text

This bill would make it unlawful for a person in the USA to buy or sell a gun unless the person receiving the gun has qualifying insurance and the seller verifies coverage. It does not apply to the sale of a gun to the US government. Violators may have to pay a $10,000 fine.

Qualified insurance is;

liability insurance covering the purchaser specifically for losses resulting from use of the firearm while it is owned by the purchaser

A person is defined in the US code as;

the term “person” and the term “whoever” include any individual, corporation, company, association, firm, partnership, society, or joint stock company.

I suppose government agencies are already covered by insurance of a sort. Government agencies just soak the taxpayers for payouts when they hand out guns to their employees who use them to assault or murder the people they are expected to protect.

The rest of us would be required to obtain insurance to cover the bad things that may be done with those guns. Would a thief be considered the owner of a gun they steal? Would I be liable for the misuse of a gun when I no longer have possession?

Are there any countries that require liability insurance be bought by gun owners to cover misuse of a firearm?

Ranb

 

[Giordano]

I suspect from your other posts that you have other points that you are trying to make here. But liability insurance is currently mandatory in most states to own a car. The ownership and responsibility issues you bring up are likely to be the same. In California I am responsible for the use of my automobile if I loan it or give it willingly to someone else, but I am not responsible if it is stolen.

 

[Dr. Keith]

If gun owners are to be believed it should cost almost nothing, since guns do almost no damage, on average.

 

[Giordano]

It is an interesting idea. I suppose the Constitutional question is if such mandatory insurance is so expensive as to preclude a significant number of people from gun ownership. Something for the courts to resolve.

However, as Dr. Keith points out, it should be quite inexpensive given its low risk. Gun ownership might even (from what I've read here) give you a discount on your property, health, and life insurance because of its protective effects.

 

[BStrong]

https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/2546/text

This bill would make it unlawful for a person in the USA to buy or sell a gun unless the person receiving the gun has qualifying insurance and the seller verifies coverage. It does not apply to the sale of a gun to the US government. Violators may have to pay a $10,000 fine.

Qualified insurance is;

A person is defined in the US code as;

I suppose government agencies are already covered by insurance of a sort. Government agencies just soak the taxpayers for payouts when they hand out guns to their employees who use them to assault or murder the people they are expected to protect.

The rest of us would be required to obtain insurance to cover the bad things that may be done with those guns. Would a thief be considered the owner of a gun they steal? Would I be liable for the misuse of a gun when I no longer have possession?

Are there any countries that require liability insurance be bought by gun owners to cover misuse of a firearm?

Ranb

Interesting twist on keeping the unwashed masses away from firearms whilst allowing their betters to be armed.

In California we already have a version of this wrt concealed carry - in most counties it's mandatory to have a 1 million dollar liability policy as one of the prerequisites for issuance of the carry license.

Kind of keeps renters out of the concealed carry demographic.

I predict failure to launch on this one.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Liability Insurance for Swimming Pools Explained

 

[Ranb]

I suspect from your other posts that you have other points that you are trying to make here.

Not really. I am most interested in whether or not other countries have a scheme like this. I don't think this will bill pass.

But liability insurance is currently mandatory in most states to own a car.

As far as I know a person does not need insurance to simply own a car but they do need it to drive it on public roads.

Ranb

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

As far as I know a person does not need insurance to simply own a car but they do need it to drive it on public roads.

Ranb

In every state I've inquired about* you need liability insurance to register a car. Small difference, but lawyers love that ****.

On the griping hand I own an M113 that isn't insured or registered. And may never be. Next person to inherit it can make up their own mind on that.



*I mentioned elsewhere I worked with auto accident claims in the past.

 

[Ranb]

In every state I've inquired about* you need liability insurance to register a car. Small difference, but lawyers love that ****.

Not in WA if I read this link correctly;
http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/insurance.html

If you drive a vehicle that is required to be registered in Washington State, you must have one of the following:

Auto insurance
Self insurance
Certificate of deposit
Liability bond

You don’t need to have insurance when you operate a vehicle registered as any of the following:
Motorcycle. (RCW 46.04.330) Motor-driven cycle. (RCW 46.04.332) Moped. (RCW 46.04.304) Horseless carriage over 40 years old (RCW 46.18.255) State or publicly-owned vehicle. (RCW 46.16.020) Common or contract carrier with the Washington Utilities and Transportation Commission.

Ranb

 

[marplots]

Not in WA if I read this link correctly;
http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/insurance.html


Ranb

And marijuana is legal there now, right?
Please tell me there's at least a helmet law for motorcyclists?

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Not in WA if I read this link correctly;
http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/insurance.html


Ranb

Variations on a theme there. You have to show that you're financial covered for any liability you incur during the operation of a motor vehicle. (And things may have changed in the past years, of course.)

 

[Ranb]

Pot is legal here. No interest in it other than I might try a pot brownie someday just to see what the fuss is about. Probably wait until I retire from my shipyard job as I'm not supposed to indulge while employed by the feds

There is a helmet law; don't need a helmet law to keep covered though. At least once a month I get a rock or other debris thrown into my face shield while riding. A helmet that covers the ears is more comfortable than ear plugs. It was only a full face helmet that kept me from needing a face transplant when I hit a deer doing 55mph.

I stay insured on my bike too. Damaged two vehicles in my first bad accident on a bike.

Ranb

 

[Trebuchet]

And marijuana is legal there now, right?
Please tell me there's at least a helmet law for motorcyclists?

There is. And bicyclists in many municipalities. They also don't let the motorcyclists ride up between the lanes on the freeway, as in California.

The likelihood of a federal gun insurance law passing, or even making it out of committee, is slim to none, and slim just left town. Just another congresscritter making a point for the faithful, similar to the R's fifty or so bills to overturn Obamacare.

 

[RussDill]

Oi, imagine the insanity if for every potentially dangerous thing you owned, you needed a rider of some sort. Want to own a ladder? Better prove coverage at the checkout! Anyway, insurance companies aren't dumb, they have certain policies, restrictions, and riders already for particularly high risk situations. Trampolines, pools, tree houses, etc.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Oi, imagine the insanity if for every potentially dangerous thing you owned, you needed a rider of some sort. Want to own a ladder? Better prove coverage at the checkout! Anyway, insurance companies aren't dumb, they have certain policies, restrictions, and riders already for particularly high risk situations. Trampolines, pools, tree houses, etc.

Luckily, personal liability insurance is available. Or we can sky it out and just hope we never have a disastrous insurance loss.

 

[Ranb]

Maybe some sort of broad form insurance then?

Ranb

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Maybe some sort of broad form insurance then?

Ranb

PLUP, Personal Liability Umbrella Policy. Sold in increments of $1,000,000 IIRC. I know I signed a check for $1,300,000 once, auto policy limits and a PLUP. Insured 13 year old son got into the family car and lost control of it, destroying a business. And himself.

 

[Giordano]

PLUP, Personal Liability Umbrella Policy. Sold in increments of $1,000,000 IIRC. I know I signed a check for $1,300,000 once, auto policy limits and a PLUP. Insured 13 year old son got into the family car and lost control of it, destroying a business. And himself.

Having children of my own, I can only hope I am misreading this. Was it a type of destruction from which he recovered?

 

[Cain]

In theory, I'd like to be the kind of guy who rides a motorcycle, carries a gun, and smokes the Devil's Lettuce. I don't really need those things because I have a badass beard.

 

[Fizil]

PLUP, Personal Liability Umbrella Policy. Sold in increments of $1,000,000 IIRC. I know I signed a check for $1,300,000 once, auto policy limits and a PLUP. Insured 13 year old son got into the family car and lost control of it, destroying a business. And himself.

Umbrella policies are also usually pretty cheap aren't they? My only experience is with commercial lines, but just a quick look at the numbers shows me that something like $2 mill Umbrella on $1 mill underlying is only about 7 cents of Umbrella premium for every $1 of underlying premium. The next million of Umbrella is only 5 cents per $1 more. The maximum any of my current clients allow is $10 mil/$1 mil, which is 27 cents per $1 of underlying premium.