Split Thread Maori Creationism in Science lessons

[smartcooky]

Can we have a count of people in this thread who are parents of a child at high school in New Zealand, who are presently studying in that science curriculum, please.

I'll go 1.

If you count grandparents, I'll go 3

 

[Myriad]

If you count grandparents, I'll go 3

Your grandparents are studying science in high school in New Zealand? Good on them!

 

[pipelineaudio]

Watching alleged skeptics special plead for this is the same crap as we had going on by pretty much the same people 10 years ago that boiled down to "its not grape if brown people do it"

Please, get over yourselves

As a Hawaiian, this is a HUGE problem for the future of our people, we need to stop these outside religious nuts from taking over our policy and education and have us fighting against our own self interest.

You may not like it being called a religion, fine, political ideology, whatever. Don't like the term SJW? Fine, use whatever word you want for anti-science, anti-speech, anti vaccine, anti "western medicine", identity politics activists who are pushing all this crap.

To New Zealand: we apologize that all these san fran, portland and seattle nutjobs made a stop at our airport before getting to you. We should have stopped them here, but we don;t want them either

 

[Roger Ramjets]

Arth, can you comment on the following?

From the level 6 "Physics Earth and Space Science" curriculum: "Explore how mauri is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore mauri."

Context is important.

The full line:-

explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the taiao. Explore how mauri is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore mauri.

taiao: world, Earth, natural world, environment, nature

mauri: life principle, life force, vital essence, special nature, a material symbol of a life principle, source of emotions - the essential quality and vitality of a being or entity. Also used for a physical object, individual, ecosystem or social group in which this essence is located

Translated to English:-

explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the environment. Explore how life is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore the ecosystem.

ecosystem.

An ecosystem (or ecological system) is a system that environments and their organisms form through their interaction. The biotic and abiotic components are linked together through nutrient cycles and energy flows.

Biotic material

Biotic material or biological derived material is any material that originates from living organisms.

 

[Roger Ramjets]

"explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the environment. Explore how life is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore ecosystems."​

Sounds innocuous enough.

But hang on. Why is it essential to care for the environment?

It isn't of course. Science is totally agnostic on the subject. It doesn't care how much we rape the land for fun and profit - though it certainly helps us do it. Scientists are working in laboratories right now trying to figure out cheaper ways to extract fossil fuels and burn them, or create nanoparticles that will get into organisms and cause cytotoxicity, and many other damaging technologies that science is enabling and encouraging.

But how how can it be that science, that ivory tower of pure research into how the world works, has become the useful idiot of capitalism and its destruction of ecosystems so essential to life (including our own)? Look no further than... the Bible!

Genesis 1:28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

We did that alright. First we 'multiplied' and 'subdued' Europe until there wasn't enough left to support us, then we looked for new lands to exploit. Starting with missionaries to soften up the locals so we could steal their land ("it doesn't belong to you, it's God's!"), then we proceeded to recreate a bit of home in the Antipodes while we shipped the spoils back to Mother England.

Not content with stripping all the bush off to create farmland, we then saturated the land with fertilizers and poisons, developed with the help of science. And anyone who opposed it was branded a 'greenie' or 'indigenous rights activist'. How dare they get in the way of our God-given right to subdue the Earth? And what foolishness it is to suggest that science might not be all about discovering more effective ways to profit?

Science itself may be agnostic, but the directions we push research aren't. Culture and religion have a big influence on what gets studied and what doesn't, as well as how the knowledge is used. The Christian commands to "go forth and multiply" and "subdue the Earth" are still embedded in our so-called secular society. And it's embedded in our science too. Can't see it? That's because you are a part of the culture that's doing it.

 

[Paul2]

Context is important.

The full line:-


taiao: world, Earth, natural world, environment, nature

mauri: life principle, life force, vital essence, special nature, a material symbol of a life principle, source of emotions - the essential quality and vitality of a being or entity. Also used for a physical object, individual, ecosystem or social group in which this essence is located

Translated to English:-

explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the environment. Explore how life is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore the ecosystem.

ecosystem.

Biotic material

From what of that context do you conclude that the anti-scientific idea of an essence per mauri is not being taught within the science curriculum?

 

[smartcooky]

Context is important.

The full line:-


taiao: world, Earth, natural world, environment, nature

mauri: life principle, life force, vital essence, special nature, a material symbol of a life principle, source of emotions - the essential quality and vitality of a being or entity. Also used for a physical object, individual, ecosystem or social group in which this essence is located

Translated to English:-

explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the environment. Explore how life is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore the ecosystem.

ecosystem.

Biotic material

This post is the ultimate example of cherry-picking just the words you want to use to support a bull-**** claim, while hand-waving those that don't (or pretending they don't exist) because they tear the rug out from under your argument.

The very same words you context-ripped can be used to make the argument that Biblical Creationists make to argue their case for Creation to be taught in school science classes? You know this, right?

 

[smartcooky]

"explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the environment. Explore how life is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore ecosystems."​

Sounds innocuous enough.

But hang on. Why is it essential to care for the environment?

It isn't of course. Science is totally agnostic on the subject. It doesn't care how much we rape the land for fun and profit - though it certainly helps us do it. Scientists are working in laboratories right now trying to figure out cheaper ways to extract fossil fuels and burn them, or create nanoparticles that will get into organisms and cause cytotoxicity, and many other damaging technologies that science is enabling and encouraging.

But how how can it be that science, that ivory tower of pure research into how the world works, has become the useful idiot of capitalism and its destruction of ecosystems so essential to life (including our own)? Look no further than... the Bible!

Genesis 1:28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

We did that alright. First we 'multiplied' and 'subdued' Europe until there wasn't enough left to support us, then we looked for new lands to exploit. Starting with missionaries to soften up the locals so we could steal their land ("it doesn't belong to you, it's God's!"), then we proceeded to recreate a bit of home in the Antipodes while we shipped the spoils back to Mother England.

Not content with stripping all the bush off to create farmland, we then saturated the land with fertilizers and poisons, developed with the help of science. And anyone who opposed it was branded a 'greenie' or 'indigenous rights activist'. How dare they get in the way of our God-given right to subdue the Earth? And what foolishness it is to suggest that science might not be all about discovering more effective ways to profit?

Science itself may be agnostic, but the directions we push research aren't. Culture and religion have a big influence on what gets studied and what doesn't, as well as how the knowledge is used. The Christian commands to "go forth and multiply" and "subdue the Earth" are still embedded in our so-called secular society. And it's embedded in our science too. Can't see it? That's because you are a part of the culture that's doing it.

The Green Party manifesto is thataway ---------------->

 

[Graham2001]

The same idea that I posted in the Op is spreading to Australia as can be seen by this photograph of an ad from an Australian University.

 

[jeremyp]

"explore the effects of natural, and human-induced changes to the environment. Explore how life is an essential part of the natural and human-constructed world and how it is essential to maintain or restore ecosystems."​

Sounds innocuous enough.

But hang on. Why is it essential to care for the environment?

It isn't of course. Science is totally agnostic on the subject. It doesn't care how much we rape the land for fun and profit - though it certainly helps us do it. Scientists are working in laboratories right now trying to figure out cheaper ways to extract fossil fuels and burn them, or create nanoparticles that will get into organisms and cause cytotoxicity, and many other damaging technologies that science is enabling and encouraging.

But how how can it be that science, that ivory tower of pure research into how the world works, has become the useful idiot of capitalism and its destruction of ecosystems so essential to life (including our own)? Look no further than... the Bible!

Genesis 1:28 God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”

We did that alright. First we 'multiplied' and 'subdued' Europe until there wasn't enough left to support us, then we looked for new lands to exploit. Starting with missionaries to soften up the locals so we could steal their land ("it doesn't belong to you, it's God's!"), then we proceeded to recreate a bit of home in the Antipodes while we shipped the spoils back to Mother England.

Not content with stripping all the bush off to create farmland, we then saturated the land with fertilizers and poisons, developed with the help of science. And anyone who opposed it was branded a 'greenie' or 'indigenous rights activist'. How dare they get in the way of our God-given right to subdue the Earth? And what foolishness it is to suggest that science might not be all about discovering more effective ways to profit?

Science itself may be agnostic, but the directions we push research aren't. Culture and religion have a big influence on what gets studied and what doesn't, as well as how the knowledge is used. The Christian commands to "go forth and multiply" and "subdue the Earth" are still embedded in our so-called secular society. And it's embedded in our science too. Can't see it? That's because you are a part of the culture that's doing it.

Scientists are also the ones telling us what the consequences of all these actions are. I guarantee there is nothing in Mauri lore that tells us that burning hydrocarbons on the scale on which we do it os going to be catastrophic for us.

 

[theprestige]

Well I just found out about the Moa and the Haast's Eagle, both rendered promptly extinct by the Maori ways of knowing about ecology and conservation. So maybe not the best thing to try to honor and preserve those primitive beliefs in a modern curriculum.

 

[Klimax]

Well I just found out about the Moa and the Haast's Eagle, both rendered promptly extinct by the Maori ways of knowing about ecology and conservation. So maybe not the best thing to try to honor and preserve those primitive beliefs in a modern curriculum.

They can serve as a warning how even low tech humans can affect their environment..

 

[jeremyp]

Delete: forget it. Too long ago.

 

[smartcooky]

Well I just found out about the Moa and the Haast's Eagle, both rendered promptly extinct by the Maori ways of knowing about ecology and conservation. So maybe not the best thing to try to honor and preserve those primitive beliefs in a modern curriculum.

Actually nine species of Moa, several species of native ducks, geese petrels, shearwaters, rails, owls and raptors. You can add those to the delights of Māori knowledge.... and they are still given exceptions to take native specials such as wood pigeons for "traditional" and cultural reasons.

 

[jonesdave116]

Actually nine species of Moa, several species of native ducks, geese petrels, shearwaters, rails, owls and raptors. You can add those to the delights of Māori knowledge.... and they are still given exceptions to take native specials such as wood pigeons for "traditional" and cultural reasons.

I think it is still legal to kill a Welshman with a bow and arrow in Shrewsbury after dark. Never tried it.

 

[jonesdave116]

Having been educated to the age of 12 in England, and from then on in New Zealand, I would say that only in the former did I ever encounter any 'religious' education. For some reason the Church of England is allowed to run primary schools in England (where I now live again). You can't even get away with that in the religion mad country of the USA. It's against their constitution. I needed a letter from my parents to get out of RE in England. Go figure.

 

[Planigale]

Having been educated to the age of 12 in England, and from then on in New Zealand, I would say that only in the former did I ever encounter any 'religious' education. For some reason the Church of England is allowed to run primary schools in England (where I now live again). You can't even get away with that in the religion mad country of the USA. It's against their constitution. I needed a letter from my parents to get out of RE in England. Go figure.

Religious education is compulsory in all English schools not just CoE or RC. it is generic, and covers most major religions. CoE schools aren't particularly religious (speaking as a muslim girl who attended both junior and senior CoE schools). They do have religious based assemblies which I was exempt from but attended, I liked the choir and sang in the carol service. My mother had attended a catholic boarding school in India so the concept of a cross religious education was familiar.

Unlike the US, England is an officially Christian country, with a state church, whose head (Archbishop Cantab) is appointed by the PM, (of course the PM is appointed by the sovereign who is also nominal head of the CoE). Parliament regulates the church and bishops are part of the legislature.

 

[theprestige]

Having been educated to the age of 12 in England, and from then on in New Zealand, I would say that only in the former did I ever encounter any 'religious' education. For some reason the Church of England is allowed to run primary schools in England (where I now live again). You can't even get away with that in the religion mad country of the USA. It's against their constitution. I needed a letter from my parents to get out of RE in England. Go figure.

I think you missed the point of the thread entirely.