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Adhd

Liszt

Graduate Poster
Joined
Apr 7, 2007
Messages
1,026
This is in the CT section, because I think ADHD is a myth peddled by big pharma to lazy parents via overworked doctors.

Also, the following section is from my book (I used to link to my webpage in my sig, but took it out when I traced a vandal to this site. but anyway, I´ve written a book)

NOTE! Please do not quote or copy any of this OP in the replies...well, only small bits. (copyright issues etc)

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...Common behavioural traits in children are now being treated with drugs. Ritalin is one of the most popular, along with a cocktail of anti-depressants (side effect – depression!).

...Eli Lilly produced a drug called Strattera, which was turned down by the FDA as an anti-depressant. Later, it was, for some reason, accepted as treatment for ADHD – Attention Deficit Hyperactive Disorder.

In August 2004, Eli Lilly helpfully produced a pamphlet, which found itself in the waiting rooms of GPs, called the “ADHD Information booklet”. It was designed to help people understand why medication is necessary, although cynics believe it was simply an effort to increase sales (Eli Lilly’s revenue in 2006 was $14.5 billion). The innocent sounding word “Lilly” appears on each page.

Children are the primary targets of this particular medication – or perhaps their lazy parents, who had their children by accident and do not really want to take proper care of them.

This twenty-page pamphlet, with pictures of children laughing and playing on every other page, is worth a close look.

We are immediately told that ADHD is “one of the most common behavioural disorders of childhood and adolescence”, even though it was unheard of two decades ago. I was studying Human Psychology when news about this first appeared. No one thought parents would be mad enough to fall for this ruse drug their children, but we were wrong. So, do you have ADHD? Let’s look at some symptoms, and see if you, dear reader, or perhaps your children qualify for free amphetamine-based drugs…and note that these are complete and direct quotes, from page three… “What is ADHD and how do I recognise its symptoms?”

Hyperactivity – fidgety; has difficulty playing quietly; finds it hard to sit still; is always on the go; acts as if ‘driven by a motor’; talks excessively; runs excitedly and inappropriately

Impulsiveness – has difficulty awaiting turn; frequently interrupts; blurts out answers; intrudes on others; disobeys instructions

Inattentiveness – has difficulty sustaining attention and concentrating; does not seem to listen; is easily distracted; makes careless mistakes; finds it hard to organise or complete tasks; avoids sustained mental effort; loses things easily

Loses things easily? I think they forgot “breathes, eats and occasionally goes to the lavatory”.

You have probably seen “personality tests” where the same question is asked in a variety of different ways, because the person who devised the test assumes the respondent is stupid…well, look at these “symptoms” again. The same person seems to have written this helpful leaflet. It advises, in orange print, that the symptoms begin before the age of seven, and even admits, “As children mature towards adolescence, signs of excessive activity (e.g. excessive running, not remaining in seat etc.) [Presumably, this reminder, which appears on page four, are directed at parents who also suffer from ADHD] are less common, and hyperactive symptoms may be confined to fidgetiness, or inner feelings of restlessness or jitteriness”.

Now time for the emotional argument – a random quote, again in orange print, “I’m desperate to have friends, but they don’t want to play with me”.

Perhaps the most surreal bit of this disgraceful little piece of **** is the heading “A parent’s perspective of living with an ADHD child”, because it has a tiny number seven after it, pointing to reference point number seven on page twenty. Reference number seven simply says “Living with an ADHD child. The real story.” Sorry if you were expecting a peer reviewed study.
Don’t worry! Help is at hand. Page sixteen advises that “a number of medications are available”, among them, atomoxetine, also known as Strattera, made by Eli Lilly. The rest of the pamphlet merely paraphrases what was said in the first few pages. It is designed for the truly stupid, including a section called “What questions might you want to ask your doctor?” which gives nine possible questions for people who have forgotten how to think.

It is unfortunately easier for a parent of a difficult (wait, aren’t they all difficult?) child to medicate rather than educate and discipline, but obviously much more damaging in the long run. No satisfactory long-term effects of these drugs have been carried out, except the ones happening right now, all around us…on us.

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soooo...anyone here think they have ADHD? The only people who have disagreed with me on this in the past have been people who claim to have the disorder. Every psychologist I know believes that AHDH is a myth (psychiatrists, on the other hand, will fall for anything)
 
Not a myth. Overly diagnosed definitely but only a myth to those predisposed to think the medical profession is based on treatment instead of cure. Personally I think anyone who claims it's a myth has TS (total stupidity).
 
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Not a myth. Overly diagnosed definitely but only a myth to those predisposed to think the medical profession is based on treatment instead of cure. Personally I think anyone who claims it's a myth has TS (total stupidity).

eh? Ritalin (for example) is a treatment, not a cure. Did you leave your skeptical head at home, Enigma?

Have you read the list of symptoms? By "overly diagnosed", do you mean "diagnosed too often"?

and do you seriously think that pharma companies should be telling doctors what to do? No one in their right mind thinks that this is a good thing.
 
I beleive that ADHD is not a myth (have had to look after some ADHD scouts, not fun on a Ridge walk) incorrectly diagnosed in many cases or used as a catch all, yup. used as an excuse for behaviour by parents Most Definately!

to coin a lyric from HMHB "is your child hyperactive? or perhaps he is a [Rule8]"

No Pharmaceutical company should push specific drugs to the medical profession, the problem however is if one of the little ba... darlings decides to go on a 2 hour self destructive burnout taking soft furnishings and neighbourhood pets with him, the parents are prob going to blame their GP/Doctor for not doping little Tarquin or Tasha up the up to the eyeballs, so they can get on with their careers/lives without having to watch over them(Sorry had to live in Surrey too long *Shudder*)

In the Case of the Scouts, myself and the other leaders used to run an additional Stress free day for the parents whose kids where most definately too much, we also found out that it helped in many cases when we could find something to occupy them (one decided to to become a chef after we found out his tendancy to the campfire, we made him responsible for it and all food cooked on a 2 week camp, which he took to quite readily)

but in most cas... *oooooh shiny things*
*Bat, bat, ball goes left, right, left, right, under the fridge -- SQUIRREL *POUNCE* --- sunbeam zzzzz*

=^..^=
 
eh? Ritalin (for example) is a treatment, not a cure. Did you leave your skeptical head at home, Enigma?
There is much more to medicine than what your restricted viewpoint is capable of understanding.

By "overly diagnosed", do you mean "diagnosed too often"?
Define each word and then combine them and even someone suffering from TS will understand.

and do you seriously think that pharma companies should be telling doctors what to do? No one in their right mind thinks that this is a good thing.
You have no idea what the reps from drug companies do. They try to sell their product and at times they make "stupid" sales claims and even "bribe" but they in no way tell doctors their job. If that is the stupidity you believe, you don't have TS you have ASWD (Adult Stupidity and Woo Disorder), there is no cure. But Strattera may aleviate your symptoms :)
 
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A much more useful report or book would be trying to figure out what percentage of the medicated actually have ADHD. Everyone seems to be in agreement that it has been over-diagnosed, but I don't know if any studies that have examined just how much. The actual disorder is very real, I worked with a whole lot of those kids.

Also, posting an excerpt here, but asking us not to quote it in in-thread replies is utterly ridiculous. Once it appears in a thread, what difference does it make if a bit of it appears again eight inches down?

Also, quoting a small section of it for the purpose of commenting on it or "reviewing" it falls well within fair use. It makes no sense either way.
 
a great post, Furi (also, well done on being a scout leader.)

And smart move - giving the pyromaniac the job of cooking. You, sir, would make a fine psychologist (don't worry, that is a compliment. I think.)

Trisket - I´m afraid this proves nothing. My point is that ADHD is...well, read Furi's post.

Do not engage in personal attacks. And try to remain both civil and polite
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: brodski
 
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a great post, Furi (also, well done on being a scout leader.)

And smart move - giving the pyromaniac the job of cooking. You, sir, would make a fine psychologist (don't worry, that is a compliment. I think.)

Trisket - I´m afraid this proves nothing. My point is that ADHD is...well, read Furi's post.

Do not engage in personal attacks. And try to remain both civil and polite
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: brodski

Reported
 
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Do not engage in personal attacks. And try to remain both civil and polite
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: brodski
.
I'll leave the thread alone but I figured someone who works in a hospital pharmacy and has a BS in chemistry would at least be someone you would want to listen to. I was wrong
no one in this thread should engage in personal attacks
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: brodski
.
 
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He is clearly an open-minded researcher, dedicated to discovering the truth about the topic.
 
Also, posting an excerpt here, but asking us not to quote it in in-thread replies is utterly ridiculous. Once it appears in a thread, what difference does it make if a bit of it appears again eight inches down?

Also, quoting a small section of it for the purpose of commenting on it or "reviewing" it falls well within fair use. It makes no sense either way.

1 I can edit out my post, but I cannot edit someone elses, hence the request not to reprint the OP.

2 I said reprinting "small bits" is fine. So why make out that I didn't?

however, this

"A much more useful report or book would be trying to figure out what percentage of the medicated actually have ADHD. Everyone seems to be in agreement that it has been over-diagnosed, but I don't know if any studies that have examined just how much."


is spot on. It has probably been done. I really haven't looked into this for a couple of years - there could be a study out by now. If there isn't, someone should do one.

I deliberately said to word "myth" to get more reaction. That's pretty shameful, no? There would probably be no replies if I said "misdiagnosed" or whatever, as it is hardly a contraversial stance.

ETA - David, I was on your website the other day. You are a very witty writer!
 
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I deliberately said to word "myth" to get more reaction. That's pretty shameful, no? There would probably be no replies if I said "misdiagnosed" or whatever, as it is hardly a contraversial stance.
Screw leaving the thread. You now admit you meant mis-diagnosed so this thread is in the wrong section and you only said myth to get this bs post in the CT section. You would be a psychiatrists dream.
 
Screw leaving the thread. You now admit you meant mis-diagnosed so this thread is in the wrong section and you only said myth to get this bs post in the CT section. You would be a psychiatrists dream.

It's the internets, isn't it? It isn't the BMJ.

Chill out Enigma. And why do you want to "screw" everything? You would be a psychiatrist's dream.
 
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It's the internets, isn't it? It isn't the BMJ.

Chill out Enigma. And why do you want to "screw" everything? You would be a psychiatrist's dream.
Do you understand that the forum has subforums for a reason. This isn't your personal playground. This thread belongs in the science and medicine subforum where your stupid idea will get the proper thrashing it deserves. You didn't post there simply because you are afraid.
 
I will be moving this thread to SMMT, if people don't calm down, I'll move it to AAH.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: brodski
 
A much more useful report or book would be trying to figure out what percentage of the medicated actually have ADHD. Everyone seems to be in agreement that it has been over-diagnosed, but I don't know if any studies that have examined just how much. The actual disorder is very real, I worked with a whole lot of those kids.

How can you say it is over diagnosed or not? It is a collection of symptoms
 
How can you say it is over diagnosed or not? It is a collection of symptoms

I think David meant that the boundaries between normal and abnormal behaviour are blurred.

As in - how many boxes do you need to tick before you are officially ADHD?
 

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