Casuistry: The Good Pedophile?

[Dr Adequate]

This has bugged me since I read about it. This really happened in the UK a few years back, but I don't have references.

However, the facts are undisputed. This story goes like this.

A guy was found by the police to have hardcore child pornography on his computer. He admitted that he did, and that he was sexually attracted to little girls.

That should make it an open and shut case, you would think.

However, his defense lawyer proved to the court (and this too is not disputed as fact) that:

(1) Every single one of those "hardcore images" was a fake image (produced using photoshop or what-have you).

(2) His client knew that, and had specially looked for fake images and avoided real images like the plague (as shown by analysis of the data on his computer).

[The outcome of the trial, by the way, was that the accused was found guilty according to the appropriate laws. This is by the by.]

Now, here's a riddle to untie, and here's a tale to unfold. On this showing, is he a good man or a bad man?

Discuss.

 

[Ceritus]

A Man......

If he never acted out on any of his urges and only observed or created fake child porn pics than what is the problem if he only used it for private use? Even IF he was looking at real child porn pictures why should he be getting in trouble if he did not create them or fund them? If I look a pictures of dead bodies does that make me a murderer?

 

[Dogdoctor]

A pedophile is a pedophile. If he tries to avoid arrest by keeping only fake pictures of kids he is still a pedophile.

 

[Dr Adequate]

Ladies and gentlemen --- behold --- two completely incompatible views.

Let the games begin.

 

[Bjorn]

A pedophile is a pedophile. If he tries to avoid arrest by keeping only fake pictures of kids he is still a pedophile.

Let's imagine I'm not turned on by young girls, but turned on by older girls pretending to be young girls. Am I a pedophile, "still" a pedophile, or not even close?

 

[Ceritus]

A pedophile is a pedophile. If he tries to avoid arrest by keeping only fake pictures of kids he is still a pedophile.

So then if you play video games where you shoot other people than you are a murderous person and a threat to society?

Or could you be playing these games because you are having fun with them but would never go out and kill someone else.... Which would be the same in my eyes if this person masterbates to pictures of children as long as he does not harm these children or take pictures himself of these children or give money to anyone who does than he has done nothing wrong. For those who play first person shooters you fund the people who make these games!!!!!

I love first person shooters I find them entertaining but the thought of really killing someone appauls me.

I look at it alot like calling lightning within 5SM. If there is no lightning within 5SM the warning is not issued, when there is lightning within 5SM the warning is issued sometimes the first strike is on the base hurting or killing an individual which is unfortunate. If this person is like a Towering Cumulus cloud he is not officially a Thunderstorm (threat) until it produces lightning (Takes, Funds Child pornography or abuses a child himself). Just because it appears he is heading down the road to child molestation or child porn producer does not mean he is one and he should not be treated as one.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Or what if someone mistakenly thinks they're looking at a child, but it actually turns out to be Emmanuel Lewis or a young-looking person who's actually quite old or someone with that disorder that's the reverse of progeria? In that case they think they're committing a crime, have the intent to commit a crime, but are not committing a crime because of mere accident.

 

[Z]

The fantasy is still there, even if the practicioner is careful and 'faking it'.

At the heart of it, I suppose most men are genetically predisposed toward younger women; what I don't understand is an attraction to women so young as to be infertile. Or young boys.

But dressing adults up as children, as schoolgirls; making them wear diapers, or shave, or call them 'Daddy'... Well, it's pedophilic fantasy, regardless of the mode of enactment.

And that's probably where the line has to be set: how far does someone with this interest go to fulfill that interest? I'm all for a healthy sexual fantasy life; but just how much is 'too much'?

I think pedophilia is a very bad thing, when it's acted upon; and I think there are very fine lines, for some people, between looking at doctored photos, and looking at real photos, and then between looking and creating.

Slippery slope? Perhaps.

All I know is, if you're not SURE they're legal, you probably just shouldn't bother with it.

 

[Dogdoctor]

Let's imagine I'm not turned on by young girls, but turned on by older girls pretending to be young girls. Am I a pedophile, "still" a pedophile, or not even close?

This guy admitted to being a pedophile.

 

[Ceritus]

This guy admitted to being a pedophile.

But did he admit to harming anyone else?

ped·o·phile ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pd-fl, pd-)
n.
An adult who is sexually attracted to a child or children.

He seems to be locked up for a thought crime.



So the next time you or anyone fantasizes about killing your boss or your mother in law you should describe yourselves as murderous?

I see nothing wrong with a persons bilogical imperitive to be attracted to children as long as they do not act out in such a way that they harm said children or fund the harming of said children.

For the record though I think child pornography is disgusting and people who take these pictures or fund the taking of these pictures should be behind bars. No child deserve to go though such an ordeal. Regardless of what I feel the line is simple. Were any children harmed in the making of these fake photos and if so did he fun the people harming these children or harm them himself if not he should be a free man.

 

[Dogdoctor]

At the heart of it, I suppose most men are genetically predisposed toward younger women; what I don't understand is an attraction to women so young as to be infertile. Or young boys.

I am not so sure that is correct. I think men who are interested in younger women are often losers who like younger women because they are easier to manipulate. I always liked older women and rarely had younger girlfriends or even the same age as me for that matter however now from an aesthetic point of view women older than me now are most often not so beautiful as those younger than me (though I still think Grace Slick is a fox). Well I guess from this you aren't a pedophile.

It sounds like he admitted to being a pedophile. That is the end of discussion as far as I am concerned. I am not sure of the laws but if he admitted to being a pedophile that should be enough to convict him.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Is it a crime to be a pedophile? Or does someone have to commit a pedophiliac act like molestation or assault or rape or kidnapping first?

 

[Ceritus]

I am not so sure that is correct. I think men who are interested in younger women are often losers who like younger women because they are easier to manipulate.

Even if they are losers this is still an imperitive within them that enables them a way to reproduce. Just because you are not diabetic and do not have to take insulin does not mean no one needs to take insulin.

I know I personally like an older mentality in women but with a younger looking body. Finding both is a rarity but when I do find them I cherrish them.

 

[Dogdoctor]

Or what if someone mistakenly thinks they're looking at a child, but it actually turns out to be Emmanuel Lewis or a young-looking person who's actually quite old or someone with that disorder that's the reverse of progeria? In that case they think they're committing a crime, have the intent to commit a crime, but are not committing a crime because of mere accident.

Wait a minute I was attracted to Emmanuel Lewis (joke) I am not familiar with the law. However I know a little about pedophiles and that is they are going to molest kids whether or not they play around with pornography. If someone admits to wanting to molest kids that should be enough to get him some help or remove him from society so he can't harm anyone.

 

[Ceritus]

I want to take over the world, should I be removed from society?

 

[TragicMonkey]

Wait a minute I was attracted to Emmanuel Lewis (joke) I am not familiar with the law. However I know a little about pedophiles and that is they are going to molest kids whether or not they play around with pornography. If someone admits to wanting to molest kids that should be enough to get him some help or remove him from society so he can't harm anyone.

Even if he knows it's wrong? And is telling this to a psychiatrist that he's gone to for help with this matter?

If we lock people up for desires they have, against their will, in their heads, and never act on....well, those are thought crimes. Invent a mind reading device, and use it on everybody. Detect them early, when they're still children themselves, and lock them up for life because of what they might do.

It's kind of difficult, under the law, to convict people because there's a chance they might commit a crime in the future. Especially since that applies to everybody.

 

[TragicMonkey]

I want to take over the world, should I be removed from society?

No, you should be sent as delegate to the UN. You'd fit in there.


Pssst. Your sig...you've misspelled "Friedrich". But I always call him "Freddy".

 

[Dogdoctor]

Even if they are losers this is still an imperitive within them that enables them a way to reproduce. Just because you are not diabetic and do not have to take insulin does not mean no one needs to take insulin.

Do losers need a way to reproduce? Ok just as long as they are of age.

I know I personally like an older mentality in women but with a younger looking body. Finding both is a rarity but when I do find them I cherrish them.

Yup

 

[Dogdoctor]

Even if he knows it's wrong? And is telling this to a psychiatrist that he's gone to for help with this matter?

If we lock people up for desires they have, against their will, in their heads, and never act on....well, those are thought crimes. Invent a mind reading device, and use it on everybody. Detect them early, when they're still children themselves, and lock them up for life because of what they might do.

It's kind of difficult, under the law, to convict people because there's a chance they might commit a crime in the future. Especially since that applies to everybody.

This is not an innocent person needing protection from the law. This is a person who admitted to wanting to molest young girls and he was found with illegal pornography (apparently since we have no other data) end of story. Lock his rear up.

 

[Piscivore]

This discussion is interesting, as I just finished reading Lolita.

Is there a difference in your mind between someone attracted to children that have acheived puberty but are legally below the age of consent, and those that are attracted to pre-pubescent children?

What is your opinion about written fantasies involving underage persons? is there a difference between explicit text involving underage persons written for the author's personal use, and that written for public consumption? How about works intended to be purely purient vs. those in literature, like Lolita? How explicit is "too explicit?"

I have a pressing professional interest in this last block of questions.