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A question about LSD.

Juliette

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J
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Jul 1, 2006
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My 36 year old son is a paramedic/firefighter. Recently he applied for a job in a large department that recieved hundreds of applications. He scored #1 on the first round of written and oral review tests, and became one of 5 contenders for 3 openings.

Great. Then came the first part of the background investigation. His credit history has been excellent since he began working at age 16, he has never had as much as a traffic or parking violation, etc.

A few days after the first interview with the background investigator he recieved a letter informing him he was no longer being considered for the position, nor should he apply if future jobs became available in the department.

The investigator had told my son that they had even hired someone who had only been out of rehab a month for cocaine addiction, so to go ahead and tell him his entire drug history because it was unlikely to elimanate him. He fessed up.

In highschool (where he graduated 19 years ago), he smoked pot a few times, but didn't like it, and after about a month of experimenting with it quit and has not smoked it since. Fine. And one time, also in high school, when he was 16, he tried LSD. He hated it and has never done it since. Uh oh.

That was it. This is based on the belief that anyone who tried LSD even once in their life was always subject to flashbacks. This is why the letter informed him he would never be considered for this department.

Now this seems incredibly archaic to me. I understand that a certain high standard must be - or should be - expected of the people whose proffesions can mean life or death, but this seems over the top.

I have tried to find information that either proves or disproves the idea that a person - almost 20 years later - is subject to flashbacks. Can any one here help me find some answers?

Thanks everyone,
Julia
 
I'd be curious about how they're assessing risk here. Even if there is some risk of flashbacks (after a couple of, presumably flashback-free decades), I'd wonder how it compares to other risks. For example, the risk of relapse if someone is just one month out of rehab for coke addiction...
 
Juliette said:
The investigator had told my son that they had even hired someone who had only been out of rehab a month for cocaine addiction, so to go ahead and tell him his entire drug history because it was unlikely to elimanate him.
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jon said:
I'd be curious about how they're assessing risk here. Even if there is some risk of flashbacks (after a couple of, presumably flashback-free decades), I'd wonder how it compares to other risks. For example, the risk of relapse if someone is just one month out of rehab for coke addiction...
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Most likely, the investigator just lied about hiring the coke addict, to get him to "fess up".
 
From everything I've read (and experienced!) flashbacks of the type your son was disqualified over are an urban myth. Real flashbacks, of the kind everyone experiences, are nothing more than a strong rememberence of some traumatic event. Your son's problem getting this job was caused by the ignorance created by prohibition laws.
 
I thought that an LSD "flashback" was caused by a trace amount of the drug remaining in the fat tissue of the user for years or perhaps decades, to be later absorbed into the bloodstream, causing another drug-induced episode? Or is that just a myth they taught us in junior high school?
 
JamesDillon said:
I thought that an LSD "flashback" was caused by a trace amount of the drug remaining in the fat tissue of the user for years or perhaps decades, to be later absorbed into the bloodstream, causing another drug-induced episode? Or is that just a myth they taught us in junior high school?
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Yes, it is myth, at least from the articles I just looked at on the erowid web site. It seems to be about as great of an urban legend (as mmiller pointed out) as the old film Reefer Madness.

Julia
 
mmiller said:
From everything I've read (and experienced!) flashbacks of the type your son was disqualified over are an urban myth. Real flashbacks, of the kind everyone experiences, are nothing more than a strong rememberence of some traumatic event. Your son's problem getting this job was caused by the ignorance created by prohibition laws.
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Yep. If he was truly disqualified based on that, it is a travesty.

I, too, experimented at one time in my life, having tried LSD on numerous occasions. I quite enjoyed the drug actually. Now, I'm not comparing myself to your son (I have tons of other issues), but twenty years later and:

Flashbacks = 0
Traumatic memories = 0
Ill effects from LSD = 0

I can't believe a paramedic or firefighting organization would still be hanging onto "Refer Madness" type ignorance about drugs in this day and age.
 
Old man said:
Most likely, the investigator just lied about hiring the coke addict, to get him to "fess up".
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Oh, I agree. It seemed to me to be an obvious investigators tool. However, my son was also told that the next part of the background check would involve a polygraph test, and that the same questions would be asked. He went on to tell him that any sign of deception would be cause for an automatic dismissal. Since the one LSD use was something he disclosed to the district where he currently works, and had still gotten the job over 60-plus applicants, he felt he needed to go ahead and reveal it once again.

Julia
 
Juliette said:
Yes, it is myth, at least from the articles I just looked at on the erowid web site. It seems to be about as great of an urban legend (as mmiller pointed out) as the old film Reefer Madness.

Julia
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Reefer Madness is exactly the right analogy. "They" knew they didn't like (fill in drug name here) but knew bugger-all about it, so they came up with some way of demonising it. Another common myth was that trippers jumped off tall buildings because "they thought they could fly". How they elicited that fact from pavement-jam is anybody's guess.
 
JamesDillon said:
I thought that an LSD "flashback" was caused by a trace amount of the drug remaining in the fat tissue of the user for years or perhaps decades, to be later absorbed into the bloodstream, causing another drug-induced episode? Or is that just a myth they taught us in junior high school?
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It's actually weak calcium bonds in the bones. But like just about everything else, there's an Arrhenius equation associated with it. 19 years is long enough to make a flashback highly improbable.
 
Bright idea

Juliette said:
My 36 year old son is a paramedic/firefighter. Recently he applied for a job in a large department that recieved hundreds of applications. He scored #1 on the first round of written and oral review tests, and became one of 5 contenders for 3 openings.

Juliette- Your son sounds bright. Maybe he should redirect his career and pursue something more medical-related. He should also write an article about his experience for a newspaper. It would be fascinating.
I find it nasty that he told the truth and was punished for this virtue. I also find it hard to believe that there are all these firefighters out there who never abused or used in their past, -weed, alcohol, or whatever the drug of choice in their cultural upbringing.
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epepke said:
It's actually weak calcium bonds in the bones. But like just about everything else, there's an Arrhenius equation associated with it. 19 years is long enough to make a flashback highly improbable.
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O.K., I plead total ignorance. Arrhenius equation?

Thanks,
Julia
 
One of the researchers working for the government did a study on LSD linking it to birth defects or genetic mutation. This study was later found to be flawed. The researcher went on to do a fertility practice and ended up arrested for fraud related to his business. The government used to give special considerations to people who produced "good studies" showing drugs to be bad for human consumption. This apparently motivated people to publish crap in order to get a favor from Uncle Sam.
 
it seems like if the company is like that, maybe your son wouldnt want to work there.
i agree, even if there was some legitimacy to the concept of "flashbacks" i dont think that is grounds for passing on someone for a job because there are so many other like experiences that could have a bigger impact on your performance. next thing you know, they will be asking if you ever have arguments with your wife or if you ever have more than two beers at dinner, cause theres a lot more chance of those things proccupying your mind and leading to poor performance.

sadly, at the very least, your son has learned to just use a white lie. i consider that if someone asks you "have you ever smoked" to mean "have you had a habit?" smoking socially a few times in college doesnt count. same for drugs.
 
I've taken LSD at least 100 times and have numerous experiences with other hallucinogens - DMT, Salvia, Psilocybin, Amarita etc - and a few difficult experiences with them - but NEVER anything coming close to a "Flashback"
 
Cute as all this anicdotal evidence is lets have a look at what the reseach has to say.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=7965440&query_hl=1&itool=pubmed_docsum

Drugs simular to LSD may cause problems

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=6135405&query_hl=1&itool=pubmed_docsum

They exist

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...t_uids=1254369&query_hl=1&itool=pubmed_docsum

adding marijuana to the mix does not appear to help

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=8251869

It exists but the doctors like to call it post-hallucinogen perceptual disorder

In short it is rare (don't ask me how rare figures go from 20 odd percent on down) but appears to be real.
 
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