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Bill Moyer's and Washington

Roadtoad

Bufo Caminus Inedibilis
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A friend sent me this article by Bill Moyers. While normally, I don't enjoy Moyers and his brand of self-righteous and self serving journalism, this was something which caught my attention.

First, I want to say this about taxes: I am for the lowest possible taxes and tax rates. Since we've already seen that our Government will take the money and waste it, that our public's trust will be abused, the one thing you want to do is keep the weapon of choice out of the hands of Congress. A flat tax with a low rate will do this for the most part. It's not perfect, but it's a start.

However, Moyers makes several valid points, namely that 44 million Americans have no health insurance, that we're watching schools become worse and worse, while funding increases, in some cases exponentially, and we're watching Congress as it makes life easier and easier for the wealthiest among us.

I don't trust the wealthy. They've made it clear they'll screw me over in five seconds just because I'm there, whether there's a need to or not. But I sure as hell don't trust those who claim to be my friend because more often than not, they're trying to become friends of the wealthy. While we're thumbing our noses at ethics, we're losing not only our nation, but we're losing our nation's soul. And while I cannot stomach Socialism, the self-restraint which made the American Republic a greater force for good is seemingly on the wane, while this cancer (yes, I said "cancer") of greed eats away at the bones of what's left of my country.

And frankly, that makes more than a little sad.
 
Pretty good article. But Moyers plays up the typical left-wing boogie-man (corporations) while ignoring the government, which gives the corporations the power to do what they do. The corporations are not the problem, the government is.
 
Tony said:
Pretty good article. But Moyers plays up the typical left-wing boogie-man (corporations) while ignoring the government, which gives the corporations the power to do what they do. The corporations are not the problem, the government is.

I would beg to differ on a number of points. Remember that corporations are supposed to be "artificial persons," and that they're ideally subject to the same laws as individuals. However, show me where a corporation has ever really been treated in the same manner as an individual. Ever.
 
Tony said:
Pretty good article. But Moyers plays up the typical left-wing boogie-man (corporations) while ignoring the government, which gives the corporations the power to do what they do. The corporations are not the problem, the government is.
The govenment is the people, we provide them with the power. Blame the govt. and you are really blaming the people. So what are you going about it?
 
DavidJames said:
The govenment is the people, we provide them with the power. Blame the govt. and you are really blaming the people. So what are you going about it?

I understand part of where he's coming from. He's reminding us of the Libertarian argument against government.

Part of the problem, though, is Paul Harvey's reminder that Self Government does not work without Self Control.
 
Roadtoad said:
I would beg to differ on a number of points. Remember that corporations are supposed to be "artificial persons," and that they're ideally subject to the same laws as individuals. However, show me where a corporation has ever really been treated in the same manner as an individual. Ever.

Hmmm, you seem to be supporting my contention. Who gives corporations the power and leverage to skirt the law? They surely don't give it to themselves.
 
DavidJames said:
The American people through their elected representatives in government

Wrong answer. But nice way to pass the buck.
 
DavidJames said:
The govenment is the people, we provide them with the power. Blame the govt. and you are really blaming the people. So what are you going about it?

And that excludes of course "politician promises"?
 
DavidJames said:
The govenment is the people

No it's not. The government is made up of elected politicians who, besides for purposes re-election, are essentially independent from the wants of the people.
 
Tony said:
Wrong answer. But nice way to pass the buck.
Talk about shirking responsibility. Spend some time and learn how govt works. Just because you don't like the results doesn't mean it's not working as designed.
 
Tony said:
No it's not. The government is made up of elected politicians who, besides for purposes re-election, are essentially independent from the wants of the people.

How does it go? "...that this government, of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from this earth"?

Something like that.

Granted, that is just one man's opinion.

On the other hand, in a little more binding sense, there is the statement that, "We the people of the United States...do ordain and establish this constitution."

So the people establish the government, if nothing else.
 
Tony said:
No it's not. The government is made up of elected politicians who, besides for purposes re-election, are essentially independent from the wants of the people.
What have you done, specifically, to share your opinions with your elected officials. What letters have your written, phone calls made, meetings attended? What are you doing to ensure your voice has been heard by the people elected to serve you?
 
pgwenthold said:
How does it go? "...that this government, of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from this earth"?

Something like that.

Granted, that is just one man's opinion.

On the other hand, in a little more binding sense, there is the statement that, "We the people of the United States...do ordain and establish this constitution."

So the people establish the government, if nothing else.

I agree, that that's how is should be. Trust me, I want a government of the people, by the people and for the people as much as anyone else, but I'm not going to pretend that's how it is.
 
Roadtoad said:
I understand part of where he's coming from. He's reminding us of the Libertarian argument against government.

Part of the problem, though, is Paul Harvey's reminder that Self Government does not work without Self Control.

"...without self discipline."

Friendly, subtle correection, only for accuracy's sake. Point well-taken.

:)
 

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