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Cont: Criminal Charges/convictions Against Trump / Trump Indicted / Hush Money Part IV

It's gotten better but for the longest time Wikipedia had this bad habit of every article being written like:

"X is widely regarded as true. Here is all the evidence that X is true. Here are all the other experts X is true. There is no reason to even think that X might not be true. Everything we know about the world only works if X is true. Here's a simple experiment you can do yourself to show that X is true. Here's a picture of X.

However some people think X is not true."

A lot of the media is in that place right now.
 
steenkh said:
Can he pardon himself before he is convicted?
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Trump can do anything he wants until somebody stops him. I don't know how much clearer he can make that.

With the SCOTUS we have now Trump absolutely will be able to find a way to pardon himself, or do something functionally identical, if he gets back in office. They've already handed him a blank check in that regard.
 
arthwollipot said:
This makes it all the more important to vote for Harris/Walz. If Trump gets in the first thing he'll do is pardon himself.
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He won't be able to pardon himself until Jan. 20. Sentencing is in November, so if there's jail time, he'd be in jail until Jan. 20.

Better than nothing.
 
Thought these were state charges and hence (theoretically) unpardonable by the President.
 
The Don said:
Thought these were state charges and hence (theoretically) unpardonable by the President.
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I think you're correct. There are so many indictments and allegations it's hard to keep track. [snort]
 
Paul2 said:
I think you're correct. There are so many indictments and allegations it's hard to keep track. [snort]
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Doesn't mean that he couldn't try to pardon himself and/or SCOTUS rules that he can do so and/or that the charges shouldn't have been brought in the first place.
 
He owns the SCOTUS.* It would surprise me if they didn't cook up some damn thing or the other so Trump will skate on everything, whether they be federal or state charges. Probably the civil cases also too.


* 2/3rds of it anyway.
 
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They’re trying very hard to have the case removed to federal jurisdiction. If they managed to do that, the case could make it its way to the Supreme Court.
 
JayUtah said:
They’re trying very hard to have the case removed to federal jurisdiction. If they managed to do that, the case could make it its way to the Supreme Court.
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It's also very, very obvious exactly why they are desperate to have it moved to federal jurisdiction.
 
Not sure if/when these crimes will be investigated or, if anyone has seen this video. I found it enjoyable and worth sharing.

Where did Trump's money come from? ~20 minutes

 
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Wait, are people still thinking the legal system applies to Trump? Even if he gets convicted on every count in every trial he's allowed infinite appeals. He'll just appeal each and every one, each and every time, and for some reason he's allowed to do that perpetually. Trump's allowed to just say "well, I didn't like the verdict, so consider tossing out the verdict and the charges altogether" and then the courts say "okay, let's consider that, we'll talk about it next year" and then push back the clock again. If his 11,834th appeal doesn't win he'll just appeal for the 11,835th time. He's allowed to do this because he's Trump. You could try to sue him about the special treatment in court, but any judgment rendered there he could appeal forever so don't bother.

He's 96 years old and has infinite appeals, he's not going to face a day in jail or a dollar in fines. Whatever his eventual sentence it'll be carried out on his corpse and his estate.
 
TragicMonkey said:
He's 96 years old and has infinite appeals, he's not going to face a day in jail or a dollar in fines. Whatever his eventual sentence it'll be carried out on his corpse and his estate.
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I've said before that Trump finally running out of appeals, ironing out all the legal what-if-ing, finally getting convicted over something meaningful, making us go through the effort and time and money of trying to make some modern version of the Tower of London to house a populist demigog with an army of supporters ready to storm the Bastille (Yes the Tower of London is in the Bastille in my metaphor) for him, hiring and training a special vested security force to actually keep an eye on him.... and then just straight up dropping dead from a cheeseburger induced heart attack the very next day is exactly the kind of nonsense he would do.

More seriously like you I'm rapidly losing my patience with how certain people seem to get infinite "do overs" hoping to get the results they want.

Justice seems to get to "No we're done talking, the decision is final" point really goddamn quick for every low income black person serving a life sentence for selling the wrong plant too many times, but Trump launches a coup against our Country and apparently he gets to dictate when he's decided he's done talking about whether or not he's guilty.

For us normal people when the courts find us guilty that's just where it ends.
 
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JoeMorgue said:
Justice seems to get to "No we're done talking, the decision is final" point really goddamn quick for every low income black person serving a life sentence for selling the wrong plant too many times, but Trump launches a coup against our Country and apparently he gets to dictate when he's decided he's done talking about whether or not he's guilty.

For us normal people when the courts find us guilty that's just where it ends.
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Hell, we even get cases where the court openly says that actual innocence is no reason to overturn a guilty verdict and the sentence stands! In my state we had a guy who actually did get his verdict overturned and the court ordered him released from prison...and the state just didn't do it! They kept him in anyway!

Trump gets away with more crap than Michael Scott. Anybody else would have been fired in the first thirty seconds of episode 1.
 
Even before Trump this annoyed me.

During our interminable rash of "White cop gives black guy 353 warning shots in the back, pees on the corpses, sends the dry cleaning bill to the window" cases every time anyone suggested that "No the fact that that the black guy was in the same hemisphere at a marijuana plant for .03 seconds 9 years ago doesn't matter and they shouldn't be bringing it up in court" some insufferable smug ass would go "Oh but we have to let them do that or ELSE THEY WILL JUST APPEAL!"
 
Paul2 said:
He won't be able to pardon himself until Jan. 20. Sentencing is in November, so if there's jail time, he'd be in jail until Jan. 20.

Better than nothing.
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He can't pardon his felony conviction, it is not a federal case. The president can only pardon for federal crimes, this conviction is entirely in state court.
 
ponderingturtle said:
He can't pardon his felony conviction, it is not a federal case. The president can only pardon for federal crimes, this conviction is entirely in state court.
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Don't worry about that, the SC will rule that while a president can't pardon himself for a state conviction, a trumperor can, and that Trump is the trumperor. Is there anything in the Constitution that says the trumperor can't pardon himself? There's always an out for Trump, he is the special darling.
 
ponderingturtle said:
He can't pardon his felony conviction, it is not a federal case. The president can only pardon for federal crimes, this conviction is entirely in state court.
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Well that's my understanding based on various legal experts but then again there are many, many things which weren't possible and/or were illegal until he just up and did them. This could be another example - he pardons himself and SCOTUS backs him up.
 
ponderingturtle said:
He can't pardon his felony conviction, it is not a federal case. The president can only pardon for federal crimes, this conviction is entirely in state court.
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Until he can. I am sure his SC sponsorship deal would cover a "yes you can" decision. But of course only for Trump.
 
Interesting thing I was thinking about, I wonder how many of the GOP justices will try to hang on if Harris wins? Only 2 of them are relatively young (the drunk and handsmaid tales), but the rest are getting up there. Can Thomas or Alito make it another 4 years?

ETA: I lied, Gorsuch or whatever is younger than the beer chugger.
 
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plague311 said:
Interesting thing I was thinking about, I wonder how many of the GOP justices will try to hang on if Harris wins? Only 2 of them are relatively young (the drunk and handsmaid tales), but the rest are getting up there. Can Thomas or Alito make it another 4 years?

ETA: I lied, Gorsuch or whatever is younger than the beer chugger.
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There are enough GOP senators to prevent any Democratic Party nominees even being considered. :mad:
 
slyjoe said:
You don't need 2/3 of the Senate for SC justices. At least until they change the rules again.
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Simple majority when Republicans have the Senate majority.

Two-thirds when Democrats have the Senate majority.

:rolleyes:

It's rather like how Republicans refused Obama's SC pick a vote because he only had 11 months left in his administration, but Trump could push through a nominee within two months of the election.
 
Stacyhs said:
Simple majority when Republicans have the Senate majority.



Two-thirds when Democrats have the Senate majority.



:rolleyes:



It's rather like how Republicans refused Obama's SC pick a vote because he only had 11 months left in his administration, but Trump could push through a nominee within two months of the election.
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Trump could never be that organised. That was McConnell pulling the strings.
 
dirtywick said:
apnews.com

Prosecutors oppose tossing Trump’s hush money conviction but are open to sentencing delay

New York prosecutors oppose any effort to dismiss Trump’s hush money conviction, but say they are open to delaying sentencing until after his second term.
apnews.com apnews.com

delayed until never.

yeah, yeah, it's a state level crime and so on and so forth.
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Oh, Jesus H. Christ. I can understand delaying the implementation of the sentence, but at least sentence him! Let him know what he's facing as soon as he's out of office so he can stew for the next four years.
 
www.newsweek.com

Donald Trump faces new legal headache

An attorney is suing the FBI and DOJ to force the release of special counsel Jack Smith's reports into the president-elect.
www.newsweek.com www.newsweek.com

youtube law talking guy legal eagle is suing the fbi and doj for the release of special couseler jack smith's files in the investigation of donald trump, after they rejected his foia request.
 
Trump isn't happy


Merchan will have to watch his back!


Donald J. Trump
@realDonald Trump
BREAKING: In a completely illegal, psychotic order, the deeply conflicted, corrupt, biased, and incompetent Acting Justice Juan Merchan has completely disrespected the United States Supreme Court, and its Historic Decision on Immunity. But even without Immunity, this illegitimate case is nothing but a Rigged Hoax. Merchan, who is a radical partisan, wrote an opinion that is knowingly unlawful, goes against our Constitution, and, if allowed to stand, would be the end of the Presidency as we know it. Merchan has so little respect for the Constitution that he is keeping in place an illegal gag order on me, your President and President-Elect, just so I cannot expose his and his family's disqualifying and illegal conflicts....
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