The Definition of Skepticism

[Orphia Nay]

My position is that skeptical inquiry was incidental to the establishment of the forum. There's a reason so many of the most regularly active threads are social games of one kind or another. There's a reason Gravy moved on, when his work here was done.

What's the reason?

 

[theprestige]

What's the reason?

I led with the reason.

For those of you just tuning in, and struggling to follow the conversation: Scroll up.

 

[Orphia Nay]

historically more of a TAM alum social club

You mean this?

 

[theprestige]

You mean this?

It depends. Do you have any kind of interesting dissent or addition to the premise? Or are you just playing out this act of confusion?

 

[Orphia Nay]

It depends. Do you have any kind of interesting dissent or addition to the premise? Or are you just playing out this act of confusion?

Why is only dissent interesting?

I'm interested in why you (and Cosmic Yak) call discourse here "social games", and why you apparently see the forum negatively.

 

[theprestige]

Why is only dissent interesting?

To you? I have no idea. I clearly included agreement in my question.

Why do you have neither?

I'm interested in why you (and Cosmic Yak) call discourse here "social games",

I don't call (all the) discourse here social games. I call the explicit and popular and active social game threads social games, and a much more defining feature of this forum than the skeptical inquiry CY imagines.

and why you apparently see the forum negatively.

I don't see the forum negatively. It's one of the few multipartisan online spaces where trans rights ideology can be openly challenged without sanction, for example. You don't find that very often.

 

[Pixel42]

I have to say I do raise an eyebrow when I click on New Posts to see if any interesting new threads have been started, and see the number of active threads which can indeed accurately be described as social games. They do seem to outnumber the threads which contain serious discussion by some margin.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

Why is only dissent interesting?

I'm interested in why you (and Cosmic Yak) call discourse here "social games", and why you apparently see the forum negatively.

For my part, I would point to the US and UK Politics threads as examples of partisan bickering in the former, and a partisan echo chamber in the latter. The Israel/Palestine threads are all about trolling, hatred, and unevidenced assertions, and have also degenerated into echo chambers. I have quoted in this thread an example from the Science sub-forum of a member explicitly rejecting evidence as a way of establishing truth. Far too much of what goes on here has bugger all to do with scepticism, which is a great shame. Actual critical thinking is becoming increasingly rare here. It's more about posturing.

 

[arthwollipot]

My position is that skeptical inquiry was incidental to the establishment of the forum.

The forum was established by James Randi, pretty much the personification of skeptical inquiry.

It's one of the few multipartisan online spaces where trans rights ideology can be openly challenged without sanction, for example. You don't find that very often.

Damn shame in my opinion.

 

[Orphia Nay]

OK, theprestige doesn't see the forum negatively.

Do you see it negatively, on the whole, Cosmic Yak?

I avoid the Humor subforum, and have lately been staying out of most political topics, but I still find things of interest and good content even from people I don't often agree with politically.

 

[arthwollipot]

On the other hand, Humor is where I spend quite a lot of time.

 

[Pixel42]

Damn shame in my opinion.

If the belief that reality can be changed by the thoughts in someone's head can't be challenged on a sceptic's forum where on earth can it be challenged?

 

[steenkh]

For my part, I would point to the US and UK Politics threads as examples of partisan bickering in the former, and a partisan echo chamber in the latter.

Both threads could be called partisan echo chambers because of their lack of opposition. The same can be said of most science or paranormal threads, because even if there is opposition, it is tiny compared to the number of skeptics debating them.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

Both threads could be called partisan echo chambers because of their lack of opposition.

Disagree. There are a number of Trump supporters on this forum.

The same can be said of most science or paranormal threads, because even if there is opposition, it is tiny compared to the number of skeptics debating them.

Again, I disagree. Look at the global warming thread, for example. A good half of it is counterfactual claims. Opposition to facts is well represented.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

OK, theprestige doesn't see the forum negatively.

Do you see it negatively, on the whole, Cosmic Yak?

I avoid the Humor subforum, and have lately been staying out of most political topics, but I still find things of interest and good content even from people I don't often agree with politically.

Yes and no. I have said before that I think this forum is in decline, not just in terms of numbers, but also the quality of the conversation. Cynicism and partisan pigheadedness far outweigh scepticism and critical thinking. When I first joined, I was learning things all the time. Now I spend most of my time defending myself against trolls, and trying to persuade people to look at the facts. There are times when I get involved in a really good discussion, but these instances are becoming few and far between. I stick around because I still entertain the hope that things will improve. It is an increasingly forlorn hope, though.

 

[zooterkin]

A social club for people who had attended The Amazing Meeting at some point. It's untrue because I was a member of this forum for years before I made the pilgrimage.

Same here, though there was definitely the feel of an in-group about those who had been to TAM.

 

[theprestige]

Would it be nice, in your opinion, to have sceptical inquiry return to a more central role/place in this forum?

Yes, but I think it has to happen organically. Posting a manifesto and trying to enforce it is not the way.

Or are you happy with the social games (which I see as partisan bickering) predominating here?

I don't mind the social games. I think the partisan bickering is a millstone around the forum's neck.

If it were up to me, I wouldn't bother with an "official" definition of skepticism. I'd just abolish the political subs. I think it would go a long way towards improving skeptical debate here if people were expected to argue the merits of policies, rather than indulge in partisan bickering.

 

[zooterkin]

Several posts moved to AAH.

A reminder, please keep to the topic of this thread, which is not veganism/vegetarianism, nor one another; and if you want to discuss the way this forum is moderated, that belongs in FMF.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

 

[jimbob]

I have split the discussion about vegetarianism to a new thread

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: jimbob

 

[varwoche]

There's a fundamental problem. The owner of this forum is explicitly opposed to highlighting skepticism. This is reflected in the changes he made to forum organization, with the prominent expansion of Current Events.

I'd provide a link if we had a search function.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

There's a fundamental problem. The owner of this forum is explicitly opposed to highlighting skepticism. This is reflected in the changes he made to forum organization, with the prominent expansion of Current Events.

I'd provide a link if we had a search function.

(Apologies and etc.)

I could while away the hours
Conferrin' with the flowers,
Consulting with the rain;
And my head I'd be a scratchin'
While my thoughts are busy hatchin'
If I only had a SEARCH FUNCTION.

I'd unravel ev'ry riddle for my
Individdle
In trouble or in pain
With the thoughts that you'll be thinkin'
You could be another Lincoln
If you only had a SEARCH FUNCTION.

Oh, I, could tell you why
The oceans near the shore
I could think of things I'd never
Thunk before,
And then I'd sit down and think some more.

I would not be just a muffin',
My head all full of stuffin',
My heart all full of pain;
And perhaps I'd deserve you and be
Even worthy even you
If I only had a SEARCH FUNCTION.

 

[dann]

There's a fundamental problem. The owner of this forum is explicitly opposed to highlighting skepticism. This is reflected in the changes he made to forum organization, with the prominent expansion of Current Events.
I'd provide a link if we had a search function.

The expansion of current events was meant to be for stuff like this:
NJ Drones/Alien Mothership Drone Scare Thread'
Satanist display at State Capitol
How do we know a pandemic's over?
It just wasn't what happened.