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The Electric Comet Theory /SAFIRE Part VI

Oh, look a comet asteroid!

New analysis of asteroid dust reveals evidence of salty water in the early solar system


Asteroid Bennu was targeted for the OSIRIS-REx mission because remote sensing observations from Earth indicated it as a B-type asteroid. These asteroids are rich in carbon and hydrated clay minerals, possibly sharing similarities to the most primitive group of meteorites on Earth, known as carbonaceous chondrites.

Any hydrated clays found in/on comets?

Pristine asteroid samples reveal secrets of the ancient solar system


Asteroid Bennu is thought to be made of rubble fragments from a 4.5-billion-year-old parent body, containing materials that originated beyond Saturn, which was destroyed long ago in a collision with another object.

The findings from returned samples of asteroid Bennu may provide researchers insight into what happens on distant icy bodies in our solar system, such as Saturn's moon Enceladus and the dwarf planet Ceres in the asteroid belt.


"Both Enceladus and Ceres have subsurface brine oceans," Associate Professor Timms said. "Even though asteroid Bennu has no life, the question is could other icy bodies harbor life?"

Good to see the comet/asteroid story coalesce.

The ELECTRIC COMET.


.
 
Errrr, when it encounters the solar wind? Otherwise, all you have is the photelectric effect. Want to answer your own question, given that the solar wind is getting nowhere near the comet for months on end?

Yeah, ok.

Conclusions.

Collisional cooling of electrons following a radial outward path is not sufficient to explain the observations. We suggest that the ambipolar electric field keeps electrons in the inner coma for a much longer time, giving them time to dissipate energy by collisions with the neutrals. We conclude that better models are required to describe the plasma environment of comets. They need to include at least two populations of electrons and the ambipolar field.

What's this ambipolar electric field?

Impact ionisation, anyone?
 
It hasn't. Asteroids are asteroids. Comets are comets. There are some bodies which seem to be intermediate between the two. None of which is of any relevance to the electric comet woo.


Ok.

Asteroid Bennu was targeted for the OSIRIS-REx mission because remote sensing observations from Earth indicated it as a B-type asteroid. These asteroids are rich in carbon and hydrated clay minerals, possibly sharing similarities to the most primitive group of meteorites on Earth, known as carbonaceous chondrites.
Righto then...

ELECTRIC COMET MODEL:
• Comets are debris produced during violent electrical interactions of planets
and moons in an earlier phase of solar system history. Comets are similar to
asteroids, and their composition varies. Most comets should be homogeneous—
their interiors will have the same composition as their surfaces. They
are simply “asteroids on eccentric orbits.”

I wonder what the MAINSTREAM reckon?

We are continuing to investigate Bennu using the pristine samples collected back in 2020. We are currently researching the timing of the Bennu parent body breakup event and looking for evidence of impacts recorded by various minerals in the samples.

What's this "break up event" and what "parent body", jd116?

.
 
jonesdave116 said:


It hasn't. Asteroids are asteroids. Comets are comets. There are some bodies which seem to be intermediate between the two. None of which is of any relevance to the electric comet woo.

Samples returned from the asteroid Ryugu are similar to Ivuna-type carbonaceous meteorites

Phyllosilicate minerals are the main host of water in the Ryugu samples. The amount of structural water in Ryugu is similar to that in CI chondrites, but interlayer water is largely absent in Ryugu, which suggests a loss of interlayer water to space. The abundance of structural water and results from dehydration experiments indicate that the Ryugu samples remained below ~100°C from the time of aqueous alteration until the present. We ascribe the removal of interlayer water to a combination of impact heating, solar heating, solar wind irradiation, and long-term exposure to the ultrahigh vacuum of space. The loss of interlayer water from phyllosilicates could be responsible for the comet-like activity of some carbonaceous asteroids and the ejection of solid material from the surface of asteroid Bennu.


Rogee...

Spitzer Spectral Observations of the Deep Impact Ejecta


Spitzer Space Telescope imaging spectrometer observations of comet 9P/Tempel 1 during the Deep Impact encounter returned detailed, highly structured, 5- to 35-micrometer spectra of the ejecta. Emission signatures due to amorphous and crystalline silicates, amorphous carbon, carbonates, phyllosilicates, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, water gas and ice, and sulfides were found. Good agreement is seen between the ejecta spectra and the material emitted from comet C/1995 O1 (Hale-Bopp) and the circumstellar material around the young stellar object HD100546. The atomic abundance of the observed material is consistent with solar and C1 chondritic abundances, and the dust-to-gas ratio was determined to be greater than or equal to 1.3. The presence of the observed mix of materials requires efficient methods of annealing amorphous silicates and mixing of high- and low-temperature phases over large distances in the early protosolar nebula.

So, Asteroids are asteroids. Comets are comets.

Right. :sneaky:
 
I'll bite.

There are some bodies which seem to be intermediate between the two.

Which ones? What are the characteristics?


Bunnu and Ryugu are in the solid ASTEROID classification, I take it?

.
 
Why are you linking to what amounts to a press release about the paper instead of the paper itself? And this isn't news. But it's not enough to just note that there are other forces. The magnitude of those forces matters. Which is where figure 12 of the paper comes in. They do the math (something the EUtards never even try) and calculate how big those forces are. And how big are they? From less than 0.00005 times the force of gravity to less than 0.0000000000000000001 times the force of gravity.

Yeah, that's really going to show those gravity guys how irrelevant gravity is compared to electromagnetism. :rolleyes:
 
Nope, basic plasma physics as known for many decades before your cult even existed.

Agreed.

Basic plasma physics.

Electric field measurements at the plasma frequency around comet 67P by RPC-MIP on board Rosetta


Results. We are showing that strong electric field emissions at the plasma frequency near 67P were present sporadically throughout the period when Rosetta was escorting the comet, without being continuous, as the occurrence rate is reported to be of about 1% of all the measured RPC-MIP passive spectra showing strong electric field emissions. The Langmuir wave activity monitored by RPC-MIP showed measurable enhancements during SIR or CME interactions and near perihelion.

Langmuir wave get a touch up when the SOLAR PLASMA whips past!
 
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Why are you linking to what amounts to a press release about the paper instead of the paper itself? And this isn't news. But it's not enough to just note that there are other forces. The magnitude of those forces matters. Which is where figure 12 of the paper comes in. They do the math (something the EUtards never even try) and calculate how big those forces are. And how big are they? From less than 0.00005 times the force of gravity to less than 0.0000000000000000001 times the force of gravity.

Yeah, that's really going to show those gravity guys how irrelevant gravity is compared to electromagnetism. :rolleyes:



:lolsign:

Planetary Systems.​



But

How's the LORENTZ FORCE go, compared to GRAVITY, when you are try to "move" PLASMA?

In exoplanetary systems and debris disks, nongravitational forces affect the lifetimes of circumstellar particles and feed refractory debris to the photospheres of the central stars.

Including charged DUST, a complex PLASMA.

or a you still talking orbits?

.
 
jd116, would also know, of course, that the SOLAR PLASMA (Sun winds) is getting NOWHERE near the nucleus.

So where are all these ELECTRONS (including negativity CHARGED DUST) coming from?

.

Observations of a mix of cold and warm electrons by RPC-MIP at 67P/Churyumov-Gerasimenko


The influence of the ambipolar electric potential, associated to the cometary plasma inhomogeneities and localized around the comet nucleus, in terms of particle trapping, might facilitate the electron cooling. This hypothesis shall be investigate in further details from global modeling (Deca et al. 2017, 2019; Sishtla et al. 2019) to investigate the physical processes at the origin of the cold electron population far from perihelion reported in this study.

ok

Therefore, the observation of cold electrons by RPC-MIP at the end of the Rosetta cometary operations is not consistent with the cooling of newborn electrons that are ballistically escaping the inner coma region, but is rather consistent with electron that would stay longer in the denser inner cometary atmosphere region, and therefore with electrons that got trapped in the inner coma by the ambipolar electric field as shown in recent kinetic simulations of cometary electron dynamics (Deca et al. 2017, 2019; Sishtla et al. 2019).


No Solar wind though, so...


:runaway

.
 
Why is the solar wind not reaching the surface of the comet, again, jd116?

outgassing or double layer?

.
 
And.....? Do I need to remind you what the electric comet woo says? And it has precisely nothing to do with plasma physics, and was invented by people with zero clue about the subject.

You are a giggle, jd116!

Basic question.

What is a comet?

To narrow the focus on the ELECTRIC COMET and the DIRTYSNOWBALL, the ROSETTA mission confirmed the existence of "jets".

It is now thought that "jets" are?
and

How Do Cometary Jets Work?

.
 
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You are a giggle, jd116!

Basic question.

What is a comet?

To narrow the focus on the ELECTRIC COMET and the DIRTYSNOWBALL, the ROSETTA mission confirmed the existence of "jets".

It is now thought that "jets" are?
and

How Do Cometary Jets Work?

.
We already knew what jets were. Duh!
 
Involves dust and sublimation, yeah?

Comet_activity_22_November_2014.jpg
Credits: ESA/Rosetta/MPS for OSIRIS Team MPS/UPD/LAM/IAA/SSO/INTA/UPM/DASP/IDA

As such, the nucleus is deliberately overexposed in order to reveal faint jets and the collimated nature of the streams of gas and dust rising from the surface.


:whistling

.
 
Involves dust and sublimation, yeah?

View attachment 58883
Credits: ESA/Rosetta/MPS for OSIRIS Team MPS/UPD/LAM/IAA/SSO/INTA/UPM/DASP/IDA




:whistling

.
As observed. What are you struggling with? When we look at jets spectroscopically, we see GAS. Cold, neutral, GAS. And the DUST is what is reflecting the sunlight. That is why it has a solar spectrum. And of course they are faint. The material of the comet's surface has an albedo of ~ < 5%. So, the DUST in the jets is going to have a low albedo isn't it? Only on a handful of occasions were the jets brighter than the nucleus. Likely caused by ice entrained along with the dust. Just as was seen at Hartley 2.
 
As observed.

What I'm struggling with is, when we get down in the weeds, it's not how it works. Is it now JD116.

All this data and time from an comet escort mission and you are still clutching straws

and still...

Overall then, important questions about the cometary activity mechanism still remain unanswered, and it is still a struggle to explain how dust of various sizes is broken off and lifted from the surface.

What the hell are the "scientist" doing? It's embarrassing.

Your dirtysnowball is dead. Has been for sometime. The struggle is real!

Little bit more $$$$ and a few dedicated mission and i;m sure you'll find the same fatal problems for your mainstream dirtysnowball model.

I'll start with the NUCLEUS is CHARGED (with respect to the solar PLASMA) the DUST is CHARGED and responding to ELECTRIC FIELDS.

Sublimation is a bust!



:redface1
 
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As observed.

What I'm struggling with is, when we get down in the weeds, it's not how it works. Is it now JD116.

All this data and time from an comet escort mission and you are still clutching straws

and still...



What the hell are the "scientist" doing? It's embarrassing.

Your dirtysnowball is dead. Has been for sometime. The struggle is real!

Little bit more $$$$ and a few dedicated mission and i;m sure you'll find the same fatal problems for your mainstream dirtysnowball model.

I'll start with the DUST is CHARGED and responding to ELECTRIC FIELDS.

Sublimation is a bust!



:redface1
Gibberish. Sublimation is observed. Get over it. And the dust is entrained in GAS not in non-existent electric fields.
 
Seems you are wrong.

Your model is bust. You can do your song and dance on sublimation and GAS but it don't work like that.

or are you saying N Attree et al are wrong? Their maths works out. The ASSUMPTION on the other hand...

Q is your BIGGEST assumption

.
 
Seems you are wrong.

Your model is bust. You can do your song and dance on sublimation and GAS but it don't work like that.

or are you saying N Attree et al are wrong? Their maths works out. The ASSUMPTION on the other hand...

Q is your BIGGEST assumption

.
No, I'm not wrong. Sublimation is observed and dust is observed to be entrained by gas. Get over it.
 
Is a lie. Point to any paper by him that says sublimation is not happening. Otherwise quit with the lies. You have no science.

Sublimation model of comets is incorrect. The new data from recent missions and experiments have now CONFIRMED this mechanism to NOT be the DOMINATE DRIVER of cometary activity.

Do you even do science?

Where are all these ELECTRONS and CHARGED DUST coming from, we most definTLY OBSERVE this.

Your SUBLIMATION model fell over using the 1957 Haser model as the basis for Q, the "outgassing" rate.

The Haser model was pivotal in helping astronomers understand the composition and behavior of cometary comas, leading to more accurate measurements of the amount of gas and dust being ejected by comets. It also contributed to refining our understanding of the dynamics of comet tails.

Radial Distribution of Gas: The model provides an explanation for the distribution of gases in the coma. It suggests that the concentration of a gas decreases as you move away from the nucleus, with a more significant density closer to the nucleus and a gradual decrease outward.

Well that's wrong, Not even close to an approximation. Just at guess at best.

Outgassing Process: As the comet heats up near the Sun, volatile materials such as water, carbon monoxide, and carbon dioxide SUBLIMATE from the nucleus. This outgassing produces the coma and also drives the formation of the comet’s tail, via dust entranment.

This is YOUR model jd116. and you cant get the dust to entrain in the GAS, so?:lolsign:
 
Comets are CHARGED rocks on eccentric orbits. Pretty simple.

Results. We are showing that strong electric field emissions at the plasma frequency near 67P were present sporadically throughout the period when Rosetta was escorting the comet, without being continuous, as the occurrence rate is reported to be of about 1% of all the measured RPC-MIP passive spectra showing strong electric field emissions. The Langmuir wave activity monitored by RPC-MIP showed measurable enhancements during SIR or CME interactions and near perihelion.


At what point does the "dust" from the surface of the nucleus become CHARGED and respond to these STRONG ELECTRIC FIELDS?

There are quite a few electrons that can stick to the dust (making it a PLASMA, complex PLASMA but still a PLASMA making the MATH HARD) These are MASSIVE negative particles. We "see" this in our pretty pictures, like this one....


Comet_67P_15_April_2015.jpg
 
Hey Sol88, when did you last change your signature? I'm not sure I noticed it before, but your signature says that plasma is a gas.
 

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