Did hell just freeze over? Pope Benedict gives thumbs up to condoms

Ryokan

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Ryokan
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Pope Benedict XVI has said the use of condoms is acceptable "in certain cases", according to a new book.

He said condoms could reduce the risk of infection with HIV, such as for a prostitute, in a series of interviews he gave to a German journalist.
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When asked whether the Catholic Church is "fundamentally against the use of condoms", the Pope is said to have replied, in the book entitled Light of the World: The Pope, the Church and the Signs of the Times:

"It of course does not see it as a real and moral solution.

"In certain cases, where the intention is to reduce the risk of infection, it can nevertheless be a first step on the way to another, more humane sexuality," he said.

The Pope gives the example of the use of condoms by prostitutes as "a first step towards moralisation", even though condoms are "not really the way to deal with the evil of HIV infection".
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Ok, wow.
 
Just wow indeed. I just heard it on the radio too.
On the Dutch news he was quoted as condoning condoms in gay prostitution, which gave me a double wow.
 
I saw a picture of young Benedict with a condom on his thumb and a page at his elbow. I wondered what that was about. Thanks.
 
It makes perfect sense given the premises.

It's birth control that's evil, not a particular piece of hardware as such.
 
Femke said:
Just wow indeed. I just heard it on the radio too.
On the Dutch news he was quoted as condoning condoms in gay prostitution, which gave me a double wow.
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You've got to keep this clear though. They aren't condoning condoms, they aren't condoning homosexuality, and they aren't condoning prostitution. According to the church, any of the above will lead to an eternity in hell. Instead, they are saying that IF you're going to be visiting a gay prostitute, you might as well throw in the third sin of wearing a condom and be a bit safer about it. When they 'condone' condom use as a means for heterosexual couples in married, monogamous relationships to avoid either or both STDs or pregnancy, then it will be news.

For now, they might as well be telling murderers that they condone sharpening their knives first.
 
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You know , stuff like this kind of bugs me.

They condemn a useful , helpful, frankly, great tool. They cause pregnancies and std's through guilt, harm huge portions of the world through this, but....

They then make a statement that certain people could use them, because they are sinning anyway. And people are expected to say " wow, look at how far the church has came."

This is b.s, they deserve no praise, they wouldn't deserve any praise if they completely said " wrap your rascle.", stopping being a jerk, ( or in this case causing death, among other things.) is not grounds for praise. You cannot expect to be given praise for not doing something evil, they shouldn't have been doing it in the first place. Even a complete reversal of their position would simply put them at the same level as the rest of the civilized world. I don't get praise for not telling people not to use condoms, neither should they, at best they would reap the rewards of us not being able to point it out.

The catholic church seems like the kid who gets yelled at for bringing home nothing but F's as grades. They expects praise when he brings home d-'s. Sure it is better, but not at the acceptable level.

It would be like praising a murderer if he decided just to beat people till they were blind. Sure i would rather him do that than kill me, but he shouldn't be doing either.
 
sadhatter said:
This is b.s, they deserve no praise, they wouldn't deserve any praise if they completely said " wrap your rascle.", stopping being a jerk, ( or in this case causing death, among other things.) is not grounds for praise. You cannot expect to be given praise for not doing something evil, they shouldn't have been doing it in the first place. Even a complete reversal of their position would simply put them at the same level as the rest of the civilized world. I don't get praise for not telling people not to use condoms, neither should they, at best they would reap the rewards of us not being able to point it out.
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Are you waiting for the day when the Catholic Church does a 180 degree reversal on all their positions? Is that something you could expect?

The enlightenment of the Catholic Church will not come suddenly, if ever. But if it comes, it will be done small step by small step until they finally arrive at the sane position - just like they've done with slavery, the position on Jews, crusades, evolution, etc.

The Catholic Church is one of the most evil and vile organizations in the world, but there's no reason not to give them some positive reinforcements as they take baby steps down a path that could lead them to the same values that other rational human beings in the 21st century hold.

sadhatter said:
The catholic church seems like the kid who gets yelled at for bringing home nothing but F's as grades. They expects praise when he brings home d-'s. Sure it is better, but not at the acceptable level.
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Well, yelling at the kid that he still sucks when he has improved from F to D certainly won't help, will it? But some positive reinforcement would surely help, right? "You're still not doing well, kid, but at least you're doing better! Continue to improve!"
 
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It's been shown that the conception and the fetus development cannot take place in the rectal area of a male body. So what does the Holy See worry about?

:confused:
 
Does anyone have a link to the original article yet?

I've seen this reported like the OP, using "prostitute", and I've seen it discussed with "gay prostitute" AND "male prostitute.

Someone having translation issues or is there a lot of speculation floating around?
 
Ryokan said:
Are you waiting for the day when the Catholic Church does a 180 degree reversal on all their positions? Is that something you could expect?

The enlightenment of the Catholic Church will not come suddenly, if ever. But if it comes, it will be done small step by small step until they finally arrive at the sane position - just like they've done with slavery, the position on Jews, crusades, evolution, etc.

The Catholic Church is one of the most evil and vile organizations in the world, but there's no reason not to give them some positive reinforcements as they take baby steps down a path that could lead them to the same values that other rational human beings in the 21st century hold.



Well, yelling at the kid that he still sucks when he has improved from F to D certainly won't help, will it? But some positive reinforcement would surely help, right? "You're still not doing well, kid, but at least you're doing better! Continue to improve!"
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I have been keying your car for 2 months, i decide to stop and only pee on the windshield.

Are you going to praise me? Or are you going to tell me to stop *********** on your car?

They want praise? Start doing good things, limiting the bad things you do, is still doing bad things.
 
sadhatter said:
I have been keying your car for 2 months, i decide to stop and only pee on the windshield.

Are you going to praise me? Or are you going to tell me to stop *********** on your car?

They want praise? Start doing good things, limiting the bad things you do, is still doing bad things.
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Has anyone said the church is worthy of praise? It's a step in the right direction, and I don't see what's the big deal about acknowledging that.
 
epix said:
It's been shown that the conception and the fetus development cannot take place in the rectal area of a male body. So what does the Holy See worry about?

:confused:
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.
I was told years ago in high school that homosexuals (they used a shorter term) had their "sex glands" in their throats.
 
Abdul Alhazred said:
It makes perfect sense given the premises.

It's birth control that's evil, not a particular piece of hardware as such.
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Actually, I think it is sex outside of marriage and for purposes other than procreation and the enhancement of the marriage bonds that are considered perversions. Basically the Pope is saying that the use of a condom does not compound the sin and that these sinners should consider the health issues of not using condoms in the course of their sinful pursuits, particularly as many of them are married and risk the health of their partners (who may not be sinners) in the course of their immoral practices.
 
Much ado about nothing.
Maybe this will keep a few more Vatican priests from getting aids from each other.
 
Tricky said:
How about regular gay sex that is not prostitution? After all, neither is preventing conception.
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According to the church there are only two natural motivations for sex, to procreate within the bonds of marriage, and to strengthen and reinforce the bonds of marriage. Having sex for any other reason is a perversion of these natural motivations and sinful.

Accordingly, all men (and most women) are sinners,...I hope this wasn't a "news flash" moment.
 
Kopji said:
Much ado about nothing.
Maybe this will keep a few more Vatican priests from getting aids from each other.
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With each other, or with any gay partner they happen to be getting it on with.

This is an interesting phenom. One has to wonder if it isn't a cave to public pressure regarding preventing HIV, or, a cave to fears of a potential new scandal in the making if gay priests are revealed via any cases of HIV among themselves.
 
Someone (sorry I missed who it was) has just been on the radio* here talking about this and representing the Catholic Church.

Apparently male prostitutes never sleep with women, when the pope talked about male prostitutes he was exclusively referring to gay sex. Even when the interviewer pressed her to discuss male prostitutes sleeping with women, she was adamant that this never hapens.


Jeremy Vine's show on Radio 2, which people in the UK can hear again on iPlayer.
 
he mooved 1 mm, and you are WOW?
i was more like, move more idiot.
 
Pope's remarks in book open new chapter in condom debate

By John Thavis
Catholic News Service

VATICAN CITY (CNS) -- In a new book, Pope Benedict XVI said the use of condoms may be a sign of moral responsibility in some specific situations when the intention is to reduce the risk of AIDS.

The pope addressed the issue in the book-length interview, "Light of the World: The Pope, the Church and the Signs of the Times," which was to be released Nov. 23. The Vatican newspaper published excerpts from the book Nov. 20, including the comments on condoms.

In the book, the pope repeated what he said during a trip to Africa last year, that "we cannot solve the problem (of AIDS) by distributing condoms." Focusing exclusively on condoms damages human sexuality, making it "banal" and turning it into a kind of "drug," he said.

(Balance of article at URL above.)

No, it did not!
 
epix said:
It's been shown that the conception and the fetus development cannot take place in the rectal area of a male body. So what does the Holy See worry about?

:confused:
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Indeed... the RCC condone and employ the VYWtm method.*






* Virgin Youth Wrapper.


(Yes... I shall burn, I suppose.)
 
JihadJane said:
I saw a picture of young Benedict with a condom on his thumb and a page at his elbow. I wondered what that was about. Thanks.
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Are they against wearing one on you head? while visiting a male prostitute?
 
It's all about public image. Everything the catholic church does, it does to maintain a certain level of dominance it's been used to. The whole contraception issue makes it look really silly and quite evil (which it is in equal parts imo). The only reason they're back peddling on the issue is to claw back some public support.
 
Red3 said:
It's all about public image. Everything the catholic church does, it does to maintain a certain level of dominance it's been used to. The whole contraception issue makes it look really silly and quite evil (which it is in equal parts imo). The only reason they're back peddling on the issue is to claw back some public support.
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With the result that, whatever the Rat may have actually meant here, this is yet another classic example of the church claiming moral authority while reacting to contemporary morals, rather than actually trying to define its own morality. One might almost think that the morality of the Catholic Church was derived from its perception of public opinion rather than handed down from the ultimate authority.

Dave
 
Dave Rogers said:
With the result that, whatever the Rat may have actually meant here, this is yet another classic example of the church claiming moral authority while reacting to contemporary morals, rather than actually trying to define its own morality. One might almost think that the morality of the Catholic Church was derived from its perception of public opinion rather than handed down from the ultimate authority.

Dave
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Ultimate & from on high moral authority based on popular opinion! - The vatican's speciality these days. :confused:

The word of God (but only if it's popular). I preferred them when they did what they wanted without giving a s*&t.
 
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Dave Rogers said:
With the result that, whatever the Rat may have actually meant here, this is yet another classic example of the church claiming moral authority while reacting to contemporary morals, rather than actually trying to define its own morality. One might almost think that the morality of the Catholic Church was derived from its perception of public opinion rather than handed down from the ultimate authority.

Dave
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Actually, there is no change in the Pope's latests interviewed statements and traditional Catholic teachings and understandings at least with respect to the last half century or so that I've been paying attention to them.
 
So much for being a vanguard of conservative morality. The Vatican is decadent and decaying- their likely nomination of a Negro for Pope when Benedict dies off will be the final killing blow to any dignity they might have held prior to this announcement.
 
What am I going to do with these?
 

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Rockingham said:
So much for being a vanguard of conservative morality. The Vatican is decadent and decaying- their likely nomination of a Negro for Pope when Benedict dies off will be the final killing blow to any dignity they might have held prior to this announcement.
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Amen to that!

After all, I am sure that there are at least a few people who long for the good old days when the Catholic church, that vanguard of conservative morality, did things like cover-up the sex crimes that their priests commited against children.
 
I'd help, but I don't really know how to send stunned silence and a bewildered look via email. Perhaps attach a video clip?
 
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