Alcohol Use and Alcoholism

[seayakin]

I saw this editorial in the Sunday New York Times.

Drinking by the Numbers

For me it is interesting because I gave up alcohol about a year ago although I have had a about 5 drinks in the last 15 month period. I mainly gave it up because I was finding quantity I was drinking was creeping up similarly to how the editorial descibes it and this was probably a 10 year process. For me, I was actually a tee totaller in undergraduate and didn't start drinking more until graduate school and when I began working. However, it is an interesting intellectual question about when someone crosses the line from heavy drinker to alcoholic. There is also the CAGE test. When I was drinking, I was possibly CAGE positive but it was borderline.

I do have friends who are alcoholics and have since gone to AA and have been dry (some for as many as 30 years). I thought the article was interesting because it suggested giving it up for short periods of times. This is something I have done in the past but I'm not sure if there is an scientific evidence to support this.

It does seem there is no scientific metric that can be used to determine when someone cross the line.

 

[Varanid]

It's interesting -- I am not a "drinker." I've had hard alcohol maybe five times (totaling 5 to 10 drinks) in the last year. I can't remember the last time I was proper sloshed -- my recreational substance of choice is herbal.

That said, I ************* love beer. Love it, love it, love it. And while I don't want anything to do with non-alcoholic beer, I don't drink beer to get drunk. I drink it because I ************* love beer.

But whereas five years ago, loving beer meant I had two per night, it slowly crept up to 5 or 6 a night. I've since wrangled it back down to 3 or 4, but that's probably too much on a day-in-day-out context.

So yeah, I think the creeping increase in drinking is a very real phenomenon that must be kept in check.

 

[lionking]

Interesting article. I'm a drinker, but "reset" to zero every couple of months or so to get fit and give my liver a rest. I'm nearly 65 and don't think I will ever change my lifestyle to a teetotal one. When I drink, it's more than the government recommended level, but I'm comfortable with it.

 

[big-E]

I guess I must be the equivalent of one of those people who doesn't understand how people get fat, when it's "easy" to just decide not to eat too much...

I'm British, so drinking has been a common and generally unremarkable part of my life since teen years... I like drinking, be it beer, cider, wine or spirits, and when I do drink (usually two or three times a week) I usually have enough to feel mildly inebriated, sometimes moderately, but I've never been a heavy drinker and have no problems at all with 'needing' a drink - in that I can go without whenever I want (genuinely!). As I'm now rapidly approaching 40 I almost never get properly drunk because I know how regrettable it will be the next day (this realisation kicked in when I was around 30)

The idea of needing to take a break for a while or it will sneak up and overcome me is completely alien to me... it seems almost sinister in some way, and triggers faint, but bizarre puritanical knee-jerk reactions about moral failings, which are quite inexplicable since I wasn't brought up or educated to think that at all. Puzzling. No alcoholics that I know of in my family or immediate circle.

I guess whatever appetite I have for it is pegged at a 'sustainable' level, and thus no willpower is required. What I *do* need willpower for is chocolate, cakes & biscuits... my brother, like many others, just doesn't *want* to eat much sweet stuff so he never has an issue staying thin. It really does seem like there are natural variations in appetites for all sorts of things and if yours happens to be set 'high' then you're in trouble. What you do need is sympathy from those who don't have that difficulty, and understanding that what's easy for them isn't necessarily just as easy for you - on a biochemical level.

 

[lionking]

I guess I must be the equivalent of one of those people who doesn't understand how people get fat, when it's "easy" to just decide not to eat too much...

I'm British, so drinking has been a common and generally unremarkable part of my life since teen years... I like drinking, be it beer, cider, wine or spirits, and when I do drink (usually two or three times a week) I usually have enough to feel mildly inebriated, sometimes moderately, but I've never been a heavy drinker and have no problems at all with 'needing' a drink - in that I can go without whenever I want (genuinely!). As I'm now rapidly approaching 40 I almost never get properly drunk because I know how regrettable it will be the next day (this realisation kicked in when I was around 30)

The idea of needing to take a break for a while or it will sneak up and overcome me is completely alien to me... it seems almost sinister in some way, and triggers faint, but bizarre puritanical knee-jerk reactions about moral failings, which are quite inexplicable since I wasn't brought up or educated to think that at all. Puzzling. No alcoholics that I know of in my family or immediate circle.

I guess whatever appetite I have for it is pegged at a 'sustainable' level, and thus no willpower is required. What I *do* need willpower for is chocolate, cakes & biscuits... my brother, like many others, just doesn't *want* to eat much sweet stuff so he never has an issue staying thin. It really does seem like there are natural variations in appetites for all sorts of things and if yours happens to be set 'high' then you're in trouble. What you do need is sympathy from those who don't have that difficulty, and understanding that what's easy for them isn't necessarily just as easy for you - on a biochemical level.

There is also a hereditary disposition to drinking.

https://www.niaaa.nih.gov/alcohol-h...-use-disorders/genetics-alcohol-use-disorders

This is not an excuse, and this disposition can easily be overcome. But it is a factor. I come from a long line of drinkers.

 

[MikeG]

.....I'm British, so drinking has been a common and generally unremarkable part of my life since teen years.........

Careful about generalising. The one doesn't follow from the other. I'm British, and I'll have a glass of wine with dinner guests (so a dozen or 15 glasses of wine a year) plus a very occasional beer if we ever go to a pub.

 

[NoahFence]

Is a 6 pack a day too much?

 

[big-E]

Careful about generalising. The one doesn't follow from the other. I'm British, and I'll have a glass of wine with dinner guests (so a dozen or 15 glasses of wine a year) plus a very occasional beer if we ever go to a pub.

Ah, I didn't mean that all Britons drink, just that drinking (often to excess!) is widely "accepted" as a general cultural thing... not necessarily my own drinking, but it is all around us from teenage years onwards. I was just trying to provide background context for viewers from more abstemious cultures!

 

[Dr.Sid]

Try not to drink for a month. If you can't do it, you drink too much. And the fact that the limit is different for everyone, is one of the problem of alcohol. You are only safe when you don't drink any. And srsly, why would you.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Is a 6 pack a day too much?

During one part of my childhood I learned it's okay for a grownup to drink one 12 pack in the morning and another one in the afternoon. "Too much" is a third twelve pack in then evening, unless there are guests.

 

[MikeG]

......You are only safe when you don't drink any.

Safe from what?

...... And srsly, why would you.

Why wouldn't you?

 

[Dr.Sid]

Safe from what?

From alcoholism, obviously.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

At any rate, I gave up consuming any and all alcohol and any and all fermented things forever, back in February. I'd like to enjoy a beer again someday, but I haven't even found a consistent safe number of Jelly Bellies I can eat without getting sick, so beer is way the heck down on my list of things to experiment with.

 

[MikeG]

From alcoholism, obviously.

Obviously. So clearly my glass of wine every few weeks means I am at risk of developing an alcohol dependence. I see.

 

[big-E]

Obviously. So clearly my glass of wine every few weeks means I am at risk of developing an alcohol dependence. I see.

I'd be more worried about your woodwork dependency. I'm unconvinced you could give that up for a month! (Huge fan of your cottage renovation by the way... as a DIY dilettante I'm in awe)

 

[wareyin]

Obviously. So clearly my glass of wine every few weeks means I am at risk of developing an alcohol dependence. I see.

You are only safe from alcohol dependence when you define yourself by your reaction to alcohol, and actively suppress your longing for it. If alcohol is not negatively affecting your life, nor are you constantly thinking about it, you must be an alcoholic! [/sarcasm]

 

[Magrat]

I very rarely drink, have gotten drunk perhaps six times in my entire life. Both my parents were alcoholics, as were two of my grandparents. I have always been aware of that and this is a big reason why I rarely drink.

Genetics are a big factor here I feel.

 

[blutoski]

I saw this editorial in the Sunday New York Times.

Drinking by the Numbers

For me it is interesting because I gave up alcohol about a year ago although I have had a about 5 drinks in the last 15 month period. I mainly gave it up because I was finding quantity I was drinking was creeping up similarly to how the editorial descibes it and this was probably a 10 year process. For me, I was actually a tee totaller in undergraduate and didn't start drinking more until graduate school and when I began working. However, it is an interesting intellectual question about when someone crosses the line from heavy drinker to alcoholic. There is also the CAGE test. When I was drinking, I was possibly CAGE positive but it was borderline.

I do have friends who are alcoholics and have since gone to AA and have been dry (some for as many as 30 years). I thought the article was interesting because it suggested giving it up for short periods of times. This is something I have done in the past but I'm not sure if there is an scientific evidence to support this.

It does seem there is no scientific metric that can be used to determine when someone cross the line.

That makes sense... even if we drew up biological metrics, they would be arbitrary (like blood pressure or body fat percentage &c).

In terms of identifying addiction, psychologists use the '3 Cs' - can you control it? do you experience cravings? are there life impacting negative consequences?

 

[casebro]

Is a 6 pack a day too much?

The study I am familiar with shows a J shaped curve of risk. 3 drinks per day is the healthiest, better than T-totaling. 6 per day eliminates that advantage, and gets you back to the norm. So as a norm, light drinking is OK. But if 6-8 gives you an
unquenchable thirst, you better get your drinking under control.

 

[casebro]

At any rate, I gave up consuming any and all alcohol and any and all fermented things forever, back in February..

Are you including yeasted breads, cheeses, and aged meats in that? Does Benedryl zonk you? If that describes your triggers, you might look up tyramine, and low tyramine diet. You may lack the CYP2D6 enzyme that breaks down Tyramine. 15% of people do have a prob there.