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"180" Movie

JudeBrando

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y2KsU_dhwI

http://180movie.com/


http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=1437294

"A well-known evangelist says his new documentary has the capability to change a person's mind on the issue of abortion in a matter of seconds."

"180, a documentary set to debut September 26, is produced by Living Waters, a ministry headed by evangelist Ray Comfort. The film documents eight people who were adamantly pro-abortion, but changed their minds on the issue after they were asked a question on the topic."

"It really is a matter of perspective," Comfort decides. "Knowledge is very, very powerful, and when we have knowledge, it can send information; it can change our whole perspective. That's exactly what happens. The reason why we called it '180' is because people do a 18- turn, not only about the abortion issue, but about the issue of the gospel."


http://thenewamerican.com/culture/family/9171-new-online-video-set-to-change-abortion-debate

"A new online movie released September 26 by Christian apologist Ray Comfort is poised to radically change the abortion debate in the United States and beyond. Entitled 180 because of the complete change of heart eight “pro-choice” individuals in the film have just moments after being confronted with the truth about abortion, the movie had nearly 30,000 views on YouTube within 24 hours of its release, prompting some observers to predict that the free online movie is destined to go viral — meaning millions will log on to view it over the next few months."
 
What's your point Jude? Just cutting and pasting stuff without any comment or question is tantamount to spamming in my opinion.
 
WOW, Jude
Ray Comfort?
Yer coming here with Ray Comfort
Does it involve bananas?
By the way Jude seeing as how you seem to be profoundly ignorant of the bible please give us your opinion of what Numbers 5:21-21, 27-28 means in context of the abortion debate.
 
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I am so sure that watching a movie about eight idiots that changed their mind and are now on the wrong side of an issue will make me disregard all logic and reason.
 
The film documents eight people who were adamantly pro-abortion, but changed their minds on the issue after they were asked a question on the topic.

They were asked one question, and changed their mind? So they have this powerful tool to turn unbeliever into believers, and instead of using it as a weapon for their cause, they won't let you hear this mind changing question unless you buy their movie?

Ray Comfort has done his 'one question that will change your mind' thing before. It didn't work then, it won't work now.
 
For those of us who can't be bothered to watch the video, can you tell us what the question that supposedly changes people's positions on this is?

After all, if we were to watch the video, the only reason would be to find out what the question is, not to listen to cherry-picked anecdotes of people who changed their position.

You can put it in a spoiler if you like.
 
Here's his last attempt at converting someone with one question, in a sort of perverted version of the Socratic method:

 
And then there's, err, this:



Umm, apparently, if God doesn't want you to have an abortion, he will send Ray Comfort to talk to you..

But there's no revelation about his magical question.
 
I was expecting a slimmed-down sequel to 300.

"Three-fifths the Spartans. Five-thirds the bravery!" raves Ben Lyons in USA Today.
 
From what I've read elsewhere, it's basically equating abortion to the Holocaust and having a person admit that they really don't want to be another Hitler.

I don't know if anybody really changes their mind on this issue, as much as he forces a connection from the against Hitler dot to the against abortion dot. This is, after all, the same man who believes he disproved abiogenesis by opening a jar of peanut butter and not seeing life spontaneously spring into being.
 
Here's his last attempt at converting someone with one question, in a sort of perverted version of the Socratic method:



That was... pathetic. I know I'm "preaching to the converted", and I've heard these same arguments before but...

First of all this video assumes that being nice has something to do with following the ten commandments. (Where are the commandments against raping children, burning down your neighbor's house while they're out, kicking puppies, or being mean and nasty?) But that's not really part of the argument.

Saying "What do you call someone who tells lies? A liar." is an equivocation. You could just as well argue:

"What do you call someone who paints?"
"A painter."
"Have you ever painted?"
"Yes."
"Then I guess that makes you a painter."

You couldn't honestly describe someone as a painter unless they're painting or paint often. You couldn't honestly describe someone as a liar unless they're lying or lie often.

Same goes for the argument about stealing, and the thing about looking at a woman with lust being the same thing as adultery is nonsensical.

The funny bit is how it says that only a corrupt judge would let a criminal go free without punishment. Applying this same logic to the next part, surely only an insane and/or evil judge would let a criminal go free in exchange for punishing an innocent person?

Of course, none of the arguments in the video make any sense unless you already accept the Christian faith, and if you accept the Christian faith you don't need to watch the video to accept Christ, so the whole thing is pointless.

And then there's, err, this:


So Ray (claims that) he heard about a new convert who was about to have an abortion, rushed over to the hospital, burst into her room (why would they let him in or tell him which room?) and demanded that she not go through with the abortion. And the woman says that she prayed to God that if he didn't want her to have an abortion, he should send Ray Comfort to talk to her.

That's very strange thing to pray for. Why didn't she just pray to God that if he didn't want her to have the baby, he should let her win the major prize in the lottery? And if she had sufficient reason to have an abortion despite it being against her newfound religious beliefs, why would she be praying for a sign to tell her not to go ahead with it? Ray's sudden appearance wouldn't change the underlying circumstances.
 
The question is: "If you were sitting in a bulldozer with a bunch of Nazis pointing machine guns at you ordering you to bury Jews alive, would you do it?"

Some people do say that they probably would do it, then Ray asks them if they would shoot the Jews themselves, and then they usually say no.

Godwin for the win, Ray.
 
Okay, I watched the movie. Let me sum it up:

It's 33 minutes long. The first 10 minutes are used to describe what an awful person Hitler was. A lot of people are interviewed asking if they know who Hitler is, and what they think of him. Since he's also at some neo-nazi rally asking these questions, the answers are mixed.

People are asked, it's 1939, you have a sniper rifle and have Hitler in your sights, would you shoot?

Most say yes.

He then asks, what if it's Hitler's mom, pregnant, would you shoot her?

Most hesitate a bit before they say yes.

There's a lot of nazi and holocaust imagery, including a lot of photos of dead Jews in mass graves.

Hitler is described by Comfort as someone who hated Christianity, and saw himself as God.

(Already you can see the great appeal to emotion coming, huh?)

That's the 10 minute 'intro'.



Comfort then continues asking people questions.

It's 1943, you're in a concentration camp. The nazis have put you in a bulldozer in front of a ditch full of Jews. They tell you that either you drive the bulldozer and fill the ditch, or they'll kill you. Will you?

Most say it's a hard question, but come to the conclusion that there's little choice. They'd do it.

He then asks if they'd been given a rifle instead, and asked to shoot all the Jews, would they still do it?

Most hestitate for some time, then say they wouldn't. Why? Because it would be harder.

He then says, so you value life?

People say yes.

He then asks, what do you think about abortion?

Most say they support it, it's a woman's right to choose.

He asks, so when does it become a life?

One woman says three months, and then we're off to a video showing a 6 week 6 day old fetus. You can see eyes, hands, feet, etc.

Others are asked, when does it become a life? A few different answers.

He then asks, ok, finish this sentence: It's ok to kill a baby in the womb when...?

A hard question for many. One woman replies "when it comes from something that shouldn't have happened." Most struggle.

So he asks, ok, I'm a construction builder, and I'm going to blow up a building. There's a possibility there's someone in there, but I just don't know. I'm going to blow it up anyway. What would you say?

The answer goes unanswered, as he jumps right to asking, what justifies killing a baby in the womb?

Some replies of if you can't support it, etc.

So he ask, can you say that's like saying, before you bury those Jews alive, just give us a though and then bury them alive.

(Didn't make much sense to me, no wonder they struggled with that one..)

He then says, so you would give your life for the Jews who would die anyway, but you won't speak up about abortion, you won't speak up about the murder of children in the womb? I would like you to say, that's wrong! To kill a child in it's safest place, it's mother's womb, and to actually go in there and destroy it, for selfish reasons?! Tell me a reason for killing a baby in the womb!

"Well, if it's rape or something like that.... It's tough."

Comfort says, why is it tough? Why would you kill a baby for the crime of the father? Which is worse, murder or rape?



Blah blah, 6th commandment, thou shalt not kill, it's never right to kill a baby in the womb. Hitler declared Jews as non-human, and that's exactly what you do when you declare a fetus to be non-human! If you're not sure, that's taking a huge risk with someone's life, imagine if someone said that about you when you were three months and they decided to kill you for selfish reasons.

There's a lot of this. "So if you feel you can't take care of the baby, you'll kill it?" "Why would you advocate the murder of a child when you know thou shalt not kill?" Etc, etc.



One woman says that sometimes there are medical problems, sometimes there are defects, their quality of life will be restrained into a 9 by 9 hospital room..

Comfort says, there are nazis in front of you, and they're going to kill kids with Down's syndrome. They're going to kill them all, they did this. You think that's ok, then?

Absolutely not, she replies.

Comfort counters, but they get a bad quality of life!

There's more of this. "How can you make that judgment when the child is still not born?" "I can say that about any child - I think this child will have a bad life, so I think I'll kill it." Blabla...



He then says, we're talking about a holocaust in America, in our country, that's sanctioned by the government.

He, asks a guy, so you think it's ok to kill a child in the womb?

He replies, I don't think it's ok, I just don't think that, umm...

Comfort interrupts him with, but isn't that what Nazi Germany was about, like saying, "What Hitler did was wrong, I think it's his choice, I don't think it's ok, but he did it and it was his choice to do it bla bla bla bla can you say it's a similar thing?"

The guy agrees, "err, I guess, when you put it like that, yeah, very similar. I guess me saying it's ok for someone to choose is the same as saying it was ok for Hitler choose.."

Comfort asks if he's going to change his stance on abortion.

Guy says yes, and we have our first convert!



One woman is told, along with more holocaust images,I'd like you to feel like you would in Germany, when Jews were being killed all around you. You'd be horrified, and we've got a holocaust in America, in which real babies are being murdered because of a woman's choice, and it's legal, just like in Nazi Germany!

She gets no reply.

Another woman says, I think in some situations, it can be necessary.

Comfort asks, do you think there's a baby in the womb?

Yes, she replies.

Comfort then asks, finish the sentence for me: Killing a baby in the womb is ok when..?

She has no answer.

Another woman is asked the same.

She replies, well maybe adoption would be better.

So you've changed your mind on abortion, Comfort asks.

She replies yes, it sounds bad when you put it like that.

Convert number 2!



The woman who a bit further up had no answer to when it was ok to kill a baby is asked if she would vote for someone who was for the killing of children in the womb?

She says no, and confirms she has changed her stance.

Convert number 3!



Another woman again. Ray says, and just as you felt strongly about the life of Jews, and we need to rise up as one person and speak against it, don't you think we need to do that about the issue of abortion?

She replies, I think you have a valid point there!

More holocaust images.

Convert number 4!



An earlier girl says, I feel it should be allowed, because it is a choice, but I personally will not do it.

Comfort counters, so you wouldn't kill Jews, but it's ok for someone else to kill them?

Yes, she says.

There's a new woman, and Comfort asks, so what would you say to someone like you in Germany that says, well you should never kill Jews, but I think people should have a right to do it?

The woman is flabbergasted.

Comfort says, that's what you're saying!

The woman reluctantly agrees.

Comfort asks if she has changed her mind about abortion, and she says yes and 'will vote differently in the future'.

Convert number 5!



An earlier man appears, and Comfort asks if he has changed his mind on abortion.

Yes, he says, when you put it like that, it does change your mind!

Convert number 6!



Another man from earlier appears, saying it's never ok to kill a baby in the womb.

Comfort asks if he has changed his mind on abortion. The man says yes, and says he will 'vote against abortion'.

Convert number 7!



A woman from earlier appears, and is asked the question, 'it's ok to kill a baby when..?' She says that in her heart it's never.

Then we cut away from her for some reason, and another woman is asked if she has changed her mind on abortion.

Yes, she replies.

Convert number 8!



Yet another woman, and she's asked if she believes it's a baby in the womb.

Yes, she replies.

Comfort asks, so what's the justification for killing a baby in the womb? Think of one!

She hesitates quite a bit.. "Humpf, hmm, for killing a baby in the womb?"

Comfort: Just give me a situation where you'd say, 'yeah, that's justifiable. You can kill that baby because of..?'

She can't think of any reasons.



We then get some text... "Unborn babies killed in the American Holocaust in the first 37 years after Roe vs. Wade: 53,310,843" - with the number flashing across the screen.

More Nazi imagery appears, with Comfort telling us that Hitler hated the ten commandments.

A lot of Nazi stuff continues, telling us how awful they were and how much Hitler hated Christianity. Although it's an extreme example, Comfort tells us, it's common practice to have a low moral standard when we free ourselves from the ten commandments.

There's still 10 minutes left of the video. The rest seems to be a summary, and some back patting by Comfort. I can't watch anymore.



TL;DR: Appeal to emotion!



So there you have it, folks: Ray Comfort's ONE question that will instantly change your stance on abortion !

I'm off to wash my brain... :(
 
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It's obvious that he interviewed a lot of people, then picked the replies he liked. I wonder what the ratio of people who were convinced to people who weren't was.
 
Whoops- got here late. I need someone to fill me in. Luckily it's a JudeBrando thread, so just tell me what stage we are at:

1. Post a religiously or socially conservative quote as OP

2. Wait around 2 pages for comments by others to accumulate

3. Quote mine to accuse other posters of being stinky liberal anti-God atheist scum. Avoid any mention of the actual answers provided by other posters, but instead claim that they were unable to respond to the OP and attacked the messenger instead.

4. When other posters get annoyed and ask you (JB) what your position is on the quote, say you have no position. Claim instead that you are only asking questions, that you were testing the other Forum members to see if they can discuss an issue politely and logically, and say that they failed the test. Again accuse them of attacking the messenger and being close minded.

5. When posters point out in detail the logical, specific answers to the OP, disappear for a few days.

6. Start a new OP.
 

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