Back to the Bermuda Triangle, Part II: Atlantis (again)

Checkmite

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Ah, Bimini. A beautiful, if insignificant, speck of land is the Bimini Island, located opposite Miami on the eastern edge of the Gulf Stream. Bimini is often the “gateway” to the Bahamas for small private cruisers, who stop to take on water at Alice Town, the island’s only settlement. There is a bar in Alice Town (which shall remain nameless) where the underwear (yes, underwear) of countless previous patrons is tacked to the wall and hung from lines, with names and dates going back 50 years written on them; you’re free to leave yours there if you want. But the reason most people visit Bimini is for the scuba diving.

Off Bimini, in extremely shallow water, there lies a formation of fractured beachrock similar to other formations of fractured beachrock, yet different because the formation is actually a road or wall built by either aliens or Atlanteans, depending on who’s trying to sell you the bridge. The formation in question, typically yclept the “Bimini Road”, does not resemble its original structure, of course. In the mid 1920s, after a bad hurricane, a few American companies in charge of repairing stateside harbors harvested tons upon tons of stones from the Bimini Road. And other formations around Bimini. They’ve left calling cards behind, as well, in the form of tool marks on a few rejected stones. These tool marks can still be seen today, and when “discovered” are hailed as evidence by proponents of a theory regarding an ancient civilization which selected the Bimini region as their home.

Most people reject this theory, including most scientists. According to proponents, that’s because it would upset currently held scientific theories concerning the history of the Bahamas islands, and scientists can’t handle being proven wrong. Actually, the reason this theory is usually rejected out of hand is not out of favor to the incumbent theories, but rather out of disdain for the methodology used to arrive at it. You see, the proponents of an ancient civilization on Bimini didn’t simply happen upon the stones, examine them, and work out a theory to explain them. Instead, they arrived with a theory already on their minds, and checked over the evidence to see whether it was compatible with their theory. That theory involves a great island civilization that sunk into the ocean long, long ago…an island named Atlantis.


Atlantis is, to be brutally precise, a fairy tale invented by one Greek philosopher named Plato. Some may feel that this analysis is too bold; however, considering that no mention of Atlantis has been found anywhere in any classical literature or art outside of Plato’s two dialogues, the Timaeus and the Critias, the only reasonable conclusion is that it never existed independent of them.

The first mention of Atlantis is in the Timaeus. In it, a man named Critias tells a story told to him by his grandfather, who was also named Critias. That older Critias learned the story from his grandfather, named Dropides, who swore that he heard it from the great Greek scholar Solon, who in turn was told the story by Egyptian priests from a city called Sais. Those priests heard the story from their predecessors, and so on down the line. According to the story, Solon was visiting Sais and was talking with the Egyptian priests. The priests asked Solon to tell them the oldest story he could think of; he gives them the canned Greek “creation myth”.

From the Timaeus
Thereupon one of the priests, who was of a very great age, said: O Solon, Solon, you Hellenes are never anything but children, and there is not an old man among you. Solon in return asked him what he meant. I mean to say, he replied, that in mind you are all young; there is no old opinion handed down among you by ancient tradition, nor any science which is hoary with age.

According to Solon…according to Dropides, according to Critias the elder, according to Critias, according to Plato, the Egyptians began to tell a very “old” story.

From the Timaeus
In the first place you remember a single deluge only, but there were many previous ones; in the next place, you do not know that there formerly dwelt in your land the fairest and noblest race of men which ever lived, and that you and your whole city are descended from a small seed or remnant of them which survived. And this was unknown to you, because, for many generations, the survivors of that destruction died, leaving no written word. For there was a time, Solon, before the great deluge of all, when the city which now is Athens was first in war and in every way the best governed of all cities, is said to have performed the noblest deeds and to have had the fairest constitution of any of which tradition tells, under the face of heaven.



Many great and wonderful deeds are recorded of your state in our histories. But one of them exceeds all the rest in greatness and valour. For these histories tell of a mighty power which unprovoked made an expedition against the whole of Europe and Asia, and to which your city put an end. This power came forth out of the Atlantic Ocean, for in those days the Atlantic was navigable; and there was an island situated in front of the straits which are by you called the Pillars of Heracles; the island was larger than Libya and Asia put together, and was the way to other islands, and from these you might pass to the whole of the opposite continent which surrounded the true ocean; for this sea which is within the Straits of Heracles is only a harbour, having a narrow entrance, but that other is a real sea, and the surrounding land may be most truly called a boundless continent.

So apparently, there was a huge island outside the Mediterranean, and behind it was a continent so big the Egyptians called it “boundless”. Already the words are suspect, being that all of North America and South America themselves can barely be called “larger than Libya (Africa) and Asia put together”, let alone an island between the Americas and the Med. But perhaps I’m arguing semantics? Let’s continue.

From the Timaeus
Now in this island of Atlantis there was a great and wonderful empire which had rule over the whole island and several others, and over parts of the continent, and, furthermore, the men of Atlantis had subjected the parts of Libya within the columns of Heracles as far as Egypt, and of Europe as far as Tyrrhenia. This vast power, gathered into one, endeavoured to subdue at a blow our country and yours and the whole of the region within the straits; and then, Solon, your country shone forth, in the excellence of her virtue and strength, among all mankind. She was pre-eminent in courage and military skill, and was the leader of the Hellenes. And when the rest fell off from her, being compelled to stand alone, after having undergone the very extremity of danger, she defeated and triumphed over the invaders, and preserved from slavery those who were not yet subjugated, and generously liberated all the rest of us who dwell within the pillars.

Coming from a Hellene, this story sounds like propaganda. Proud Athens, all by herself, fending off the brutish warrior thugs of “Atlantis” – thugs who managed to capture nearly the entire Mediterranean! – and liberating the world from slavery. It’s a wonderful and powerful story. And what happened to these knights in shining armor, the Athenians? What happened to the Atlantean hordes?

From the Timaeus
But afterwards there occurred violent earthquakes and floods; and in a single day and night of misfortune all your warlike men in a body sank into the earth, and the island of Atlantis in like manner disappeared in the depths of the sea. For which reason the sea in those parts is impassable and impenetrable, because there is a shoal of mud in the way; and this was caused by the subsidence of the island.

Talk about fixing something that wasn’t broke. This seems like an almost intentional parody of the deus ex machina concept. After the war, both the good guys and the bad guys were just obliterated. Must’ve ruined a perfectly good day for the Athenians.

In the Critias, Plato covers some of the political and demographic aspects of the Atlantean culture, none of which are pertinent to the existence argument.

Now, from this story we have certain specific facts about Atlantis, which we should need to use were we to attempt to find the island. According to Plato,

  • Time - Atlantis existed 9,000 years before Plato’s time…that would be 10,000 years before our time.
  • Size - Atlantis was larger than Libya and Asia put together. Friends, even if we’re talking about then-known Libya and Asia, that’s bloody huge.
  • Location - Atlantis was outside the Mediterranean Sea, in the Atlantic Ocean, and situated in front of the Straits of Heracles (Gibraltar).
  • Method of Destruction - Atlantis was sunk by violent earthquakes and floods, rendering the ocean in its immediate vicinity impassable by creating a shoal of mud.

Despite many exhaustive searches, there is nothing on this earth that matches Plato’s (Critias’s, Dropides’s, Solon’s, the priests’) 4 basic criteria. Some have insisted that Plato’s story was allegory, and was really inspired by the destruction of the Santorini volcano and its island. However, the only fact to link Santorini and Atlantis is that they were both islands that were destroyed. Santorini was not in the Atlantic, was not destroyed 9,000 years before Plato’s time, was not sunk by earthquakes and floods, and did not leave any part of the sea “impassable”, with a mud shoal or otherwise (in fact, the opposite happened – the Santorini destruction made the former center of the island “navigable” by erasing it). Santorini fails every single criteria. Santorini was not Atlantis.

That’s not to say that there wasn’t an island in Antarctica or off the coast of South America or Africa, or in a lake in the Andes that was home to a city and that sunk. There are plenty of such instances, all through world history. But those places were not Atlantis. They bear no resemblance to Atlantis. There was no Atlantis.


Still, some see hope in the Bahamas. The Bahamas are in the Atlantic, did exist 9,000 years before Plato, and were technically largely sunk by flooding – even if the “cataclysmic flood waters” rose only about an inch every hundred years or so. As it relates to the Bermuda Triangle, this would be its ultimate victim…an entire civilization!

However, most proponents don’t propose that the Atlanteans were victims of the Bermuda Triangle. Rather, they propose that the Atlanteans are responsible for the Bermuda Triangle. But how can this be? How can this race of conquest-driven blowhards be responsible for airplane and ship disappearances thousands of years after its death? Plato’s Critias describes the Atlanteans as a race ruled by kings, with warriors who used swords, bows, and chariots. What’s missing?

The reason for the “Atlantean Blame” theory lies not with Plato, but with someone who lived 10,000 years later…a “sleeping medium” that gave Atlantis a mondo facelift and threw the old Greek philosopher’s description more or less to the dogs. I speak of course of “Edgar Cayce”, who wove stories of an Atlantis with airplanes, supercomputers, and whiz-bang neeto keeno sexy-cool “crystal” energy sources. Abuse of these energy sources, said Cayce, destroyed Atlantis by causing volcanic upheavals. Unfortunately, like Santorini, Cayce’s “Atlantis” bears absolutely nothing in common with Plato’s Atlantis, save that we’re dealing with an island that sank. However, according to Cayce, sunken “Atlantis” would actually pop back up:

Poseidia will be among the first portions of Atlantis to rise again – expect it in ’68 or ’69 – not so far away!

Sadly, Poseidia – or any part of Atlantis – did not rise again, as well we all know. The islands in the Bahamas now are the same islands that were there in Cayce’s time. However, when dealing with proponents of Atlantis, we must remember that we are dealing with people who are willing to fudge details in order to make their theories work. The same people who will take Plato’s work and arbitrarily say “Well, he got this and this and this slightly wrong, but the rest of the work is completely accurate” are the same people who look at Cayce’s prediction about an island rising from the depths and say “Well what he really meant was that the Bimini Wall would be discovered in ’68 or ‘69”, as indeed it was “discovered” in 1968. But while Cayce may have said “rise again” when he really meant “be discovered”, his words about crystal sources are taken for Gospel by his followers, who insist that some of these sources are still active, and cause planes and ships to disappear in the waters of the Bermuda Triangle.

There may have been an ancient civilization which lived on Bimini Island 10,000 years ago. There are several mysteries introduced by this hypothesis, of course. The first is why this civilization didn’t bother to rebuild itself, either on the remaining islands or on nearby continental masses…or did they? The author of our Bermuda Triangle book, Quasar, draws similarities between the Bimini Wall (which is presumably collapsed) and Peruvian Indian walls. Of course, Peru is on the other side of a continent from the Bahamas, and it seems odd that the Atlanteans wouldn’t have stopped in, say, the Yucatan or Columbia and built the structures there as well. In fact, given that the Peruvian Indians built their walls only around 1,000 years ago, one would wonder why no Atlanteans built any walls at all in the centuries following their escape, or why wall-building knowledge was “passed down” for over 9,000 years (again assuming a “dry Bahamas” time-window of 10,000 years ago) before the recipients of this ancient wisdom bothered to implement it at all.

Quasar would counter this, as he does in his book, by suggesting that a good portion of the Bahamas were still dry as late as 1513, and that the Bimini Road (or nearby structures) was among the stoneworks still standing on dry land at that time. This would definitely place our Atlanteans and Peruvians a bit closer together in time…but what is our evidence? According to Quasar, it’s the infamous map of Admiral Piri Reis! The Piri map shows an island near the North American coast with what could be construed as a “row of polygonal, joined stones” in the center. Contemporary cartographers often drew not-to-scale landmarks on their islands to help the reader connect an island on the map with an island he was theoretically looking at. Since this “island” had polygonal stones in its center, it meant the Bimini Wall was on dry land in 1513. That’s what Quasar says in his picture caption, anyway. Well, friends, I won’t delve into the Piri map any further than to point out the fact that it wasn’t drawn by a “cartographer”, but by Piri himself, using several different maps (in different scales), many of which were outdated. Though the Piri map was finished in 1513, it cannot be used as a method of connecting absolutely anything with a particular year. The Piri map has been thoroughly trashed elsewhere, and a quick Google will find you enough information to discredit it thoroughly.

So we’re left with an island that sunk thousands of years ago, with hidden “power sources” that still zap unwary travelers today. Our only source for this information is Edgar Cayce, but we’re supposed to believe it anyway. But what are our alternatives? In the next installment, we will study ways that planes and ships can “disappear” without Atlantean crystal energy beams. We will also discuss Quasar’s theories regarding Zero Point energy, and the odd claims of a little “mad scientist” from Canada named John Hutchison.
 
Joshua Korosi said:
Time - Atlantis existed 9,000 years before Plato’s time…that would be 10,000 years before our time.

:clap:
Another excellent post Joshua... save what I have quoted.

Now - (Plato - Altantis) = -11,000 years.
 
Cleopatra said:
Very good Joshua :)

When will you start your studies in Archaeology?

I already have...

...oh wait, you mean formally. I'm working on that. I'll keep you posted. :)
 
Joshua Korosi said:
I speak of course of “Edgar Cayce”, who wove stories of an Atlantis with airplanes, supercomputers, and whiz-bang neeto keeno sexy-cool “crystal” energy sources. Abuse of these energy sources, said Cayce, destroyed Atlantis by causing volcanic upheavals.
Oooh, that's interesting. I always wondered what Chris Day was on about.
The Atlantean civilisation, according to tradition, made great and formal use of quartz crystals, even in technology.
Maybe he better watch out in case he destroys Oxfordshire the same way! :D

Rolfe.
 
Absolutely excellent, Josh. I knew buying you that membership was a good investment.

(Yes, I'm admitting it.)
 
Joshua Korosi said:


I already have...

...oh wait, you mean formally. I'm working on that. I'll keep you posted. :)

When you get through, it appears these people could desperately use your help:

http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/7626.html


The expert council team had rushed to the site in a tiny back garden in Buckhaven after an amateur archaeologist unearthed a meshwork of massive stones while exploring the ground in her garden.
They had suspected that the stone slabs had lain in the Fife soil for more than 1000 years after being ferried from a nearby beach to the homes of Viking settlers.
But after many hours of painstaking excavation, they found the massive rocks were simply part of a sunken patio built in the 1940s.
 
Now I finally know exactly who to buy the drink for, if I ever make it to a TAM. Before Tricky's confession, I would've been forced to buy everybody a drink, just to make sure.

Thanks Tricky! :D
 
Joshua Korosi said:
Now I finally know exactly who to buy the drink for, if I ever make it to a TAM. Before Tricky's confession, I would've been forced to buy everybody a drink, just to make sure.

Thanks Tricky! :D

Has Tricky made something nice for you Herr Schliemann ? :)
 
What about Helike for an inspiration for Atlantis parable?

- It was buried by solifluxion during an earthquake; the site became a shalow lagoon that could account for the mud;

- The road to Helike passed through a valley with a sanctuary to Heracles;

- The city had a temple dedicated to Poseidon.

I´m not saying that Helike is Atlantis, I´m just saying it may have been a major source of inspiration used by Plato to create the myth.

Yes, its not in the Atlantic ocean, neither it is as as big as Lybia.
 
All I knew about Atlantis came from Donovan
The continent of Atlantis was an island which lay before the great flood
in the area we now call the Atlantic Ocean.
So great an area of land, that from her western shores
those beautiful sailors journeyed to the South and the North Americas with ease, in their ships with painted sails.
To the East Africa was a neighbour, across a short strait of sea miles.
The great Egyptian age is but a remnant of The Atlantian culture.
The antediluvian kings colonised the world
All the Gods who play in the mythological dramas
In all legends from all lands were from fair Atlantis.
Knowing her fate, Atlantis sent out ships to all corners of the Earth.
On board were the Twelve:
The poet, the physician, the farmer, the scientist,
The magician and the other so-called Gods of our legends.
Though Gods they were -
And as the elders of our time choose to remain blind
Let us rejoice and let us sing and dance and ring in the new
Hail Atlantis!
 
Joshua.

Another clue for you coming from studying the Platonic dialogues.Germans scholars have said something wise about Plato : "Platona Platoni safinizin" meaning that we'd better leave the Platonic texts elaborate on the platonic texts :)

In his dialogue "Menexenus" Plato includes an extended Epitaph which is an hymn to the heroic/ mythical past of the City of Athens. Although he lists the deeds of the Atheneans against the Amazons, against the Thebans and against the Argeans he doesn't mention anything about their victory against the army of Atlantis.

originally posted by Correa Neto

What about Helike for an inspiration for Atlantis parable?

I am very skeptical about this because we know that Plato was aware of the mythological tradition of his era and he was particularly familiar with the Myths that were connected with Athens.

Also, he was aware of the myths of the Orpheans and the Neopythagoreans that they were of eschatological nature and they discussed the future of the sould after death. If we believe the tradition, Plato, when he was young, attempted to become a tragic poet so,we must assume that he had worked on the myths.

My point is that he didn't really need an historical fact to inspire him the myth of Atlantis.
 
In a related matter, yesterday picked up the latest copy of Skeptical Inquirer at Borders, and the front-page article is entitled "Geologists, Beachrock, and Atlantis" (the issue is not on CSICOP's website yet; I swear it must've been released the same day I bought it). The article is written by a geologist that actually took several core samples from the stones of the "Bimini Road" in studies during the 70's and 80's, which indicate that, yes, it's beachrock. This means that if you find any websites while researching the Bimini Road that claim the stones are "made of a different material than beachrock", they are either misinformed or deliberately lying. He explains how, when a "believer" suggested that "perhaps the Atlanteans had only beachrock to construct with", he then took several more core samples from several stones. Not only was the "strata gradient" in all the stones oriented the same way (toward deeper water, indicating the beachrock formed where it now lies), but the different layers of strata could be traced through cores from adjacent stones. The rocks are completely natural both in formation and orientation.

The geologist makes it clear that beachrock formations naturally follow the outlines of the former beach they underlaid...that means if the beach curves or turns, so does the beachrock, and odd "J" shape of the Bimini Road tells us the beach that once rested in that location was thusly shaped. He also explains some "pillars" that have been found just north of Bimini. When examined, the pillars were found to be composed of Portland cement. Old ships used to carry barrels filled with cement for ballast; occasionally these barrels were jettisoned, and after a long time the wood rotted away, leaving only the barrel-shaped block of concrete. No Atlantean pillars.

Most intriguing, the geologist explains that before his investigations of the Road, he remembered having read an expose' of the Bimini beachrock...composed by none other than James Randi!
 
Yes, I've read that issue. Also I am a geologist, so I know that his description of beachrock is exactly correct. It is similar to the stuff called "hardpan" which occurs in some calcium-rich soils. The calcium leaches out until it hits an impermiable layer, then deposits as a very hard stone that will absolutely wreck a plow. Ask any farmer.


And I can tell you, beachrock would never be used for any sort of construction material. It is far too weak and fissile. Also, if it were above water, any fresh water (like rain) would leach out the calcium cement, causing it to crumble rapidly.

But it is pretty funny to see woo-woos start to backpedal when their theories start to crumble around them like subaerial beachrock.
 
And of course, when exposed to air beachrock will contract and crack, just like mud in a dry lake. Sometimes, the patterns can be interesting. Sometimes, they are awesome. Remember that thread we had a bit ago, in which we talked about hexagonal basalt? I found some really amazing photos of the phenomenon; I hope everybody got to see them.
 
Joshua Korosi said:
hexagonal basalt? I found some really amazing photos of the phenomenon; I hope everybody got to see them.
Staffa!

Forget the photos, it has to be seen to be believed.

Rolfe.
 
Rolfe- True. Staffa is very well worth a visit, especially if you go to Iona as well.
You needn't go so far north though. There's lovely polygonal jointing in the Carboniferous basalts of Scotland's midland valley- Samson's Ribs on Arthur's Seat in Edinburgh for instance, or Dunglass near Lennoxtown outside Glasgow.

Scotland is the world in miniature geologically.
 
Joshua- I'm prepared to believe that Santorini had some part in the source of the story. It's hard to see how an event of that scale could fail to have been remembered by the bronze age cultures of the eastern med.

(And Rolfe- this is another island worth seeing!)
 

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