Psychics and Missing People - Page 12

Kelly · 18th March 2006, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by Mid

Hi Kelly,

I haven't posted before in this thread as I didn't think I had anything to add but I just want to say I'm very impressed with everything you're doing over there. Also, I thought I'd just give you a heads up that although you've now blanked out the link and if you click on it it goes to no where if you hover over the link you can still see the universities web address, I'm not sure whether this was your intention or not but incase it wasn't I thought I'd let you know

Hi Mid...cute monkey by the way.

Thanks for letting me know about that. It was not intentional. I find it strange that it would still show the website with a mouseover...oh well. I removed it completely.

Thank you also for your kind words.

Kelly · 18th March 2006, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by Gr8wight

The next day the psychic's website is updated to include the claim: Assisted homeowner in emergency bulb replacement.

Funny, but true. Perhaps using humor like this might reach someone out there. I can only try.

Dr Adequate · 18th March 2006, 08:24 PM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

That is hilarious! I thought I cleaned that out so there was no clear reference to the actual location. The Fxxxxxx Scholarship people were able to figure it out because apparently he was the only Diego in KY with that privelege.

The woman from Fxxxx promised to let me know what happens to the scumbag...

Hi. I'm obviously going to have to do a lot of research to find out what's going on.

However, I might generally point out that doing product recall usually builds brand confidence. It would be good for these Fxxxxxxxx people if they took swift and immediate action (as they seem to be doing) and you credit them for it on your blog, and if they don't know this you might point it out to them.

Could I say again, keep me posted for any new links for the SkepticWiki article. I recall that KellyJ liked the "Crime Professionals Against Fraud" website more than my SkepticWiki article. In a way, KJ, you're right: first hand testimony is best. That's why I went wild over that article and put it first in the links for [swiki]Psychic Detectives[/swiki]. But in another way you're wrong --- because the SkepticWiki article linked to that article, just as it links to your blog and the Klaas foundation. And will link to psychicpredators.com.

Do keep me up to date. Thanks.

Kelly · 18th March 2006, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by Dr Adequate

Hi. I'm obviously going to have to do a lot of research to find out what's going on.

However, I might generally point out that doing product recall usually builds brand confidence. It would be good for these Fxxxxxxxx people if they took swift and immediate action (as they seem to be doing) and you credit them for it on your blog, and if they don't know this you might point it out to them.

Could I say again, keep me posted for any new links for the SkepticWiki article. I recall that KellyJ liked the "Crime Professionals Against Fraud" website more than my SkepticWiki article. In a way, KJ, you're right: first hand testimony is best. That's why I went wild over that article and put it first in the links for [swiki]Psychic Detectives[/swiki]. But in another way you're wrong --- because the SkepticWiki article linked to that article, just as it links to your blog and the Klaas foundation. And will link to psychicpredators.com.

Do keep me up to date. Thanks.

What are you going to have to do alot of research on, specifically? Do you mean our pal, Diego?

I am quite sure I saved the F woman's vm msg to me. Once I return from my next trip, if I have not heard from her, I will call her for an update. She did say that she has my email, etc. (Obviously, they checked me out, too.)

Now that I again look at the SkepticWiki page, it is an excellent one stop "shopping" for this specific issue. I bookmarked it and will utilize it in upcoming blog entries if that's ok with you.

Thanks for the reminder on KlassKids. I'm going to email Marc directly about his blog submission and see if he's going to be able to do it.

Kelly

Kelly · 20th March 2006, 06:34 PM

For those who like to email reporters who promote psychics, here's an article I ran across: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/met...h.2fca8eb.html

Roadtoad · 20th March 2006, 06:39 PM

Crap.

If only these people would quit wasting the time of the police and themselves. I realize the police feel an "obligation," but if it were me, I'd insist the psychics be kept OUT of any investigation. Let THEM spend their time and money chasing the false leads.

Gr8wight · 20th March 2006, 09:42 PM

Actually, that article does seem pretty balanced. It reports that there has been activity based on the psychic's involvement, but it also quotes the police representative as being a skeptic, and saying that psychics' claims do not pan out any more often than chance would have one expect, but that the police are reluctant to pass on any tips. Perhaps any e-mails we send should simply excourage the reporter to follow the story and write a follow up article pointing out that the psychic's suggestions were worthless.

Jon. · 20th March 2006, 10:46 PM

From the story:

Quote:

By her side was Luis Lopez, 22, Fuentes' nephew and godson.

"It doesn't matter how ridiculous it sounds," Lopez said. "A clue's a clue."

In an investigation that so far has led nowhere, Engleman's clues — and perhaps her savvy computer skills — have at the very least staved off despair in some of Fuentes' loved ones.

"It's a complete mystery, but we haven't given up hope yet," said Arthur Gomez, 45, Fuentes' brother.

He said his little sister's disappearance has made him a believer.

This is the true sadness in this story. The "clues" provided by the psychic have led exactly nowhere, but this poor family member, desperate for something, anything, that might lead to the return of his sister, clutches at the straw offered by the psychic, to the point where he will "believe", because he needs to.

It makes me very, very sad.

Kelly · 21st March 2006, 12:33 AM

I was pleased to see the story did at least present a voice of reason, however, when it ends with the family member expressing belief, which is indeed sad, that almost trumps the skeptic aspect of things.

I do agree with Gr8wight that it would be more prudent to encourage the reporter to follow up.

chillzero · 21st March 2006, 08:59 AM

Well,
I have sent out some queries about police using psychics, and will let you know any responses I get.

I was chatting with my other half last night, and a point came up that I don't think I have put across here yet.

I used to believe I 'knew' things. I had ideas about where to find missing people, or about murder cases. My partner at the time felt I should contact the families to let them know what I 'knew'. I refused, because I wanted to keep a diary of what I thought the outcome would be, and match it against the actual outcomes (should I ever be able to find out), and convince myself of a 100% hitrate before I would ever risk giving a family the wrong information. No matter how convinced I was of my ability, I knew - and interestingly most psychics will easily admit - that the ability is one that comes and goes according to whatever factors (health, stress, moral dilemma, hostile environment.....) are prevalent. Why then would anyone insist in bringing this information to a family until the ability is always there 24/7 and unerring in every detail? I don't understand it.

The most I think I could have done, had my partner pressed me more, was give my 'information' to the relevant police force, and let them weigh it up as to relevance and worthiness for attention. I would never impose on a family in such a situation. The place they find themselves is so distressing and so personal that I believe they should be supported, and respected. Never imposed upon.

Kelly · 21st March 2006, 12:00 PM

Thanks for continuing with the research, C.

Perhaps I should edit your posted story and add that you were encouraged to "help" families of the missing. I'm so glad your ethics prevented you from taking that step. Like you, I would agree for psyhics to let police discern who is a crackpot and who is not. Thank you for your honesty.

The_Fire · 21st March 2006, 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by chillzero

Well,
I have sent out some queries about police using psychics, and will let you know any responses I get.

Speaking off...I just had an idea: With the amount of nationalities we have here on the board, it would be possible to contact police forces in a lot of countries and get their statistics as well.
That would make a broadside against the claims of not only american psychics but also those from other countries. I have personally come up against an australian whom more or less refused to acknowledge that australia have the same problems with these frauds as the US.....

edit: spelling mishap. and another one....

Kelly · 23rd March 2006, 01:26 AM

Luke T.'s story is now posted on the blog:

http://voice4themissing.blogspot.com...chics-are.html

Thank you, Luke! Excellent work.

Luke T. · 23rd March 2006, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

Luke T.'s story is now posted on the blog:

http://voice4themissing.blogspot.com...chics-are.html

Thank you, Luke! Excellent work.

My pleasure.

I have sent a link to the article to the news department of the Fox affilliate mentioned in the article. I hope it is a wake-up call for them.

Dr Adequate · 23rd March 2006, 10:57 AM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

What are you going to have to do alot of research on, specifically? Do you mean our pal, Diego?

I am quite sure I saved the F woman's vm msg to me.

Well there you go again ... "the F woman" ... "our pal Diego" ... any minute know someone with a heavy Russian accent is going to sidle up to me and whisper "the grey owl flies at midnight ... the badger wants his cheese".

Quote:

Now that I again look at the SkepticWiki page, it is an excellent one stop "shopping" for this specific issue.

Cool ... that's just what dr kitten said the SW should be when it was started ... "a one-stop shop for all your skeptical needs."

Quote:

I bookmarked it and will utilize it in upcoming blog entries if that's ok with you.

Well of course ... it's what the SWiki's there for.

I've linked Luke's article --- twice, actually, 'cos it's the only skeptical take on Nancy Myer that I've been able to find. The bit about the car is excellent --- it shows that she's a [swiki]Hot Reading[/swiki] fraud.

---------

About policemen --- we used to have a couple on these forums ... Stumpy and Hannibal ... back during Lucianarchy's reign of terror. They no longer actively post, but perhaps a PM would get them involved --- it's worth a shot. I'd do it myself, except that they wouldn't remember me, but someone such as Luke T or CFLarsen might give it a shot.

Luke T. · 23rd March 2006, 11:35 AM

Originally Posted by Dr Adequate

I've linked Luke's article --- twice, actually, 'cos it's the only skeptical take on Nancy Myer that I've been able to find. The bit about the car is excellent --- it shows that she's a [swiki]Hot Reading[/swiki] fraud.

Yay!

Quote:

About policemen --- we used to have a couple on these forums ... Stumpy and Hannibal ... back during Lucianarchy's reign of terror. They no longer actively post, but perhaps a PM would get them involved --- it's worth a shot. I'd do it myself, except that they wouldn't remember me, but someone such as Luke T or CFLarsen might give it a shot.

We still have Andalyn. He's a policeman as well, and has been a member of this forum for years, and is still active here. I've PM'd him to ask him join us in this topic.

Luke T. · 23rd March 2006, 12:46 PM

Wow. I just read The Business of Preying, and my temper is flaring.

One really great part:

Quote:

On one occasion a psychic contacted Paula, Billy’s sister, and said “For $225.00, I will find your brother." Paula's answer was very commendable; she replied" there is a $15,000 reward out for the return or recovery of my brother, find him and the money is yours." Her reply was "I don't do business like that."

This is really, really great stuff. Every journalism student in the world should be required to read it.

elaine · 23rd March 2006, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by Luke T.

Wow. I just read The Business of Preying, and my temper is flaring.

One really great part:

This is really, really great stuff. Every journalism student in the world should be required to read it.

My temper will start flaring, after I stop crying for the family. Like they aren't going through enough.

Dr Adequate · 23rd March 2006, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Luke T.

We still have Andalyn. He's a policeman as well, and has been a member of this forum for years, and is still active here. I've PM'd him to ask him join us in this topic.

Looking at the posting histories of Stumpy and Hannibal, it seems like Hannibal lost the desire to post, or possibly the will to live, as a result of Lucianarchy's repulsive behavior --- and hasn't been seen since Feb '04. Stumpy, OTOH, only ever posted every few months anyway --- last seen last September. He may well be contactable.

It's worth a go. I'll PM them --- it's not as though I'm asking them a personal favor.

Katachresis · 23rd March 2006, 03:28 PM

I am toying with the idea of contacting one of my cousins. He has been a detective in a suburban city for over 25 years. I fear broaching the subject with him. The next time we are together, I will feel him out, get some general impressions. I doubt I could ask him for contributions here, but at least get an idea about what he thinks about the subject.

Kelly · 23rd March 2006, 08:10 PM

Hello all,

I did ask Janice Smolinski if she would name any of the psychics, but apparently she did not feel comfortable doing so. I will be meeting her this weekend in NC, and I plan on asking her about this. Wouldn't it be lovely to stop that wretched person in her tracks?

That would be a good idea to bring in some policemen who have experience in this area. I would love to hear their take on it.

For those who do not know, I will be away starting tomorrow morning through Monday. I'll be in Wilmington, NC, for the 2nd annual Cue Center conference, which is a gathering of organizations, such as ours, and family members of missing persons. I'll be speaking on Saturday night at the National Candlelight Vigil, held in downtown Wilmington, near the Cape Fear River.

I'm not sure how much internet time I will have while there, so I will be scarse around these parts.

If any psychics come looking for me, tell them they have the wrong number for me, but that we have their number.

Thanks, everyone, for everything.

Kelly

Luke T. · 24th March 2006, 04:16 PM

After Kelly placed my article about Nancy Myer and KPTV on her site, I emailed KPTV to let them know about it. I just got an email from the reporter who did the story:

Quote:

Thank you for the link. Very interesting article.
We appreciate your feedback.
Take care and hope to hear from you again.

And that is it.

elaine · 26th March 2006, 01:12 PM

Kelly,

Last week, the Denver Post had this article regarding a medium that moved to the area. A very one-sided and pro psychic article.

http://www.denverpost.com/search/ci_3602480

I would like to add to what this letter writer wrote in today's (March 26th)paper, using Kelly as a for instance.

http://www.denverpost.com/letters

First of all, is this okay with you? And secondly, assuming it is, any input from the forum would be greatly appreciated. I don't write as clearly and precisely as I'd like.

Here is a rough draft

I read with interest, the March 19th article 'Spiritual Medium At Large' . And like Mr. Barnhart, am very disappointed in the lack of balance and skepticism in the article. The letter writer is correct in his comments regarding cold reading. In the spirit of good reporting, I would like to suggest to the editors a follow-up article, discussing cold reading techniques and perhaps interviewing someone like Kelly Jolkowski of http://voice4themissing.blogspot.com, regarding her experiences with well-intentioned mediums.

Thanks!

dubious · 26th March 2006, 07:29 PM

Kelly,you have my deepest sympathy and utmost admiration for your courage.
Definition of the 'supernatural. "the most extraordinary claims made by the ordinary of people.
Do not relant to the onslaught of delusional believers you will confront.
Your cause is a noble one.
Kindest regards.

elaine · 27th March 2006, 06:55 AM

Thank you, Kelly, for the ok to use your name and website in my letter to the Denver Post editor. I made a couple of small changes. We'll see if they print it.

Kelly · 28th March 2006, 07:31 PM

Hi all,

I'm back from my trip, but it looks like it's going to take me several days to catch up on things. I still wanted to pop in and express my thanks.

That's too bad that you only received a form response, Luke T, but it's always possible that your article did have an impact, one that this author is not revealing.

Thanks, Elaine, for writing to the Denver Post. Working together, we can make a difference for someone.

At the conference, the blog series was a topic of several conversations. One man said that someone came to him about psychics, and he pointed them to the series. That person came back to him, apologized, indicating she had no idea, but that now she knows better.

ysabella · 28th March 2006, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

At the conference, the blog series was a topic of several conversations. One man said that someone came to him about psychics, and he pointed them to the series. That person came back to him, apologized, indicating she had no idea, but that now she knows better.

Hooray! Result!!

elaine · 29th March 2006, 07:18 AM

sorry double post

elaine · 29th March 2006, 07:18 AM

Originally Posted by KellyJ

Hi all,

I'm back from my trip, but it looks like it's going to take me several days to catch up on things. I still wanted to pop in and express my thanks.

That's too bad that you only received a form response, Luke T, but it's always possible that your article did have an impact, one that this author is not revealing.

Thanks, Elaine, for writing to the Denver Post. Working together, we can make a difference for someone.

At the conference, the blog series was a topic of several conversations. One man said that someone came to him about psychics, and he pointed them to the series. That person came back to him, apologized, indicating she had no idea, but that now she knows better.

Very cool, about the blog experience at the conference.

Regarding the letter to the Post, I wish I had read the article when it came out last week. Sending a response earlier would have helped, I'm sure. Another forum user pm'd me the reporter's email address. I'm sending her a version of the letter. If anything comes of it, I'll let everyone know.

prewitt81 · 29th March 2006, 06:56 PM

I just received a letter from "psychic" Skye Alexander http://www.skyealexander.com/ in which she claims that she "help[s] police across the United States solve homicides, missing person, and suicide cases."

My gut reaction is to send her an email pointing her to the soon-to-be psychicpredators.com, but I'm guessing that she'll just delete it and send my address to spam harvesters. Any ideas on how to proceed? Once the website is up, I won't have a problem contacting her if we have official email addresses. Honestly, I delete a lot of spam anyways, and might just fire one off to her while I'm still hot about it.

Ducky · 29th March 2006, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by prewitt81

I just received a letter from "psychic" Skye Alexander http://www.skyealexander.com/ in which she claims that she "help[s] police across the United States solve homicides, missing person, and suicide cases."

My gut reaction is to send her an email pointing her to the soon-to-be psychicpredators.com, but I'm guessing that she'll just delete it and send my address to spam harvesters. Any ideas on how to proceed? Once the website is up, I won't have a problem contacting her if we have official email addresses. Honestly, I delete a lot of spam anyways, and might just fire one off to her while I'm still hot about it.

Ask Skye what exactly needs to be solved about a suicide? It's one of the few death investigations in which the victim and the perpetrator are readily apparent.

prewitt81 · 29th March 2006, 07:19 PM

Originally Posted by fowlsound

Ask Skye what exactly needs to be solved about a suicide? It's one of the few death investigations in which the victim and the perpetrator are readily apparent.

I would guess, there, that she probably engages in the normal scumbaggery and gives false reasons for the suicide, and assurances that the "departed soul" is in a better place.

Ducky · 29th March 2006, 07:21 PM

Originally Posted by prewitt81

I would guess, there, that she probably engages in the normal scumbaggery and gives false reasons for the suicide, and assurances that the "departed soul" is in a better place.

Which is a despicable tactic, and had anyone purportedly done that to me or my family after my father's suicide, I would have kicked them right in the genitals.

I say we get this one. Email her back and ask for a specific cop to reference in each case seh has worked on so that you can "verify her credentials before making any decisions on soliciting her services." See if she even returns one cop's name.

prewitt81 · 29th March 2006, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by fowlsound

Which is a despicable tactic, and had anyone purportedly done that to me or my family after my father's suicide, I would have kicked them right in the genitals.

I say we get this one. Email her back and ask for a specific cop to reference in each case seh has worked on so that you can "verify her credentials before making any decisions on soliciting her services." See if she even returns one cop's name.

I'm on it. I'll start a new thread with any replies I receive.

Kelly · 29th March 2006, 08:36 PM

HI Prewitt...good to see you again.

Besides the usual comments, I can honestly say that this woman, Syke, has the spookiest eyes.

Thanks for the prompt attention to this matter. She's pretty vague about her "accomplishments", but that's not a surprise.

Gr8wight · 29th March 2006, 08:58 PM

Originally Posted by fowlsound

Which is a despicable tactic, and had anyone purportedly done that to me or my family after my father's suicide, I would have kicked them right in the genitals.

I say we get this one. Email her back and ask for a specific cop to reference in each case seh has worked on so that you can "verify her credentials before making any decisions on soliciting her services." See if she even returns one cop's name.

About a year ago I sent emails to several psychics whose websites claimed they had participated with police. I asked them to provide details of exactly which police forces they had been involved with. Only one of them deigned to reply to me, and his response was twofold:

1) He named a general geographic area is which he had allegedly worked, but did not name a specific law enforcement agency.

2) He told me that most police forces will deny having worked with psychics when asked, even if they had done so.

Pretty much the response I expected.

Mr. Stick · 29th March 2006, 09:45 PM

Originally Posted by prewitt81

I just received a letter from "psychic" Skye Alexander http://www.skyealexander.com/ in which she claims that she "help[s] police across the United States solve homicides, missing person, and suicide cases."

Just out of curiosity: Why did you receive such a letter?

prewitt81 · 29th March 2006, 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. Stick

Just out of curiosity: Why did you receive such a letter?

It was a mass-mailing, apparently.

Kelly · 29th March 2006, 10:42 PM

The epitome of junk mail.

Hello Gr8wight

CFLarsen · 29th March 2006, 10:57 PM

Originally Posted by Gr8wight

About a year ago I sent emails to several psychics whose websites claimed they had participated with police. I asked them to provide details of exactly which police forces they had been involved with. Only one of them deigned to reply to me, and his response was twofold:

1) He named a general geographic area is which he had allegedly worked, but did not name a specific law enforcement agency.

2) He told me that most police forces will deny having worked with psychics when asked, even if they had done so.

Pretty much the response I expected.

Still got the names of those psychics?

Keep documentation.

18th March 2006, 08:24 PM	#443
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766	Originally Posted by KellyJ That is hilarious! I thought I cleaned that out so there was no clear reference to the actual location. The Fxxxxxx Scholarship people were able to figure it out because apparently he was the only Diego in KY with that privelege. The woman from Fxxxx promised to let me know what happens to the scumbag... Hi. I'm obviously going to have to do a lot of research to find out what's going on. However, I might generally point out that doing product recall usually builds brand confidence. It would be good for these Fxxxxxxxx people if they took swift and immediate action (as they seem to be doing) and you credit them for it on your blog, and if they don't know this you might point it out to them. Could I say again, keep me posted for any new links for the SkepticWiki article. I recall that KellyJ liked the "Crime Professionals Against Fraud" website more than my SkepticWiki article. In a way, KJ, you're right: first hand testimony is best. That's why I went wild over that article and put it first in the links for [swiki]Psychic Detectives[/swiki]. But in another way you're wrong --- because the SkepticWiki article linked to that article, just as it links to your blog and the Klaas foundation. And will link to psychicpredators.com. Do keep me up to date. Thanks.
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766

20th March 2006, 09:42 PM	#447
Gr8wight red-shirted crewman Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,661	Actually, that article does seem pretty balanced. It reports that there has been activity based on the psychic's involvement, but it also quotes the police representative as being a skeptic, and saying that psychics' claims do not pan out any more often than chance would have one expect, but that the police are reluctant to pass on any tips. Perhaps any e-mails we send should simply excourage the reporter to follow the story and write a follow up article pointing out that the psychic's suggestions were worthless.
	__________________ Aurora Walking Vacation "A point of view can be a dangerous luxury when substituted for insight and understanding."--Marshall McLuhan

20th March 2006, 10:46 PM	#448
Jon. Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 3,450	From the story: Quote: By her side was Luis Lopez, 22, Fuentes' nephew and godson. "It doesn't matter how ridiculous it sounds," Lopez said. "A clue's a clue." In an investigation that so far has led nowhere, Engleman's clues — and perhaps her savvy computer skills — have at the very least staved off despair in some of Fuentes' loved ones. "It's a complete mystery, but we haven't given up hope yet," said Arthur Gomez, 45, Fuentes' brother. He said his little sister's disappearance has made him a believer. This is the true sadness in this story. The "clues" provided by the psychic have led exactly nowhere, but this poor family member, desperate for something, anything, that might lead to the return of his sister, clutches at the straw offered by the psychic, to the point where he will "believe", because he needs to. It makes me very, very sad.
Jon. Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 3,450

21st March 2006, 12:29 PM	#452
The_Fire Unimpressed Female Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: 8th level of Hell - Maleborgia Posts: 3,267	Originally Posted by chillzero Well, I have sent out some queries about police using psychics, and will let you know any responses I get. Speaking off...I just had an idea: With the amount of nationalities we have here on the board, it would be possible to contact police forces in a lot of countries and get their statistics as well. That would make a broadside against the claims of not only american psychics but also those from other countries. I have personally come up against an australian whom more or less refused to acknowledge that australia have the same problems with these frauds as the US..... edit: spelling mishap. and another one....
	__________________ If anyone told you that I'm a nice person, they were either from a different level of existance, lying through their teeth or mentally instable. "We? That better be you and that invisible aardwarck in your pocket you are talking about, because I KNOW you are not stupid enough to open a giant can of whoop ass by claiming you know what I think." Stop Sylvia Browne

23rd March 2006, 08:23 AM	#454
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Originally Posted by KellyJ Luke T.'s story is now posted on the blog: http://voice4themissing.blogspot.com...chics-are.html Thank you, Luke! Excellent work. My pleasure. I have sent a link to the article to the news department of the Fox affilliate mentioned in the article. I hope it is a wake-up call for them.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

18th March 2006, 08:14 AM	#441
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Originally Posted by Mid Hi Kelly, I haven't posted before in this thread as I didn't think I had anything to add but I just want to say I'm very impressed with everything you're doing over there. Also, I thought I'd just give you a heads up that although you've now blanked out the link and if you click on it it goes to no where if you hover over the link you can still see the universities web address, I'm not sure whether this was your intention or not but incase it wasn't I thought I'd let you know Hi Mid...cute monkey by the way. Thanks for letting me know about that. It was not intentional. I find it strange that it would still show the website with a mouseover...oh well. I removed it completely. Thank you also for your kind words.

18th March 2006, 08:26 AM	#442
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Originally Posted by Gr8wight The next day the psychic's website is updated to include the claim: Assisted homeowner in emergency bulb replacement. Funny, but true. Perhaps using humor like this might reach someone out there. I can only try.

18th March 2006, 09:02 PM	#444
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Originally Posted by Dr Adequate Hi. I'm obviously going to have to do a lot of research to find out what's going on. However, I might generally point out that doing product recall usually builds brand confidence. It would be good for these Fxxxxxxxx people if they took swift and immediate action (as they seem to be doing) and you credit them for it on your blog, and if they don't know this you might point it out to them. Could I say again, keep me posted for any new links for the SkepticWiki article. I recall that KellyJ liked the "Crime Professionals Against Fraud" website more than my SkepticWiki article. In a way, KJ, you're right: first hand testimony is best. That's why I went wild over that article and put it first in the links for [swiki]Psychic Detectives[/swiki]. But in another way you're wrong --- because the SkepticWiki article linked to that article, just as it links to your blog and the Klaas foundation. And will link to psychicpredators.com. Do keep me up to date. Thanks. What are you going to have to do alot of research on, specifically? Do you mean our pal, Diego? I am quite sure I saved the F woman's vm msg to me. Once I return from my next trip, if I have not heard from her, I will call her for an update. She did say that she has my email, etc. (Obviously, they checked me out, too.) Now that I again look at the SkepticWiki page, it is an excellent one stop "shopping" for this specific issue. I bookmarked it and will utilize it in upcoming blog entries if that's ok with you. Thanks for the reminder on KlassKids. I'm going to email Marc directly about his blog submission and see if he's going to be able to do it. Kelly

20th March 2006, 06:34 PM	#445
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	For those who like to email reporters who promote psychics, here's an article I ran across: http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/met...h.2fca8eb.html

20th March 2006, 06:39 PM	#446
Roadtoad Bufo Caminus Inedibilis Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Citrus Heights, CA Posts: 15,468	Crap. If only these people would quit wasting the time of the police and themselves. I realize the police feel an "obligation," but if it were me, I'd insist the psychics be kept OUT of any investigation. Let THEM spend their time and money chasing the false leads.

21st March 2006, 12:33 AM	#449
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	I was pleased to see the story did at least present a voice of reason, however, when it ends with the family member expressing belief, which is indeed sad, that almost trumps the skeptic aspect of things. I do agree with Gr8wight that it would be more prudent to encourage the reporter to follow up.

21st March 2006, 08:59 AM	#450
chillzero Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 15,547	Well, I have sent out some queries about police using psychics, and will let you know any responses I get. I was chatting with my other half last night, and a point came up that I don't think I have put across here yet. I used to believe I 'knew' things. I had ideas about where to find missing people, or about murder cases. My partner at the time felt I should contact the families to let them know what I 'knew'. I refused, because I wanted to keep a diary of what I thought the outcome would be, and match it against the actual outcomes (should I ever be able to find out), and convince myself of a 100% hitrate before I would ever risk giving a family the wrong information. No matter how convinced I was of my ability, I knew - and interestingly most psychics will easily admit - that the ability is one that comes and goes according to whatever factors (health, stress, moral dilemma, hostile environment.....) are prevalent. Why then would anyone insist in bringing this information to a family until the ability is always there 24/7 and unerring in every detail? I don't understand it. The most I think I could have done, had my partner pressed me more, was give my 'information' to the relevant police force, and let them weigh it up as to relevance and worthiness for attention. I would never impose on a family in such a situation. The place they find themselves is so distressing and so personal that I believe they should be supported, and respected. Never imposed upon.

21st March 2006, 12:00 PM	#451
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Thanks for continuing with the research, C. Perhaps I should edit your posted story and add that you were encouraged to "help" families of the missing. I'm so glad your ethics prevented you from taking that step. Like you, I would agree for psyhics to let police discern who is a crackpot and who is not. Thank you for your honesty.

23rd March 2006, 01:26 AM	#453
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Luke T.'s story is now posted on the blog: http://voice4themissing.blogspot.com...chics-are.html Thank you, Luke! Excellent work.

23rd March 2006, 10:57 AM	#455
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766	Originally Posted by KellyJ What are you going to have to do alot of research on, specifically? Do you mean our pal, Diego? I am quite sure I saved the F woman's vm msg to me. Well there you go again ... "the F woman" ... "our pal Diego" ... any minute know someone with a heavy Russian accent is going to sidle up to me and whisper "the grey owl flies at midnight ... the badger wants his cheese". Quote: Now that I again look at the SkepticWiki page, it is an excellent one stop "shopping" for this specific issue. Cool ... that's just what dr kitten said the SW should be when it was started ... "a one-stop shop for all your skeptical needs." Quote: I bookmarked it and will utilize it in upcoming blog entries if that's ok with you. Well of course ... it's what the SWiki's there for. I've linked Luke's article --- twice, actually, 'cos it's the only skeptical take on Nancy Myer that I've been able to find. The bit about the car is excellent --- it shows that she's a [swiki]Hot Reading[/swiki] fraud. --------- About policemen --- we used to have a couple on these forums ... Stumpy and Hannibal ... back during Lucianarchy's reign of terror. They no longer actively post, but perhaps a PM would get them involved --- it's worth a shot. I'd do it myself, except that they wouldn't remember me, but someone such as Luke T or CFLarsen might give it a shot.
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766

23rd March 2006, 11:35 AM	#456
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Originally Posted by Dr Adequate I've linked Luke's article --- twice, actually, 'cos it's the only skeptical take on Nancy Myer that I've been able to find. The bit about the car is excellent --- it shows that she's a [swiki]Hot Reading[/swiki] fraud. Yay! Quote: About policemen --- we used to have a couple on these forums ... Stumpy and Hannibal ... back during Lucianarchy's reign of terror. They no longer actively post, but perhaps a PM would get them involved --- it's worth a shot. I'd do it myself, except that they wouldn't remember me, but someone such as Luke T or CFLarsen might give it a shot. We still have Andalyn. He's a policeman as well, and has been a member of this forum for years, and is still active here. I've PM'd him to ask him join us in this topic.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

23rd March 2006, 12:46 PM	#457
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	Wow. I just read The Business of Preying, and my temper is flaring. One really great part: Quote: On one occasion a psychic contacted Paula, Billy’s sister, and said “For $225.00, I will find your brother." Paula's answer was very commendable; she replied" there is a $15,000 reward out for the return or recovery of my brother, find him and the money is yours." Her reply was "I don't do business like that." This is really, really great stuff. Every journalism student in the world should be required to read it.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

23rd March 2006, 01:06 PM	#458
elaine Killer Squirrel Killer Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,145	Originally Posted by Luke T. Wow. I just read The Business of Preying, and my temper is flaring. One really great part: This is really, really great stuff. Every journalism student in the world should be required to read it. My temper will start flaring, after I stop crying for the family. Like they aren't going through enough.

23rd March 2006, 02:05 PM	#459
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766	Originally Posted by Luke T. We still have Andalyn. He's a policeman as well, and has been a member of this forum for years, and is still active here. I've PM'd him to ask him join us in this topic. Looking at the posting histories of Stumpy and Hannibal, it seems like Hannibal lost the desire to post, or possibly the will to live, as a result of Lucianarchy's repulsive behavior --- and hasn't been seen since Feb '04. Stumpy, OTOH, only ever posted every few months anyway --- last seen last September. He may well be contactable. It's worth a go. I'll PM them --- it's not as though I'm asking them a personal favor.
Dr Adequate Banned Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 17,766

23rd March 2006, 03:28 PM	#460
Katachresis Learning to Fly Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 2,423	I am toying with the idea of contacting one of my cousins. He has been a detective in a suburban city for over 25 years. I fear broaching the subject with him. The next time we are together, I will feel him out, get some general impressions. I doubt I could ask him for contributions here, but at least get an idea about what he thinks about the subject.

23rd March 2006, 08:10 PM	#461
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Hello all, I did ask Janice Smolinski if she would name any of the psychics, but apparently she did not feel comfortable doing so. I will be meeting her this weekend in NC, and I plan on asking her about this. Wouldn't it be lovely to stop that wretched person in her tracks? That would be a good idea to bring in some policemen who have experience in this area. I would love to hear their take on it. For those who do not know, I will be away starting tomorrow morning through Monday. I'll be in Wilmington, NC, for the 2nd annual Cue Center conference, which is a gathering of organizations, such as ours, and family members of missing persons. I'll be speaking on Saturday night at the National Candlelight Vigil, held in downtown Wilmington, near the Cape Fear River. I'm not sure how much internet time I will have while there, so I will be scarse around these parts. If any psychics come looking for me, tell them they have the wrong number for me, but that we have their number. Thanks, everyone, for everything. Kelly

24th March 2006, 04:16 PM	#462
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716	After Kelly placed my article about Nancy Myer and KPTV on her site, I emailed KPTV to let them know about it. I just got an email from the reporter who did the story: Quote: Thank you for the link. Very interesting article. We appreciate your feedback. Take care and hope to hear from you again. And that is it.
Luke T. Guest Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 14,716

26th March 2006, 01:12 PM	#463
elaine Killer Squirrel Killer Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,145	Your opinions please Kelly, Last week, the Denver Post had this article regarding a medium that moved to the area. A very one-sided and pro psychic article. http://www.denverpost.com/search/ci_3602480 I would like to add to what this letter writer wrote in today's (March 26th)paper, using Kelly as a for instance. http://www.denverpost.com/letters First of all, is this okay with you? And secondly, assuming it is, any input from the forum would be greatly appreciated. I don't write as clearly and precisely as I'd like. Here is a rough draft I read with interest, the March 19th article 'Spiritual Medium At Large' . And like Mr. Barnhart, am very disappointed in the lack of balance and skepticism in the article. The letter writer is correct in his comments regarding cold reading. In the spirit of good reporting, I would like to suggest to the editors a follow-up article, discussing cold reading techniques and perhaps interviewing someone like Kelly Jolkowski of http://voice4themissing.blogspot.com, regarding her experiences with well-intentioned mediums. Thanks!

26th March 2006, 07:29 PM	#464
dubious New Blood Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 4	Kelly,you have my deepest sympathy and utmost admiration for your courage. Definition of the 'supernatural. "the most extraordinary claims made by the ordinary of people. Do not relant to the onslaught of delusional believers you will confront. Your cause is a noble one. Kindest regards.
dubious New Blood Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 4

27th March 2006, 06:55 AM	#465
elaine Killer Squirrel Killer Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,145	Sent it off Thank you, Kelly, for the ok to use your name and website in my letter to the Denver Post editor. I made a couple of small changes. We'll see if they print it.

28th March 2006, 07:31 PM	#466
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	Hi all, I'm back from my trip, but it looks like it's going to take me several days to catch up on things. I still wanted to pop in and express my thanks. That's too bad that you only received a form response, Luke T, but it's always possible that your article did have an impact, one that this author is not revealing. Thanks, Elaine, for writing to the Denver Post. Working together, we can make a difference for someone. At the conference, the blog series was a topic of several conversations. One man said that someone came to him about psychics, and he pointed them to the series. That person came back to him, apologized, indicating she had no idea, but that now she knows better.

28th March 2006, 09:06 PM	#467
ysabella Muse Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 701	Originally Posted by KellyJ At the conference, the blog series was a topic of several conversations. One man said that someone came to him about psychics, and he pointed them to the series. That person came back to him, apologized, indicating she had no idea, but that now she knows better. Hooray! Result!!
ysabella Muse Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 701	__________________ "The greater the ignorance, the greater the dogmatism." - Sir William Osler

29th March 2006, 07:18 AM	#468
elaine Killer Squirrel Killer Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,145	sorry double post

29th March 2006, 07:18 AM	#469
elaine Killer Squirrel Killer Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,145	Originally Posted by KellyJ Hi all, I'm back from my trip, but it looks like it's going to take me several days to catch up on things. I still wanted to pop in and express my thanks. That's too bad that you only received a form response, Luke T, but it's always possible that your article did have an impact, one that this author is not revealing. Thanks, Elaine, for writing to the Denver Post. Working together, we can make a difference for someone. At the conference, the blog series was a topic of several conversations. One man said that someone came to him about psychics, and he pointed them to the series. That person came back to him, apologized, indicating she had no idea, but that now she knows better. Very cool, about the blog experience at the conference. Regarding the letter to the Post, I wish I had read the article when it came out last week. Sending a response earlier would have helped, I'm sure. Another forum user pm'd me the reporter's email address. I'm sending her a version of the letter. If anything comes of it, I'll let everyone know.

29th March 2006, 06:56 PM	#470
prewitt81 Notoriously Glorious Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,226	I just received a letter from "psychic" Skye Alexander http://www.skyealexander.com/ in which she claims that she "help[s] police across the United States solve homicides, missing person, and suicide cases." My gut reaction is to send her an email pointing her to the soon-to-be psychicpredators.com, but I'm guessing that she'll just delete it and send my address to spam harvesters. Any ideas on how to proceed? Once the website is up, I won't have a problem contacting her if we have official email addresses. Honestly, I delete a lot of spam anyways, and might just fire one off to her while I'm still hot about it.
	__________________ Knowledge is Power! "If we want to teach the Moon is green cheese then we'll do it!" -- Eric Hovind defending his father's pro-creationist stance. (http://www.kent-hovind.com/) "Believe those who seek the truth. Doubt those who find it."

29th March 2006, 06:58 PM	#471
Ducky Guest Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 11,933	Originally Posted by prewitt81 I just received a letter from "psychic" Skye Alexander http://www.skyealexander.com/ in which she claims that she "help[s] police across the United States solve homicides, missing person, and suicide cases." My gut reaction is to send her an email pointing her to the soon-to-be psychicpredators.com, but I'm guessing that she'll just delete it and send my address to spam harvesters. Any ideas on how to proceed? Once the website is up, I won't have a problem contacting her if we have official email addresses. Honestly, I delete a lot of spam anyways, and might just fire one off to her while I'm still hot about it. Ask Skye what exactly needs to be solved about a suicide? It's one of the few death investigations in which the victim and the perpetrator are readily apparent.
Ducky Guest Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 11,933

29th March 2006, 07:19 PM	#472
prewitt81 Notoriously Glorious Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,226	Originally Posted by fowlsound Ask Skye what exactly needs to be solved about a suicide? It's one of the few death investigations in which the victim and the perpetrator are readily apparent. I would guess, there, that she probably engages in the normal scumbaggery and gives false reasons for the suicide, and assurances that the "departed soul" is in a better place.
	__________________ Knowledge is Power! "If we want to teach the Moon is green cheese then we'll do it!" -- Eric Hovind defending his father's pro-creationist stance. (http://www.kent-hovind.com/) "Believe those who seek the truth. Doubt those who find it."

29th March 2006, 07:21 PM	#473
Ducky Guest Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 11,933	Originally Posted by prewitt81 I would guess, there, that she probably engages in the normal scumbaggery and gives false reasons for the suicide, and assurances that the "departed soul" is in a better place. Which is a despicable tactic, and had anyone purportedly done that to me or my family after my father's suicide, I would have kicked them right in the genitals. I say we get this one. Email her back and ask for a specific cop to reference in each case seh has worked on so that you can "verify her credentials before making any decisions on soliciting her services." See if she even returns one cop's name.
Ducky Guest Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 11,933

29th March 2006, 07:31 PM	#474
prewitt81 Notoriously Glorious Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,226	Originally Posted by fowlsound Which is a despicable tactic, and had anyone purportedly done that to me or my family after my father's suicide, I would have kicked them right in the genitals. I say we get this one. Email her back and ask for a specific cop to reference in each case seh has worked on so that you can "verify her credentials before making any decisions on soliciting her services." See if she even returns one cop's name. I'm on it. I'll start a new thread with any replies I receive.
	__________________ Knowledge is Power! "If we want to teach the Moon is green cheese then we'll do it!" -- Eric Hovind defending his father's pro-creationist stance. (http://www.kent-hovind.com/) "Believe those who seek the truth. Doubt those who find it."

29th March 2006, 08:36 PM	#475
Kelly Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Renton, WA Posts: 6,277	HI Prewitt...good to see you again. Besides the usual comments, I can honestly say that this woman, Syke, has the spookiest eyes. Thanks for the prompt attention to this matter. She's pretty vague about her "accomplishments", but that's not a surprise.