Kim Dotcom

Damien Evans said:
He's been found guilty of Computer Fraud, Data Espionage, Insider Trading and Embezzlement, all in Germany, so it's certainly accurate to call him a criminal.
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All of which should have prevented him from even being allowed to enter NZ. let alone get residency. However, I am looking for some evidence of criminality that is relevant to THIS case, and there isn't any. Our laws require that a case for extradition has to be adjudged on its own merits. Prior bad acts are NOT relevant (in fact, they are not even allowed to be taken into consideration) until such time he is found guilty, then they are looked at for sentencing.

There is little doubt that the charges by the US Legal authorities have been trumped up in order to meet the necessary requirements for extradition.
 
cullennz said:
Scum tends to sink
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Actually, the opposite is true...

sewagescum.jpg


... scum floats!!!

We use to have a saying many years ago...

Politicians in Parliament are like turds in a septic tank.... the biggest ones will always make their way to the top!!!
 
marplots said:
That's an interesting legal theory there but it brings up a critical question: If I create something of value to others, do I own it? Should I be able to sell it to others? To what extent should I be able to control its distribution?
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If I buy something, to what extent do I own it? Should I be able to loan or share it with others?

The purpose of intellectual property rights (including copyrights and patents) is to incentivize creativity by rewarding it - do you reject this idea? If not, how can you square it with the free-for-all that file sharing had become?
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I know why those laws were created, but I think they've been abused terribly by large media companies. Probably the best example is Disney lobbying to get copyright extended so that Mickey Mouse never falls into the public domain. This is especially ironic in Disney's case, since they built their empire on public domain works (Alice In Wonderland, Winne-the-Pooh, numerous fairy tales). They use public domain for their own benefit, but they never give back to it.

I think that copyright should be drastically shortened: perhaps 10-15 years. At the very least, copyright extensions should be something that you have to apply for. Of course, Disney would renew the copyrights on Mickey, Star Wars, etc. but at least that way something would fall into the public domain.

Patents are a whole other mess. I think that some things should be off limits for patents; for example, UI elements. If Apple or Xerox had patented the desktop metaphor (windows, folders, etc.) then Windows would've never been made and computing would be vastly different today. If patents are used this way, then they don't spur innovation, they actually stifle it.

It seems to me the logic is that "if enough people want to do it, it shouldn't be illegal," an example of the tyranny of the majority.
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I think the logic is more like "Sharing is a higher ideal than profits".

Sometimes the copyright holder isn't the best steward of content, either. Consider the famous case of the missing Doctor Who episodes. The BBC simply taped over them, because they didn't see any reason to preserve them. They didn't see any profit in it, so now those episodes are gone forever. Something like that is much less likely to happen today due to file-sharing.
 
Axiom_Blade said:
This is especially ironic in Disney's case, since they built their empire on public domain works (Alice In Wonderland, Winne-the-Pooh, numerous fairy tales).
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Winnie-the-Pooh was not public domain, Disney paid for a license in 1966. Most of the earlier works they used were public domain stories but not Pooh Bear. I think they'd run out of good public domain stuff to mine by 66 because most of the later stuff was licensed or created in-house.
 
Axiom_Blade said:
If I buy something, to what extent do I own it? Should I be able to loan or share it with others?
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I don't really have a solution to offer up. I can, however, describe a situation I am familiar with where the material is copyright free and ethics rule the terrain.

I'm an amateur magician and spend considerable time in the community (as do a few others on this forum). The secrets of magic tricks are not copyrightable (performances may be, but not methods). For some, this is the valuable thing, the thing created, and the "nut" (although there are nuances too, such as plotline or presentation ideas).

Since secrets are not under copyright, someone can legally share how tricks are done, and in fact, quite a number of youtube videos are out there consisting of "reveals." This tends to piss magicians off, many of whom make a living performing the tricks that are being exposed.

In general, it's considered bad form to republish someone else's idea as your own or to just give away secrets - even if you purchased the effect from the creator. Do it flagrantly enough and the community will shun you.

On the creative side, some magicians have just decided not to publish any more effects. Others only release material where they can sell a physical gimmick - the "necessary" to make the trick work - and bind customers with this item instead of just the intellectual property. Others seem to be able to crap out new (or updated) material on a regular basis, trying to keep ahead of the theft. If you can put something out as a $10 download, you may be able to generate enough volume to overcome what would otherwise be a ripped-and-shared $35 DVD. One further technique is the "pre-release." Items are sold before they exist to copy and share.

Has it been good or bad for magic generally?

This is an ongoing argument in the fraternity. I would estimate that most magicians feel the rampant exposure and file-sharing is harming magic and only disagree about the extent of the harm. A few see it as freeing, or point out that "trick collectors" can evolve into magicians themselves, or serve as fans who attend conventions, lectures, and performances. Still others claim that the real "magic" resides in the performer herself, not the secrets.

Me? I can only do the stuff I'm interested in - maybe a suite of 15 solid tricks, none of which I've invented myself. I pay attention to the new stuff, but for performances, I'm not going to change much and certainly not at the speed new stuff comes out. As long as people enjoy what I do, it doesn't seem to matter that I may have learned it decades ago.

But I also understand how IP theft (even, in this case, legal "theft") discourages creators from publishing - they say so directly. It does feel unethical, when you know someone has developed a presentation or trick over the course of a long career and, when they finally decide to release it to the fraternity, they can't make a decent return on such excellent work. It saddens me. It feels wrong.
 
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marplots said:
I don't really have a solution to offer up. I can, however, describe a situation I am familiar with where the material is copyright free and ethics rule the terrain.

I'm an amateur magician and spend considerable time in the community (as do a few others on this forum). The secrets of magic tricks are not copyrightable (performances may be, but not methods). For some, this is the valuable thing, the thing created, and the "nut" (although there are nuances too, such as plotline or presentation ideas).

Since secrets are not under copyright, someone can legally share how tricks are done, and in fact, quite a number of youtube videos are out there consisting of "reveals." This tends to piss magicians off, many of whom make a living performing the tricks that are being exposed.

In general, it's considered bad form to republish someone else's idea as your own or to just give away secrets - even if you purchased the effect from the creator. Do it flagrantly enough and the community will shun you.

On the creative side, some magicians have just decided not to publish any more effects. Others only release material where they can sell a physical gimmick - the "necessary" to make the trick work - and bind customers with this item instead of just the intellectual property. Others seem to be able to crap out new (or updated) material on a regular basis, trying to keep ahead of the theft. If you can put something out as a $10 download, you may be able to generate enough volume to overcome what would otherwise be a ripped-and-shared $35 DVD. One further technique is the "pre-release." Items are sold before they exist to copy and share.

Has it been good or bad for magic generally?

This is an ongoing argument in the fraternity. I would estimate that most magicians feel the rampant exposure and file-sharing is harming magic and only disagree about the extent of the harm. A few see it as freeing, or point out that "trick collectors" can evolve into magicians themselves, or serve as fans who attend conventions, lectures, and performances. Still others claim that the real "magic" resides in the performer herself, not the secrets.

Me? I can only do the stuff I'm interested in - maybe a suite of 15 solid tricks, none of which I've invented myself. I pay attention to the new stuff, but for performances, I'm not going to change much and certainly not at the speed new stuff comes out. As long as people enjoy what I do, it doesn't seem to matter that I may have learned it decades ago.

But I also understand how IP theft (even, in this case, legal "theft") discourages creators from publishing - they say so directly. It does feel unethical, when you know someone has developed a presentation or trick over the course of a long career and, when they finally decide to release it to the fraternity, they can't make a decent return on such excellent work. It saddens me. It feels wrong.
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It is hard to predict reading taste, but I thought the Christopher Brookmyre novel A Snowball in Hell was a great novel for lovers of the magic art. It is black, funny and totally horrific. $12.95 on Amazon from memory. I read it on kindle and trust some cash ended helping Chris pay his rent.
 
The Atheist said:
Just a note for any non-Kiwis who might not be up on the KD latest, he's found love and is a happy man.

I'm struggling to see the match myself, but one woman's meat and all that. Just that there are a few hundred kg of it in Kimmy's case.
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LOL. A quick Google search shows she has recently been palling around with that oxygen thief Max Key, and her ex-boyfriend has disappeared from Facebook faster than a bucket of KFC at the Dotcom mansion. Clearly having a big bank account is very slimming.
 
Hard Cheese said:
LOL. A quick Google search shows she has recently been palling around with that oxygen thief Max Key, and her ex-boyfriend has disappeared from Facebook faster than a bucket of KFC at the Dotcom mansion. Clearly having a big bank account is very slimming.
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A big bank account is the new black ...
 
Hard Cheese said:
LOL. A quick Google search shows she has recently been palling around with that oxygen thief Max Key, and her ex-boyfriend has disappeared from Facebook faster than a bucket of KFC at the Dotcom mansion. Clearly having a big bank account is very slimming.
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I hadn't caught up with that; another Max Key/Dotcom link. I recall Max's selfies with Kimmy's ex shortly after they split.

Can't be the money this time around, that pot's dry. Maybe she's a gamer.
 
Samson said:
It is hard to predict reading taste, but I thought the Christopher Brookmyre novel A Snowball in Hell was a great novel for lovers of the magic art. It is black, funny and totally horrific. $12.95 on Amazon from memory. I read it on kindle and trust some cash ended helping Chris pay his rent.
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Sounds like a good read. I'll have to see if I can find a rip to torrent.
 
The Atheist said:
ICan't be the money this time around, that pot's dry. Maybe she's a gamer.
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He must have a bit of cash left over if he can afford to rent a penthouse at the Hilton apartments. Now that she's moved in all she needs to do is stick it out (so to speak) for 3 years and she can claim half of everything under the Property Relationships Act.
 
Hard Cheese said:
He must have a bit of cash left over if he can afford to rent a penthouse at the Hilton apartments. Now that she's moved in all she needs to do is stick it out (so to speak) for 3 years and she can claim half of everything under the Property Relationships Act.
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Well, she didn't last three days.

Seems the online romance may have been a little different in reality. I dunno whether you know, but Kim Dotcom may well be the biggest bloke in the entire country - he is a downright giant.

I'm not small, at 6' 3" and 90 kg, but he is huge and I feel like a midget next to him. He must be a good three inches taller and 200 kg heavier than me. All fat, too, so it doesn't make him attractive, and I imagine fornication would be a challenge.
 
The Atheist said:
Well, she didn't last three days.

Seems the online romance may have been a little different in reality. I dunno whether you know, but Kim Dotcom may well be the biggest bloke in the entire country - he is a downright giant.

I'm not small, at 6' 3" and 90 kg, but he is huge and I feel like a midget next to him. He must be a good three inches taller and 200 kg heavier than me. All fat, too, so it doesn't make him attractive, and I imagine fornication would be a challenge.
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So how big were those dudes in Onewhero you played rugby against you said you were thumped by?

I hope Dotcom releases a new single to go head to head with Max Key's about their important love lives.
 
Samson said:
So how big were those dudes in Onewhero you played rugby against you said you were thumped by?

I hope Dotcom releases a new single to go head to head with Max Key's about their important love lives.
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Two words: sex tape.

One more word: Yikes!
 
Samson said:
So how big were those dudes in Onewhero you played rugby against you said you were thumped by?
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90kg is on the smaller side for professional rugby players. Lower grades, though, I imagine you get far more of the blubbery pie-eaters 120-130kg+

Samson said:
I hope Dotcom releases a new single to go head to head with Max Key's about their important love lives.
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Whenever I see a picture of Max Key in the Herald trying to look cool (usually surrounded by other airheads) it makes me laugh....because in 30 years time he is going to look like his father LOL
 
Samson said:
So how big were those dudes in Onewhero you played rugby against you said you were thumped by?
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No bigger than me, but I was by no means a big player.

Farm boys. That's all I have to say on the subject. Townies v cockies.

You know who wins that.
 
SpitfireIX said:
Wow. All I knew about Kim Dotcom before you bumped this thread is that he's one of Putin's stooges on Twix. Maybe he should have moved to Russia instead of NZ.
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Well I didn't bump the thread per se, it is a continuing case with hiatuses.
The irony is he is a tech creative whose niche would be California, but suboptimally from prison.
New Zealand is losing a smart dude, Europe could use him had they not destroyed the tech industry with paranoia and nonsensical regulation.
He started life as a German baby.
 
Samson said:
Well I didn't bump the thread per se, it is a continuing case with hiatuses.
The irony is he is a tech creative whose niche would be California, but suboptimally from prison.
New Zealand is losing a smart dude, Europe could use him had they not destroyed the tech industry with paranoia and nonsensical regulation.
He started life as a German baby.
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Oh yes, he's quite a guy.
 
Samson said:
Well I didn't bump the thread per se, it is a continuing case with hiatuses.
The irony is he is a tech creative whose niche would be California, but suboptimally from prison.
New Zealand is losing a smart dude, Europe could use him had they not destroyed the tech industry with paranoia and nonsensical regulation.
He started life as a German baby.
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:rolleyes:
You are, as usual, spouting recycled lies.
Schmitz is a convicted thief and fraudster, self-aggrandising liar, a "pump and dump" grifter, conspiracy nut and Putinist propagandist.
Your sort of person.
 
I suspect that as a person he is not pleasant. But I don't think what he did should be a crime, this seems to me a civil suit. Breach of copyright (even if as a carrier he is responsible) should be a pursuit for damages not a crime. As someone who had a patent I resent the fact I had to pay for a patent and the protection is very brief (relatively) whilst you can merely assert copyright, the protection is far longer, and you can utilise criminal law to protect copyright.
 
Planigale said:
I suspect that as a person he is not pleasant. But I don't think what he did should be a crime, this seems to me a civil suit. Breach of copyright (even if as a carrier he is responsible) should be a pursuit for damages not a crime. As someone who had a patent I resent the fact I had to pay for a patent and the protection is very brief (relatively) whilst you can merely assert copyright, the protection is far longer, and you can utilise criminal law to protect copyright.
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Interesting and welcome contribution to the discussion.
God if she exists forbid any mitigation of the crimes of this obvious genius.
 
Samson said:
Interesting and welcome contribution to the discussion.
God if she exists forbid any mitigation of the crimes of this obvious genius.
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:rolleyes:
His "genius" may be obvious to you, but to those if us with actual understanding it's a thin veneer covering his lies and self-aggrandisement.
 
catsmate said:
:rolleyes:
His "genius" may be obvious to you, but to those if us with actual understanding it's a thin veneer covering his lies and self-aggrandisement.
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Here is the question:
Is the world better to bury this high functioning human being in the criminal justice system, or consider the proposition the high functioning human being know as Planigale to consider alternative outcomes?
 
Samson said:
Here is the question:
Is the world better to bury this high functioning human being in the criminal justice system, or consider the proposition the high functioning human being know as Planigale to consider alternative outcomes?
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What in the hell are you saying? This is gibberish.
 
trustbutverify said:
Oh yes, he's quite a guy.
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I've heard his name for a few years, but I was blissfully unaware of any facts. I get the distinct impression from his post that he's antisemitic, what with the scare quotes and the JAQing off.

Alas, that's not a characteristic that's troublesome to Samson. That's the cesspool he swims in.
 
Planigale said:
I suspect that as a person he is not pleasant. But I don't think what he did should be a crime, this seems to me a civil suit. Breach of copyright (even if as a carrier he is responsible) should be a pursuit for damages not a crime. As someone who had a patent I resent the fact I had to pay for a patent and the protection is very brief (relatively) whilst you can merely assert copyright, the protection is far longer, and you can utilise criminal law to protect copyright.
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A quick internet search informs me that he's also accused of money laundering, racketeering and wire fraud.
 
smartcooky said:
Actually, the opposite is true...

[qimg]https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98915197/JREF/sewagescum.jpg[/qimg]

... scum floats!!!

We use to have a saying many years ago...

Politicians in Parliament are like turds in a septic tank.... the biggest ones will always make their way to the top!!!
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In days when the Conservatives were less malign (I was in sixth form) a friend had a badge that said "Tories are the cream of the country - rich, thick, clots"
 
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