Cartoon riots are still spreading in Pakistan

[richardm]

Police in Peshawar in north-western Pakistan used teargas and batons to beat back protesters after they set fire to a KFC fast food outlet and ransacked it.
...
Yousuf Pervez, deputy medical superintendent at Lady Reading Hospital in Peshawar, told AFP: "We have received the bodies of two people, an eight-year-old boy and a 28-year-old man."
...
The office of a Norwegian mobile phone company is reported to have been attacked.
In the eastern city of Lahore Islamic students took to the streets despite a ban on public protests imposed in the province of Punjab.Police used teargas to disperse the protesters and then opened fire. One person has been killed.

Another violent demonstration has broken out in the town of Tank, near the Iranian border. A policeman was injured when some protesters opened fire indiscriminately. Eyewitnesses say more than 20 shops selling video and audio CDs have been attacked and set ablaze.

The BBC's Zaffar Abbas in Islamabad says there are indications that the protests are gradually spreading to large parts of the country.

Emphasis mine, article from The BBC. A Nuclear equipped country facing a possible extremist Muslim insurrection? Great.

I recall somebody a week or two ago (I've looked for the post and can't find it) saying that it was too soon to worry, because the sort of flag-burning we'd been seeing was par for the course for many of the countries involved. I wonder if it's time to start worrying yet?

 

[Darat]

Don't forget it is only comparatively recently that Pakistan has been anything but one of the nasty bogeymen. Of course I've always put our change of view about Pakistan down to the fact that the ruthless dictator was overthrown and a representative government came into power.... what you mean I just dreamed that?

Pakistan having nuclear weapons is I believe a danger that for some reason does not come into many discussions - yet it is a military dictatorship on top of a "fundamentalist Islamic country" - in fact it is everything that people seem to be scared about in regards to Iran yet we don't hear (today) people saying military action should be taken to remove its nuclear capability.

 

[richardm]

Pakistan ... is everything that people seem to be scared about in regards to Iran yet we don't hear (today) people saying military action should be taken to remove its nuclear capability.

I guess - and I could be wrong - that this is because Pakistan already has nuclear weapons and can't be safely disarmed. Iran doesn't have them yet - but wants them, I suspect mostly because it knows that if it does get them then it'll be in the same boat as Pakistan (et al).

FWIW I think the situation in Pakistan is a rather worrying at the moment. If Musharraf found himself pushed out - and if his soldiers keep firing on crowds that might happen - then I can easily see the uneasy situation between Pakistan and India going out of control, which is a very unhappy thought. It would be easy to characterise it as "Oh well, it's just a burned-out KFC" but I worry that it's symptomatic of a growing anti-Western trend in Pakistan that will lead inexorably to a more general anti-General trend (if you catch my drift!), since he's seen as being in cahoots with the West. And indeed, quite possibly anti-Islamic, since he's been cracking down on the Madrassas lately as well.

 

[NeilC]

Would it be unfair to say that countries full of uneducated, volatile religious zealots require a ruthless dictator?

 

[Darat]

I guess - and I could be wrong - that this is because Pakistan already has nuclear weapons and can't be safely disarmed. Iran doesn't have them yet - but wants them, I suspect mostly because it knows that if it does get them then it'll be in the same boat as Pakistan (et al).

Oh I was being at least slightly facetious with my comments. But at the time Pakistan was developing them (and India) even though the two countries were sporadically "at war" with one another the level of hysteria seemed muted compared to today. You'd almost think at least one major superpower wasn't too bothered about Islamic fundamentalists getting hold of nuclear weapons... (sorry can't help it today!)

FWIW I think the situation in Pakistan is a rather worrying at the moment. If Musharraf found himself pushed out - and if his soldiers keep firing on crowds that might happen - then I can easily see the uneasy situation between Pakistan and India going out of control, which is a very unhappy thought.

His position does look quite precarious however I think he is OK for the moment because there isn't a united opposition to him - there is as much fighting between the different factions as there is between him and those factions. He's managed so far to keep it that way - he does always have an "ace up his sleeve" he can start to make threatening noises toward India and since that is the big local bogeyman for many Pakistani's he can use that to deflect anger away from himself.

Mind you if he is assassinated or just dies I reckon at the moment there is a good chance the country will fall into chaos - and that is a very frightening thought.

It would be easy to characterise it as "Oh well, it's just a burned-out KFC" but I worry that it's symptomatic of a growing anti-Western trend in Pakistan that will lead inexorably to a more general anti-General trend (if you catch my drift!), since he's seen as being in cahoots with the West. And indeed, quite possibly anti-Islamic, since he's been cracking down on the Madrassas lately as well.

I agree but he has played the Indian card several times in the past very effectively so I suspect he will use it again.

 

[Darat]

Would it be unfair to say that countries full of uneducated, volatile religious zealots require a ruthless dictator?

Not unfair just not right.

 

[Hutch]

FWIW I think the situation in Pakistan is a rather worrying at the moment. If Musharraf found himself pushed out - and if his soldiers keep firing on crowds that might happen - then I can easily see the uneasy situation between Pakistan and India going out of control, which is a very unhappy thought. It would be easy to characterise it as "Oh well, it's just a burned-out KFC" but I worry that it's symptomatic of a growing anti-Western trend in Pakistan that will lead inexorably to a more general anti-General trend (if you catch my drift!), since he's seen as being in cahoots with the West. And indeed, quite possibly anti-Islamic, since he's been cracking down on the Madrassas lately as well.

I may have been the poster you mentioned in the OP, but I must admit that I am worried regarding Pakistan. The cartoons are being moved from the religious angle (which violence-wise I still think has spent itself) to the political---and in most Muslim countries the Religious and Political are not separate and never were meant to be separate.

And Pakistan has more than it's share of fundamentalist madras (schools) and radicals to make life interesting for Musharraf.

It will be interesting (in the Chinese curse sense) to see if he can get control and slap down hard on the 'schools'.

For if Pakistan goes, I do not see how we can sustain our efforts in Afghanistan with both East and West being effectively closed to us.

IMHO as always.

We shall see.

 

[HarryKeogh]

it's gotten so bad they're not only protesting the cartoons but attacking actual cartoon characters!

 

[MWare]

I agree but he has played the Indian card several times in the past very effectively so I suspect he will use it again.

Not just the Indian card but specifically the Kashmir card. He has used this as effectively as other dictatorships have used Palestine.

 

[MWare]

it's gotten so bad they're not only protesting the cartoons but attacking actual cartoon characters!

I'm hoping they realize that we will not take equivalent offense to the desecration of Ronald.

 

[NeilC]

Ah the old Macdonalds attack - it's traditional in anti-western / anti-capitalist demos now isn't it.

Funny how the McD's keep going if the people hate them so much. Seems like they are able to put their strongly held beliefs to one side in the face of a tasty burger.