Berlin Bans Cruise, Scoffs at Scientology!

Overman

Master Poster
Overman
Joined
Feb 2, 2006
Messages
2,629
Linky

They probably would have stood to make some money off this movie as well, so very very very very good for them, and us!!!

Cruise, also one of the film's producers, is a member of the Church of Scientology which the German government does not recognize as a church. Berlin says it masquerades as a religion to make money, a charge Scientology leaders reject.
Click to expand...

Defense Ministry spokesman Harald Kammerbauer said the film makers "will not be allowed to film at German military sites if Count Stauffenberg is played by Tom Cruise, who has publicly professed to being a member of the Scientology cult".
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
I'm so torn about this story. I definitely like the banning of Tom Cruise, but at the same time, I despise the state's endorsing of "recognized" religions.
 
Forbidding someone from filming in Germany because they belong to a group they don't like. Is this report from the 1930s or 2007?
 
JoeTheJuggler said:
I'm so torn about this story. I definitely like the banning of Tom Cruise, but at the same time, I despise the state's endorsing of "recognized" religions.
Click to expand...

I don't think that not recognizing something as a religion is the same as endorsing other religions.
 
HarryKeogh said:
Forbidding someone from filming in Germany because they belong to a group they don't like. Is this report from the 1930s or 2007?
Click to expand...

No, forbidding someone from filming on government property (specifically military bases) because he is a member of an organization which defrauds and brainwashes people.

When the US government lets Alex Jones film in the pentagon, I'll criticize Germany for this.
 
brodski said:
No, forbidding someone from filming on government property (specifically military bases) because he is a member of an organization which defrauds and brainwashes people.

When the US government lets Alex Jones film in the pentagon, I'll criticize Germany for this.
Click to expand...

Your correction is noted and appreciated. He is being forbidden from filming at a millitary base and not all of Germany.

But since this is not a Scientology event I still think forbidding him from filming there is wrong. He is there in the capacity of a film producer and actor. I know he sets up Scientology booths at films he works on. It seems simple enough to forbid him from setting them up while on gov't property.
 
HarryKeogh said:
But since this is not a Scientology event I still think forbidding him from filming there is wrong. He is there in the capacity of a film producer and actor. I know he sets up Scientology booths at films he works on. It seems simple enough to forbid him from setting them up while on gov't property.
Click to expand...

But Cruise's films do become Scientology events. I'll need to dig it up, but I do recall reading that Scientology missionaries are kept on the set, dealings with Cruise required some sort of scientology tour, etc. Where Cruise goes, Scientology follows.


Edit: Not sure of what to google I found this: http://www.rickross.com/reference/scientology/celebrities/celebrities63.html
 
Last edited:
From Wikipedia:

One of the countries which take the strongest stance against the organization is Germany. The Church of Scientology has waged a far-reaching public relations campaign to convince the world that Scientologists are persecuted regularly in Germany. The Church of Scientology has taken out full-page ads in the New York Times accusing the German government of persecuting Scientologists in Europe; while they have made repeated requests to the United Nations to have resolutions passed condemning the discrimination against Scientologists in Germany. Germany, in turn, classifies the Church of Scientology as a dangerous practice and a "sect," and it has placed the organization under surveillance for alleged unconstitutional activities.
Click to expand...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_controversy

Apparently, Scientology has become for Germany what Freemasonry was for the United States in the 19th century. It is accused of being a dangerous cult that is trying to take over the government and the economy. In 1994 German Minister of Labor Norbert Blum issued a decree preventing Scientologists from obtaining licenses to operate private employment agencies. In 1996 Bavaria barred anyone connected with Scientology from any government job. Tom Cruise's movies have been boycotted and Scientologist musicians like Chick Corea have been banned from playing in the country.
 
Last edited:
I'm with Miss A on this. While Scientology is the biggest crap I've ever heard of, there is such a thing as freedom of religion.

I have a very cool story. :D When War of the the Worlds came out, I managed to get tickets to the red carpet at the Ziegfeld Theater and got to see Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes.

He and she were incredibly gracious and polite to all the fans there and spent the majority of their time on the red carpet making the autograph and picture rounds among the three blocks of people that had lined up outside the Ziegfeld.

He, Katie Holmes and their respective entourages should have been given a medal. Speed competitive autograph signing. They were even kissing for people's cameras and calling people's friends. Tom Cruise was totally charming and delightful. He was even joking about the Oprah appearance and parodying himself.

I got an autograph and several pictures. :D
 
Can anyone just walk into any US Military installation and shoot a film? Or would they have to aks permission first - and could that potentially be denied - even on grounds of who was going to be part of the film crew?
 
Um, no one should be denied anything on grounds of their religion. Some arbitrary objection to their person doesn't sit well with me, either.

If Tom Cruise had a criminal record, now, that would be solid grounds for turning him away. Him individually, not the entire crew of the film he was to shoot, just because of his mere presence.
 
Last edited:
Rasmus said:
Can anyone just walk into any US Military installation and shoot a film?
Click to expand...

No.

Or would they have to aks permission first - and could that potentially be denied - even on grounds of who was going to be part of the film crew?
Click to expand...

Yes.

Of course I'd bet the family farm that the US gov't wouldn't ban Tom Cruise from filming there because of his affilliation with Scientology (which has nothing to do with the movie being shot.)

I don't think the US gov't would ban anyone and then list their religion/cult as the sole reason why.
 
EeneyMinnieMoe said:
I'm with Miss A on this. While Scientology is the biggest crap I've ever heard of, there is such a thing as freedom of religion.

I have a very cool story. :D When War of the the Worlds came out, I managed to get tickets to the red carpet at the Ziegfeld Theater and got to see Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes.

He and she were incredibly gracious and polite to all the fans there and spent the majority of their time on the red carpet making the autograph and picture rounds among the three blocks of people that had lined up outside the Ziegfeld.

He, Katie Holmes and their respective entourages should have been given a medal. Speed competitive autograph signing. They were even kissing for people's cameras and calling people's friends. Tom Cruise was totally charming and delightful. He was even joking about the Oprah appearance and parodying himself.

I got an autograph and several pictures. :D
Click to expand...


And that's how it all starts.

M.
 
EeneyMinnieMoe said:
Um, no one should be denied anything on grounds of their religion. Some arbitrary objection to their person doesn't sit well with me, either.
Click to expand...

What if their religion required them to kill another person as a rite or passage? Should this be denied?
 
HarryKeogh said:
I don't think the US gov't would ban anyone and then list their religion/cult as the sole reason why.
Click to expand...

If that person is a prominent member of an organisation that is deemed to be in opposition to the values/rules of the constitution things would probably look different. That some might consider this organisation a religion has nothing to do with it as far as i can see.

If anyone member of Al Kaida wanted to work as part of a movie crew their membership alone would be all that xou'd need to cite as a reason. Then you could start arguing abourt how bad the organisatzion really was. I am certain there is a lot more room for debate regarding Germany's view of Scientology, of course. But given their current stance the descision to ban Cruise is a sensible one.
 
EeneyMinnieMoe said:
If Tom Cruise had a criminal record, now, that would be solid grounds for turning him away. Him individually, not the entire crew of the film he was to shoot, just because of his mere presence.
Click to expand...

Perhaps this is the sort of thing the German government is trying to avoid?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Freakout

On July 8, 1977, however, the FBI raided Scientology offices in Los Angeles and Washington, D.C., seizing over 48,000 documents. They revealed the extent to which the Church had committed "criminal campaigns of villification, burglaries and thefts ... against private and public individuals and organizations," as the U.S. Government prosecutor put it.

It seems reasonable to me that the German government is unwilling to fully cooperate with an organization that has such an unfortunate history.
 
Overman said:
What if their religion required them to kill another person as a rite or passage? Should this be denied?
Click to expand...

I read that as "no one should be denied anything [because of] their religion", that is, denied anything that would normally be available to anyone not of that religion.
 
Rasmus said:
If that person is a prominent member of an organisation that is deemed to be in opposition to the values/rules of the constitution things would probably look different. That some might consider this organisation a religion has nothing to do with it as far as i can see.

If anyone member of Al Kaida wanted to work as part of a movie crew their membership alone would be all that xou'd need to cite as a reason. Then you could start arguing abourt how bad the organisatzion really was. I am certain there is a lot more room for debate regarding Germany's view of Scientology, of course. But given their current stance the descision to ban Cruise is a sensible one.
Click to expand...

Interesting point (of course, Al Qaida doesn't claim to be a religion but I catch your drift). It could open up another discussion as well. Would Germany be right to deny Scientologists German citizenship if they feel so strongly on this issue?

bjb said:
It seems reasonable to me that the German government is unwilling to fully cooperate with an organization that has such an unfortunate history.
Click to expand...

Wonder if they would allow a Catholic (I'm thinking of the Church's systematic covering up of the raping of children) to film at one of their bases? I mean, talk about your unfortunate histories.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom