Psychics and Missing People - Page 13

rjh01 · 30th March 2006, 01:17 AM

If you are worried that someone may send you spam after you send them e-mails, create a new e-mail account and use that. There are several organisations that will create e-mail accounts for you. If you then receive spam you can abandon it.

Kelly · 30th March 2006, 01:31 AM

Let the Sylvia Browne stories begin.

I can sleep at night. I don't know how she can.

Ducky · 30th March 2006, 01:38 AM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

Let the Sylvia Browne stories begin.

I can sleep at night. I don't know how she can.

It's 2:40 in the morning. If you can sleep, then do so!!!

As for Sylvia, I hear she eats babies. Raw.

Gr8wight · 30th March 2006, 06:20 AM

Originally Posted by CFLarsen

Still got the names of those psychics?

Keep documentation.

Unfortunately, that information is securely stored on the defective hard drive of my previous computer.

prewitt81 · 30th March 2006, 06:56 AM

Originally Posted by rjh01

If you are worried that someone may send you spam after you send them e-mails, create a new e-mail account and use that. There are several organisations that will create e-mail accounts for you. If you then receive spam you can abandon it.

Yeah, I ended up going with an anonymous email address. We'll see how it goes.

CFLarsen · 30th March 2006, 07:18 AM

Originally Posted by Gr8wight

Unfortunately, that information is securely stored on the defective hard drive of my previous computer.

Tsk, tsk...

Luke T. · 30th March 2006, 08:37 AM

Thought you all might be interested in hearing what happened to a co-worker's niece a couple weeks ago.

We were just talking about myspace.com and what an evil little web site it is on SkepticalCommunity and it prompted me to tell the story. I've been thinking about posting it here ever since it happened, but just never got around to it.

Anyway.

Here's pretty much what I posted on SC:

A niece of a co-worker was recently (couple weeks ago) nearly kidnapped by a guy she met on myspace. It was only through quick action on my coworker's part that she was rescued at the last possible moment.

Typical clueless problem child teenager. This guy tells her he's the member of a grunge band and a recruiter for Hollywood movies. Promises her he can get her into a movie in California and she will make $600,000.

She was disowned by her parents and living in an apartment with a 34 year old woman. Fortunately, this woman was on her game and started checking a lot of this guy's claims on the internet and showed the kid he was lying. One particular claim was about being a member of a band, which he named. He said they were a California band, and the roommate found it was a real band, only out of Pennsylvania. Other stuff like that wasn't adding up.

But the kid didn't want to hear it. So she tells the guy to come to her town and she will meet him and leave town with him. She quits her grocery store job and tells her roommate she is leaving.

The guy arrives by bus. Yeah. Big picture Hollywood man comes in on a bus. He then tells her he lost his driver's license and money and she has to pay for their hotel room. Yeah. Big picture Hollywood man has no money or identification proving he is who he says he is.

So she wants to stay in town until she can pick up her last grocery store paycheck before they run off to California together. And this is what probably saved her life, because while this was going on, the now ex-roommate has alerted the family, who seem apathetic after all the crap they have had to put up with from her, except for her uncle, my co-worker.

Somewhere along the line, the roommate had challenged this creep on the phone. And during the conversation, he said, "Why aren't you dead?" This was enough for my co-worker to go to the police, and for the police to go after him for threatening bodily harm when he came to town.

Her uncle (my co-worker) was able to track her location because his niece had told the grocery store where she would be.

So the cop goes with my coworker to the hotel and they knock on the door. At first the policeman says nothing as the uncle talks to his niece through the door. But they won't open it. So uncle asks the cop, "Can't you do something?" So the policeman says, "This is the police!", and the big picture Hollywood recruiter grunge band member bolts from the room and jumps out the back window, much to the shock and amazement of the idiot kid.

Luke T. · 30th March 2006, 08:40 AM

Unfortunately, the bad guy got away and the only person who has seen his face is the niece.

Dr Adequate · 30th March 2006, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

Let the Sylvia Browne stories begin.

I can sleep at night. I don't know how she can.

Cold readers don't necessarily know that they're doing it.

I've only seen two kinds of ex-psychics. One sort says "Yes, I was [swiki]Hot Reading[/swiki], I'm a fraud." The other sort says "I was [swiki]Cold Reading[/swiki], and I had no idea."

One of the latter category is our very own poster Nex.

But I've never seen anyone say "I was cold reading and I knew it." Now I think about it, the reason for this is obvious --- a deliberate fraud wouldn't confine himself / herself to cold reading --- they'd always do it hot if they could.

If cold readers can fool an audience, and they can, then they can fool themselves.

Hagrok · 30th March 2006, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by Luke T.

Unfortunately, the bad guy got away and the only person who has seen his face is the niece.

Bet his fingerprints are in a database somewhere...

Luke T. · 30th March 2006, 11:17 AM

Originally Posted by Hagrok

Bet his fingerprints are in a database somewhere...

That's what I was thinking. I said as much to my co-worker, but I can't recall what his reply was. I don't know if they lifted fingerprints or not.

Luke T. · 30th March 2006, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by Dr Adequate

But I've never seen anyone say "I was cold reading and I knew it." Now I think about it, the reason for this is obvious --- a deliberate fraud wouldn't confine himself / herself to cold reading --- they'd always do it hot if they could.

The Psychic Mafia bears this out. A good read on the tricks the author and his cohorts pulled as deliberately fraudulent psychics to make their readings as hot as possible.

Mr. Stick · 30th March 2006, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Dr Adequate

Cold readers don't necessarily know that they're doing it. ........

But I've never seen anyone say "I was cold reading and I knew it." Now I think about it, the reason for this is obvious --- a deliberate fraud wouldn't confine himself / herself to cold reading --- they'd always do it hot if they could.

Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds?
The impression I get from stage performers claiming to talk to the dead, is that they are very well aware what they are doing, and they talk to people all the time without prior knowledge.
If they used hot reading they would do much better than they do.

Luke T. · 30th March 2006, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. Stick

Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds?
The impression I get from stage performers claiming to talk to the dead, is that they are very well aware what they are doing, and they talk to people all the time without prior knowledge.
If they used hot reading they would do much better than they do.

All we see are her live appearances. Spontaneous readings on people she couldn't know anything about.

We do not see her private readings with regular clients or with clients who have to give their full name and credit card number.

Read "The Psychic Mafia" to get an idea. Psychics keep records on their clients and trade that information with each other.

Kelly · 31st March 2006, 09:55 AM

Thank you, Luke, for presenting the story about the near disaster with the misled teenager. This happens more often than we realize.

If you are a parent of a teen, or even a pre-teen, know what they are doing, especially on the internet.

Just 2 nights ago, I had a phone interview with the mom of a missing teen from NV. She was lured away in a similar fashion. NOw she's living the life of a prostitute and is a meth user. She's only 15. Cops don't care because they say she's a "runaway". Apparently, the laws in NV are so lax that no one can effectively react to this. They even had the man in question in their hands for drug possesion, but said they couldn't charge him in relation to the girl. Of course, he did not appear at his trial.

It's a system gone mad.

Don't think it can't happen to you.

alfaniner · 31st March 2006, 11:12 AM

[quote=Mr. Stick;1539132]Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds?
...[quote]

I think the key word was "ex-psychics". The current frauds know full well what they are doing.

Kelly · 31st March 2006, 05:29 PM

I would like your opinions, please.

Would having a post on humor in my series on psychics detract from its professionalism? In this post, I would briefly discuss the need for humor in dealing with the issue, and then include some psychic jokes.

rjh01 · 31st March 2006, 05:44 PM

Humour in the right hands can be a powerful weapon.
How about this one I just invented.

'I would like to report my son is missing.'
'Hey are you not that famous psychics who finds missing people?'
'Yes. Glad you recognise me.'

Kelly · 31st March 2006, 05:57 PM

Thank you for the comment and the joke.

If I decide to do this, I'll start a psychic joke thread on the Humor forum rather than have them posted here. The humor forum is an appropriate place for them.

Dr Adequate · 31st March 2006, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

I would like your opinions, please.

Would having a post on humor in my series on psychics detract from its professionalism? In this post, I would briefly discuss the need for humor in dealing with the issue, and then include some psychic jokes.

It's hard to do. I make fun of everything I can, but psychics in themselves aren't funny. Their particular arguments are often funny, but the thing itself is just disgusting.

Dr Adequate · 31st March 2006, 08:14 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. Stick

Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds?
The impression I get from stage performers claiming to talk to the dead, is that they are very well aware what they are doing, and they talk to people all the time without prior knowledge.
If they used hot reading they would do much better than they do.

Well, I think you just made my point.

If she was a fraud, then she would hot-read, and do much better than she does.

In fact, she's rubbish, she flails around wildly, and her audience believes in her. And so does she.

I'm sure the fatuous preening self-deluding stupid bitch sleeps very well. I suffer from insomnia. What of it?

Kelly · 31st March 2006, 11:08 PM

Originally Posted by Dr Adequate

It's hard to do. I make fun of everything I can, but psychics in themselves aren't funny. Their particular arguments are often funny, but the thing itself is just disgusting.

THis is why I am torn about it. rjh's joke was not bad, but yet it stung just the same. I do firmly believe in the importance of having a sense of humor in trying times.

I'm also insomniac, so my comment about her sleeping at night was more of a jab at her apparent lack of a conscience than her sleeping habits.

Kelly · 31st March 2006, 11:54 PM

The San Antonio police ask for psychic's help according to this article:

http://www.woai.com/mostpopular/stor...6-DB1D9A9CA35F

prewitt81 · 1st April 2006, 12:04 AM

Quote:

UTSA police followed every lead in their search for Fuentes. Chief Hernandez says they got help from the San Antonio Police Department and even psychics to try to track her down.

The way I read that, it seems like the psychics offered help. Very vague wording there.

Kelly · 2nd April 2006, 09:37 AM

Originally Posted by prewitt81

The way I read that, it seems like the psychics offered help. Very vague wording there.

Yes, it was vague, but there was no real purpose in even mentioning it since obviously this is not what solved the case.

prewitt81 · 2nd April 2006, 01:26 PM

Agreed.

Zoinked168 · 2nd April 2006, 02:41 PM

Why couldn't I find the delete button sooner than elaine's lighting quick reflexes. I ment to post it as a private message...

Just dig myself a hole now...

Although I wanted the post below to be private, I still believe it to be true. So if im banned from this forum because of it, then frankly I'm not bothered.

elaine · 2nd April 2006, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by Zoinked168

I am deeply sorry to hear about your son's disappearance. I know you don't want to hear some claimed psychic tell you a bunch pie in the sky for money. I don't have to have any special ability's to sense your frustration and hurt over Jason. I have some experience in locating objects and "scanning" peoples health. I myself was curious about the whereabouts of your son. I know my findings could be either devastating or bring some hope to you and your family. This is such a delicate matter which I'm not totally comfortable with. I so deeply regret to say that I found no trace of Jason's energy on earth. I have checked and re-checked hoping that I could be wrong. You could clarify this for yourself and you do not need any special abilities. But you do need a clear mind with is no easy feat. But if you can, relax and feel your own heartbeat and then picture Jason and what his heart would be doing. Then change your thoughts to your other son's heartbeat and try to see a difference. It takes time but the answer lies within you.
I am so sorry to give this news to a mother, but I feel that your mind will never rest until you find the truth.

Please accept my humblest apologies and I can only hope you don't think me as a fruit. If you do, then I accept that and I understand why and I wish you well in your search.

Deepest Regards Zoe

Unbelievable

Roadtoad · 2nd April 2006, 03:04 PM

I'll give zoinked credit:

1.) No money was requested.

2.) The answer given was honestly offered.

3.) It was a hard one to offer any parent.

I'm hoping Zoinked is wrong. No, I don't want to see this person banned, but maybe, over time, they might realize just what is truly going on in their heart and mind.

An "A" for compassion. Everything else... That's not up to me.

Kelly · 2nd April 2006, 03:07 PM

Zoe,

You will not be banned for claiming "psychic" abilities. What I fail to understand though is why you ignore my request to not come to me with your claims. Assuming you came here through the blog series, (surely you have seen it and read the disclaimer at the bottom of each post, OR you have read enough of this thread to have made this clear.) you know that I do not entertain anything psychics have to say as truth regarding my son.

You sound like a kind, yet misguided person. I don't wish to be unkind to you, but your notion of being able to know whether or not Jason's heart is beating is pure nonsense. (sensing his "energy" as you phrased it)

Every single psychic who has ever approached me tells me he is dead, so you are no different. If you have specific details about his death and disappearance, as with any of the others who now come to me, I encourage you to call our police detectives and share this with with them. I let them decide if there is anything of value to follow up. I guarantee you that they will listen to you, so please don't use that as an excuse not to call them.

Here's the number: 402-444-5647

Why don't you create your own thread to discuss your psychic abilities? If you have confidence in it, you should have no objection to doing that.

Kelly

Zoinked168 · 2nd April 2006, 03:44 PM

Firstly, thank-you for not immediately discrediting my honest thoughts. I understand that you require details and hard evidence, even in my shoes I want to see the the real facts for my allegation even though the subject nature is painfully sensitive.

I do not sell myself short in offering services to the public and I am afraid that even if I could prove some abilities, it would be too costly for myself or you Kelly as I would physically have to travel to your location, and it would be a lengthy investigation which I cannot afford to pursue at the moment as I am studying.

At no point did I say I possess psychic abilities, This term is coined too loosely for start and what I do know is that I deal with the manipulation of quantimbioelectromagnetic energy. The discussion of ESP has only recently been brought to light and what I know and practice, I fail to see an exact resemblance to what is known yet to the masses.

So although this probably appears to be a "cop-out" in my resistance to help at this point of time, I do intend to prove my capabilities in other areas than missing people.

This is me sticking my neck out into the world where I have grown tired of skeptics in the past and given up explaining and even demonstrating to. I have nothing to prove but to myself. I hope people will understand that one day.

Zoinked168 · 2nd April 2006, 03:53 PM

Further more, I would like to add that I totally support the notion of exposing frauds in the ESP department. They are a disgrace to themselves and the people they effect. So I really don't mind if you try to pick holes through my words because I know I speak the truth and frauds just make my life harder and frustrate me. This is something that fascinates my own mind and I am curious to know and see real results which no one has been proved as yet.

delphi_ote · 2nd April 2006, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Zoinked168

Further more, I would like to add that I totally support the notion of exposing frauds in the ESP department. They are a disgrace to themselves and the people they effect. So I really don't mind if you try to pick holes through my words because I know I speak the truth and frauds just make my life harder and frustrate me. This is something that fascinates my own mind and I am curious to know and see real results which no one has been proved as yet.

So why not win a Million Dollars?

Kelly · 2nd April 2006, 04:32 PM

Zoe,

You claim paranormal abilities. To be able to know if a person is alive or dead in the manner you suggest is not a normal ability. Pardon me for the psychic label.

I have a few questions for you:

Are you saying that you are not going to discuss this ability on your own thread?

Are you saying that you know nothing more than that Jason is not alive, and that you would not know more than that without coming here?

Do you have any intention of notifying the police, assuming you have details?

If you do not have any more answers and are not willing to discuss your claimed abilities, I do not see much purpose in your having contacted me.

In a nutshell, you said: "Sorry, lady, but your kid is dead."

What value does that hold for me? What value does it hold for any of the members here or the purpose of the thread/forum?

Thank you.

Kelly

Zoinked168 · 2nd April 2006, 04:37 PM

delphi_ote...I have looked into applying already. But this is not about the money. This is bigger than the material world...doesn't anyone see that yet?! Besides, this is not a win lose scenario or anything to do with numeric lottery odds.

My intention is be in James Randi's labs making history in regards to ESP. I do have a life too and I have no intentions of being a lab rat for the rest of my life.

ysabella · 2nd April 2006, 04:43 PM

You should read the Challenge guidelines. There is no "lab."

Zoinked168 · 2nd April 2006, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

Zoe,

You claim paranormal abilities. To be able to know if a person is alive or dead in the manner you suggest is not a normal ability. Pardon me for the psychic label.

I have a few questions for you:

Are you saying that you are not going to discuss this ability on your own thread?

Are you saying that you know nothing more than that Jason is not alive, and that you would not know more than that without coming here?

Do you have any intention of notifying the police, assuming you have details?

If you do not have any more answers and are not willing to discuss your claimed abilities, I do not see much purpose in your having contacted me.

In a nutshell, you said: "Sorry, lady, but your kid is dead."

What value does that hold for me? What value does it hold for any of the members here or the purpose of the thread/forum?

Thank you.

Kelly

Kelly, Before I can answer your valid questions, I have one for you. What is a "normal ability"? The whole concept behind ESP is that everyone could potentially tap into this unused resource in our brain. This is why I suggest you try it yourself.

I have briefly talked about locating people with my past mentor sometime ago now. I have some rough idea where to start but even with a natural ability, it is useless without a good technique. Everything connected to humans has evolved and improved over time, even thinking and logic for example. It would require a lot of my time to develop this independently. This is one skill out of dozens of known phenomena, and there are still limitless of unknown ones too yet to be developed. If you have looked into energy practices such as Qi-Gong you will notice that the technique has practically not evolved at all since it was established and there is only "one way of doing it", this I believe to be false not to question and improve upon something which dates back thousands of years.

I really hope you can see my view-point on this and see if it makes a little sense.

I hope that once I have established myself as genuine you will take my words more to heart. Until then, take it as you will. I force feed no one. I only ask for everyone and anyone who takes an interest in ESP to experiment for themselves before they apply straight-up knock'em down approach. Perhaps I am naive in my belief's, but regardless I see the practicalities and possible usages for the world we live in today.

I'm off to bed now. I hope that this has partly answered your questions. I will elaborate and answer any more questions you may have when I am able too

delphi_ote · 2nd April 2006, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by Zoinked168

delphi_ote...I have looked into applying already. But this is not about the money. This is bigger than the material world...doesn't anyone see that yet?! Besides, this is not a win lose scenario or anything to do with numeric lottery odds.

My intention is be in James Randi's labs making history in regards to ESP. I do have a life too and I have no intentions of being a lab rat for the rest of my life.

Take the test and use the money to feed starving children. Prove to the world and all the skeptics once and for all that psychic powers are real. Win the Nobel Prize and feed more starving children. Start a revolution in science and alter the course of history.

One simple test is all it would take.

elaine · 2nd April 2006, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Zoinked168

Why couldn't I find the delete button sooner than elaine's lighting quick reflexes. I ment to post it as a private message...

Just dig myself a hole now...

Although I wanted the post below to be private, I still believe it to be true. So if im banned from this forum because of it, then frankly I'm not bothered.

Fastest keystroke in the west :-).

But honestly Zoinked, I have no doubt that you have the best of intentions. If you really do have this ability, please do apply for the challenge.

delphi_ote · 2nd April 2006, 05:02 PM

Originally Posted by Zoinked168

I hope that once I have established myself as genuine you will take my words more to heart.

Instead of sitting around here running your mouth, why aren't you filling out the application forms? I'm starting to think you just came here to get attention.

30th March 2006, 01:38 AM	#483
Ducky Guest Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 11,933	Originally Posted by KellyJ Let the Sylvia Browne stories begin. I can sleep at night. I don't know how she can. It's 2:40 in the morning. If you can sleep, then do so!!! As for Sylvia, I hear she eats babies. Raw.
Ducky Guest Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 11,933

30th March 2006, 06:20 AM	#484
Gr8wight red-shirted crewman Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,661	Originally Posted by CFLarsen Still got the names of those psychics? Keep documentation. Unfortunately, that information is securely stored on the defective hard drive of my previous computer.
	__________________ Aurora Walking Vacation "A point of view can be a dangerous luxury when substituted for insight and understanding."--Marshall McLuhan

30th March 2006, 06:56 AM	#485
prewitt81 Notoriously Glorious Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,226	Originally Posted by rjh01 If you are worried that someone may send you spam after you send them e-mails, create a new e-mail account and use that. There are several organisations that will create e-mail accounts for you. If you then receive spam you can abandon it. Yeah, I ended up going with an anonymous email address. We'll see how it goes.
	__________________ Knowledge is Power! "If we want to teach the Moon is green cheese then we'll do it!" -- Eric Hovind defending his father's pro-creationist stance. (http://www.kent-hovind.com/) "Believe those who seek the truth. Doubt those who find it."

30th March 2006, 08:37 AM	#487
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Thought you all might be interested in hearing what happened to a co-worker's niece a couple weeks ago. We were just talking about myspace.com and what an evil little web site it is on SkepticalCommunity and it prompted me to tell the story. I've been thinking about posting it here ever since it happened, but just never got around to it. Anyway. Here's pretty much what I posted on SC: A niece of a co-worker was recently (couple weeks ago) nearly kidnapped by a guy she met on myspace. It was only through quick action on my coworker's part that she was rescued at the last possible moment. Typical clueless problem child teenager. This guy tells her he's the member of a grunge band and a recruiter for Hollywood movies. Promises her he can get her into a movie in California and she will make $600,000. She was disowned by her parents and living in an apartment with a 34 year old woman. Fortunately, this woman was on her game and started checking a lot of this guy's claims on the internet and showed the kid he was lying. One particular claim was about being a member of a band, which he named. He said they were a California band, and the roommate found it was a real band, only out of Pennsylvania. Other stuff like that wasn't adding up. But the kid didn't want to hear it. So she tells the guy to come to her town and she will meet him and leave town with him. She quits her grocery store job and tells her roommate she is leaving. The guy arrives by bus. Yeah. Big picture Hollywood man comes in on a bus. He then tells her he lost his driver's license and money and she has to pay for their hotel room. Yeah. Big picture Hollywood man has no money or identification proving he is who he says he is. So she wants to stay in town until she can pick up her last grocery store paycheck before they run off to California together. And this is what probably saved her life, because while this was going on, the now ex-roommate has alerted the family, who seem apathetic after all the crap they have had to put up with from her, except for her uncle, my co-worker. Somewhere along the line, the roommate had challenged this creep on the phone. And during the conversation, he said, "Why aren't you dead?" This was enough for my co-worker to go to the police, and for the police to go after him for threatening bodily harm when he came to town. Her uncle (my co-worker) was able to track her location because his niece had told the grocery store where she would be. So the cop goes with my coworker to the hotel and they knock on the door. At first the policeman says nothing as the uncle talks to his niece through the door. But they won't open it. So uncle asks the cop, "Can't you do something?" So the policeman says, "This is the police!", and the big picture Hollywood recruiter grunge band member bolts from the room and jumps out the back window, much to the shock and amazement of the idiot kid.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

30th March 2006, 08:40 AM	#488
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Unfortunately, the bad guy got away and the only person who has seen his face is the niece.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

30th March 2006, 01:17 AM	#481
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Flying around in the sky Posts: 28,302	If you are worried that someone may send you spam after you send them e-mails, create a new e-mail account and use that. There are several organisations that will create e-mail accounts for you. If you then receive spam you can abandon it.

30th March 2006, 01:31 AM	#482
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Let the Sylvia Browne stories begin. I can sleep at night. I don't know how she can.

30th March 2006, 07:18 AM	#486
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,371	Originally Posted by Gr8wight Unfortunately, that information is securely stored on the defective hard drive of my previous computer. Tsk, tsk...

30th March 2006, 09:17 AM	#489
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766	Originally Posted by KellyJ Let the Sylvia Browne stories begin. I can sleep at night. I don't know how she can. Cold readers don't necessarily know that they're doing it. I've only seen two kinds of ex-psychics. One sort says "Yes, I was [swiki]Hot Reading[/swiki], I'm a fraud." The other sort says "I was [swiki]Cold Reading[/swiki], and I had no idea." One of the latter category is our very own poster Nex. But I've never seen anyone say "I was cold reading and I knew it." Now I think about it, the reason for this is obvious --- a deliberate fraud wouldn't confine himself / herself to cold reading --- they'd always do it hot if they could. If cold readers can fool an audience, and they can, then they can fool themselves.
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766

30th March 2006, 09:25 AM	#490
Hagrok Muse Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 937	Originally Posted by Luke T. Unfortunately, the bad guy got away and the only person who has seen his face is the niece. Bet his fingerprints are in a database somewhere...
Hagrok Muse Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 937	__________________ Indecision may or may not be my problem...

30th March 2006, 11:17 AM	#491
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Originally Posted by Hagrok Bet his fingerprints are in a database somewhere... That's what I was thinking. I said as much to my co-worker, but I can't recall what his reply was. I don't know if they lifted fingerprints or not.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

30th March 2006, 11:19 AM	#492
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Originally Posted by Dr Adequate But I've never seen anyone say "I was cold reading and I knew it." Now I think about it, the reason for this is obvious --- a deliberate fraud wouldn't confine himself / herself to cold reading --- they'd always do it hot if they could. The Psychic Mafia bears this out. A good read on the tricks the author and his cohorts pulled as deliberately fraudulent psychics to make their readings as hot as possible.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

30th March 2006, 12:03 PM	#493
Mr. Stick Thinker Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 231	Originally Posted by Dr Adequate Cold readers don't necessarily know that they're doing it. ........ But I've never seen anyone say "I was cold reading and I knew it." Now I think about it, the reason for this is obvious --- a deliberate fraud wouldn't confine himself / herself to cold reading --- they'd always do it hot if they could. Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds? The impression I get from stage performers claiming to talk to the dead, is that they are very well aware what they are doing, and they talk to people all the time without prior knowledge. If they used hot reading they would do much better than they do.
Mr. Stick Thinker Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 231	__________________ John Edward: But, I'm a psychic. Stan Marsh: No, dude. You're a douche. John Edward: I'm not a douche. What if I really believed dead people talk to me? Stan Marsh: Then, you're a stupid douche!

30th March 2006, 12:06 PM	#494
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Originally Posted by Mr. Stick Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds? The impression I get from stage performers claiming to talk to the dead, is that they are very well aware what they are doing, and they talk to people all the time without prior knowledge. If they used hot reading they would do much better than they do. All we see are her live appearances. Spontaneous readings on people she couldn't know anything about. We do not see her private readings with regular clients or with clients who have to give their full name and credit card number. Read "The Psychic Mafia" to get an idea. Psychics keep records on their clients and trade that information with each other.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

31st March 2006, 09:55 AM	#495
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Thank you, Luke, for presenting the story about the near disaster with the misled teenager. This happens more often than we realize. If you are a parent of a teen, or even a pre-teen, know what they are doing, especially on the internet. Just 2 nights ago, I had a phone interview with the mom of a missing teen from NV. She was lured away in a similar fashion. NOw she's living the life of a prostitute and is a meth user. She's only 15. Cops don't care because they say she's a "runaway". Apparently, the laws in NV are so lax that no one can effectively react to this. They even had the man in question in their hands for drug possesion, but said they couldn't charge him in relation to the girl. Of course, he did not appear at his trial. It's a system gone mad. Don't think it can't happen to you.

31st March 2006, 11:12 AM	#496
alfaniner Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Sorth Dakonsin Posts: 30,791	[quote=Mr. Stick;1539132]Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds? ...[quote] I think the key word was "ex-psychics". The current frauds know full well what they are doing.
	__________________ Science is self-correcting. Woo is self-contradicting.

31st March 2006, 05:29 PM	#497
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	I would like your opinions, please. Would having a post on humor in my series on psychics detract from its professionalism? In this post, I would briefly discuss the need for humor in dealing with the issue, and then include some psychic jokes.

31st March 2006, 05:44 PM	#498
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Flying around in the sky Posts: 28,302	Humour in the right hands can be a powerful weapon. How about this one I just invented. 'I would like to report my son is missing.' 'Hey are you not that famous psychics who finds missing people?' 'Yes. Glad you recognise me.'

31st March 2006, 05:57 PM	#499
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Thank you for the comment and the joke. If I decide to do this, I'll start a psychic joke thread on the Humor forum rather than have them posted here. The humor forum is an appropriate place for them.

31st March 2006, 07:52 PM	#500
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766	Originally Posted by KellyJ I would like your opinions, please. Would having a post on humor in my series on psychics detract from its professionalism? In this post, I would briefly discuss the need for humor in dealing with the issue, and then include some psychic jokes. It's hard to do. I make fun of everything I can, but psychics in themselves aren't funny. Their particular arguments are often funny, but the thing itself is just disgusting.
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766

31st March 2006, 08:14 PM	#501
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766	Originally Posted by Mr. Stick Does Sylvia Brown and others of her class not use cold reading? Are they not frauds? The impression I get from stage performers claiming to talk to the dead, is that they are very well aware what they are doing, and they talk to people all the time without prior knowledge. If they used hot reading they would do much better than they do. Well, I think you just made my point. If she was a fraud, then she would hot-read, and do much better than she does. In fact, she's rubbish, she flails around wildly, and her audience believes in her. And so does she. I'm sure the fatuous preening self-deluding stupid bitch sleeps very well. I suffer from insomnia. What of it?
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766

31st March 2006, 11:08 PM	#502
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Originally Posted by Dr Adequate It's hard to do. I make fun of everything I can, but psychics in themselves aren't funny. Their particular arguments are often funny, but the thing itself is just disgusting. THis is why I am torn about it. rjh's joke was not bad, but yet it stung just the same. I do firmly believe in the importance of having a sense of humor in trying times. I'm also insomniac, so my comment about her sleeping at night was more of a jab at her apparent lack of a conscience than her sleeping habits.

31st March 2006, 11:54 PM	#503
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	The San Antonio police ask for psychic's help according to this article: http://www.woai.com/mostpopular/stor...6-DB1D9A9CA35F

1st April 2006, 12:04 AM	#504
prewitt81 Notoriously Glorious Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,226	Quote: UTSA police followed every lead in their search for Fuentes. Chief Hernandez says they got help from the San Antonio Police Department and even psychics to try to track her down. The way I read that, it seems like the psychics offered help. Very vague wording there.
	__________________ Knowledge is Power! "If we want to teach the Moon is green cheese then we'll do it!" -- Eric Hovind defending his father's pro-creationist stance. (http://www.kent-hovind.com/) "Believe those who seek the truth. Doubt those who find it."

2nd April 2006, 09:37 AM	#505
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Originally Posted by prewitt81 The way I read that, it seems like the psychics offered help. Very vague wording there. Yes, it was vague, but there was no real purpose in even mentioning it since obviously this is not what solved the case.

2nd April 2006, 01:26 PM	#506
prewitt81 Notoriously Glorious Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,226	Agreed.
	__________________ Knowledge is Power! "If we want to teach the Moon is green cheese then we'll do it!" -- Eric Hovind defending his father's pro-creationist stance. (http://www.kent-hovind.com/) "Believe those who seek the truth. Doubt those who find it."

2nd April 2006, 02:41 PM	#507
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18	Kelly Why couldn't I find the delete button sooner than elaine's lighting quick reflexes. I ment to post it as a private message... Just dig myself a hole now... Although I wanted the post below to be private, I still believe it to be true. So if im banned from this forum because of it, then frankly I'm not bothered.
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18

2nd April 2006, 02:44 PM	#508
elaine Killer Squirrel Killer Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,145	Originally Posted by Zoinked168 I am deeply sorry to hear about your son's disappearance. I know you don't want to hear some claimed psychic tell you a bunch pie in the sky for money. I don't have to have any special ability's to sense your frustration and hurt over Jason. I have some experience in locating objects and "scanning" peoples health. I myself was curious about the whereabouts of your son. I know my findings could be either devastating or bring some hope to you and your family. This is such a delicate matter which I'm not totally comfortable with. I so deeply regret to say that I found no trace of Jason's energy on earth. I have checked and re-checked hoping that I could be wrong. You could clarify this for yourself and you do not need any special abilities. But you do need a clear mind with is no easy feat. But if you can, relax and feel your own heartbeat and then picture Jason and what his heart would be doing. Then change your thoughts to your other son's heartbeat and try to see a difference. It takes time but the answer lies within you. I am so sorry to give this news to a mother, but I feel that your mind will never rest until you find the truth. Please accept my humblest apologies and I can only hope you don't think me as a fruit. If you do, then I accept that and I understand why and I wish you well in your search. Deepest Regards Zoe Unbelievable

2nd April 2006, 03:04 PM	#509
Roadtoad Bufo Caminus Inedibilis Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Citrus Heights, CA Posts: 15,468	I'll give zoinked credit: 1.) No money was requested. 2.) The answer given was honestly offered. 3.) It was a hard one to offer any parent. I'm hoping Zoinked is wrong. No, I don't want to see this person banned, but maybe, over time, they might realize just what is truly going on in their heart and mind. An "A" for compassion. Everything else... That's not up to me.

2nd April 2006, 03:07 PM	#510
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Zoe, You will not be banned for claiming "psychic" abilities. What I fail to understand though is why you ignore my request to not come to me with your claims. Assuming you came here through the blog series, (surely you have seen it and read the disclaimer at the bottom of each post, OR you have read enough of this thread to have made this clear.) you know that I do not entertain anything psychics have to say as truth regarding my son. You sound like a kind, yet misguided person. I don't wish to be unkind to you, but your notion of being able to know whether or not Jason's heart is beating is pure nonsense. (sensing his "energy" as you phrased it) Every single psychic who has ever approached me tells me he is dead, so you are no different. If you have specific details about his death and disappearance, as with any of the others who now come to me, I encourage you to call our police detectives and share this with with them. I let them decide if there is anything of value to follow up. I guarantee you that they will listen to you, so please don't use that as an excuse not to call them. Here's the number: 402-444-5647 Why don't you create your own thread to discuss your psychic abilities? If you have confidence in it, you should have no objection to doing that. Kelly

2nd April 2006, 03:44 PM	#511
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18	Firstly, thank-you for not immediately discrediting my honest thoughts. I understand that you require details and hard evidence, even in my shoes I want to see the the real facts for my allegation even though the subject nature is painfully sensitive. I do not sell myself short in offering services to the public and I am afraid that even if I could prove some abilities, it would be too costly for myself or you Kelly as I would physically have to travel to your location, and it would be a lengthy investigation which I cannot afford to pursue at the moment as I am studying. At no point did I say I possess psychic abilities, This term is coined too loosely for start and what I do know is that I deal with the manipulation of quantimbioelectromagnetic energy. The discussion of ESP has only recently been brought to light and what I know and practice, I fail to see an exact resemblance to what is known yet to the masses. So although this probably appears to be a "cop-out" in my resistance to help at this point of time, I do intend to prove my capabilities in other areas than missing people. This is me sticking my neck out into the world where I have grown tired of skeptics in the past and given up explaining and even demonstrating to. I have nothing to prove but to myself. I hope people will understand that one day.
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18

2nd April 2006, 03:53 PM	#512
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18	Further more, I would like to add that I totally support the notion of exposing frauds in the ESP department. They are a disgrace to themselves and the people they effect. So I really don't mind if you try to pick holes through my words because I know I speak the truth and frauds just make my life harder and frustrate me. This is something that fascinates my own mind and I am curious to know and see real results which no one has been proved as yet.
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18

2nd April 2006, 04:20 PM	#513
delphi_ote Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,994	Originally Posted by Zoinked168 Further more, I would like to add that I totally support the notion of exposing frauds in the ESP department. They are a disgrace to themselves and the people they effect. So I really don't mind if you try to pick holes through my words because I know I speak the truth and frauds just make my life harder and frustrate me. This is something that fascinates my own mind and I am curious to know and see real results which no one has been proved as yet. So why not win a Million Dollars?
delphi_ote Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,994

2nd April 2006, 04:32 PM	#514
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Zoe, You claim paranormal abilities. To be able to know if a person is alive or dead in the manner you suggest is not a normal ability. Pardon me for the psychic label. I have a few questions for you: Are you saying that you are not going to discuss this ability on your own thread? Are you saying that you know nothing more than that Jason is not alive, and that you would not know more than that without coming here? Do you have any intention of notifying the police, assuming you have details? If you do not have any more answers and are not willing to discuss your claimed abilities, I do not see much purpose in your having contacted me. In a nutshell, you said: "Sorry, lady, but your kid is dead." What value does that hold for me? What value does it hold for any of the members here or the purpose of the thread/forum? Thank you. Kelly

2nd April 2006, 04:37 PM	#515
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18	delphi_ote...I have looked into applying already. But this is not about the money. This is bigger than the material world...doesn't anyone see that yet?! Besides, this is not a win lose scenario or anything to do with numeric lottery odds. My intention is be in James Randi's labs making history in regards to ESP. I do have a life too and I have no intentions of being a lab rat for the rest of my life.
Zoinked168 New Blood Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 18