Continuation Part Eight: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[CoulsdonUK]

Why?
What happened to Meredeth appears to be a random act of violence that can happen anywhere.
At the same time, what happened with Amanda appears to be a malevolent face saving measure by the Italian authorities.

The focus would be different, although I am sure UK students are aware of the case being brutally murdered would be a natural concern for any student or parent.

 

[Samson]

The focus would be different, although I am sure UK students are aware of the case being brutally murdered would be a natural concern for any student or parent.

Jees Coulsdon, thank the good lord for the campfire. Here we all are, and we know Kercher is dead and Sollecito and Knox's lives are destroyed, but as Muldoon said to Lange... I love you.

 

[codyjuneau]

The focus would be different, although I am sure UK students are aware of the case being brutally murdered would be a natural concern for any student or parent.

.
Of course it would Coulsdon, and so would being charged with a murder that they did not commit while the prosecutor refers to the local burglar who obviously committed the murder as 'poor Rudy'.

BTW, Welshman, nice post. Keep them coming.
.

 

[Samson]

Interesting article. I guess if a similar poll was held in the UK universities students concern would be what happened to Meredith Kercher.

On reflection CoulsdonUK, Meredith was slaughtered by an Immigrant Ivorian Coaster. What would other UK prospective students read into the probability of this happening to them in a city of 160,000? From time to time people reflect that this is a critical thinker's forum.

 

[Diocletus]

Interesting article. I guess if a similar poll was held in the UK universities students concern would be what happened to Meredith Kercher.

This is a poll. They don't get to ask their own questions or state some other concern.

 

[Desert Fox]

The focus would be different, although I am sure UK students are aware of the case being brutally murdered would be a natural concern for any student or parent.

An important difference is that one can expect (not very commonly but it does happen) for such a thing to happen close to such such as at the University.
You do not expect, as a college student, for the authorities to convict you of murdering you roommate because they cannot own up to a mistake.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

<snip> What would other UK prospective students read into the probability of this happening to them in a city of 160,000?

Not sure what you mean?

From time to time people reflect that this is a critical thinker's forum, but seem to love all input. I was just banned from Calideeva's strange website for suggesting that "Coulsdonites" should study and discuss the evidence in this case. Will you CoulsdonUK? You have declared that you will only on your terms, which is totally acceptable.

My terms as you put are no different than anyone else who posts here, thank you for your acceptance. Coulsdonites; really? Do you believe the main topic of conversation in Seattle is this case or even in Amanda's neighbourhood or wherever Raffaele is living? I have referred to the PIP\PGP bubble outside of that life just goes on.

I have no desire to play the game of “gotcha” with regards the evidence and for me there isn’t anything new being discussed, it is essentially repetition. I am interested in what will be in the motivations, what will be in the defence teams appeals, will they focus on the evidence as many here discuss, could their appeal make any reference to Guede’s final motivations; can they even mount a defence based purely on evidence or do they have to address definitions or interpretation of Italian criminal codes used in the motivations.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

An important difference is that one can expect (not very commonly but it does happen) for such a thing to happen close to such such as at the University.

You do not expect, as a college student, for the authorities to convict you of murdering you roommate because they cannot own up to a mistake.

I merely stated that some university students in the UK might be understandably concerned with their safety given Meredith’s murder. You and others are entitled to believe as you wish, I don’t see this as some kind of contest. Indeed, when my daughter arranged her year abroad my concerns were about her being hurt or worse, it still is whenever any of my children travel.

 

[Dan O.]

I merely stated that some university students in the UK might be understandably concerned with their safety given Meredith’s murder. You and others are entitled to believe as you wish, I don’t see this as some kind of contest. Indeed, when my daughter arranged her year abroad my concerns were about her being hurt or worse, it still is whenever any of my children travel.

And rightly concerned they should be when traveling to a country that does little to control crime until it becomes violent.

 

[RoseMontague]

Google translation: Rudy Hermann Guede already sentenced to 20 years for the murder of Meredith Kercher occurred in Perugia , came a conviction for theft. This was decided by the Third Court of Appeal of Milan which found the defendant guilty of a couple of thefts October 27, 2007 in Milan. Accepting the request of the Attorney General Gianni Griguolo , the panel of judges has set sentencing for 1 year and 4 months.

The sentence for having fenced at a laptop and a cell phone stolen results in a lawyer's office in Perugia. The appellate courts of Milan have thus confirmed the decision of first instance . In Milan Guede was caught in an asylum on October 27, 2007 that before the murder of British student . In the backpack he was carrying agents found the PC and mobile phone.

" Guede , who was not at the hearing today , has always claimed to have bought them at a flea market ," said Ansa his lawyer , the lawyer Nicodemo Gentile . "Our assisted - added the lawyer - has never been accused of the theft of the two objects . It is unwise to more than one purchase. Will appeal to the Supreme Court against the conviction . " For the lawyer the judgment Dear Milan will not stretch , however, the period within which Guede , held in Viterbo , request permission to leave early from prison. Possibility provided for the Ivorian in the coming months.

Just amazing that there were three trials on this before we even knew about it. It makes me wonder why the defense teams never mentioned it. Did Amanda or Raffaele know about it?

 

[RoseMontague]

I merely stated that some university students in the UK might be understandably concerned with their safety given Meredith’s murder. You and others are entitled to believe as you wish, I don’t see this as some kind of contest. Indeed, when my daughter arranged her year abroad my concerns were about her being hurt or worse, it still is whenever any of my children travel.

I would be concerned about both and cover some of the common sense type things. Travel and go out in groups, not alone. If you are questioned by cops don't try to answer, get a lawyer. Yeah, the basic stuff.

 

[Diocletus]

Just amazing that there were three trials on this before we even knew about it. It makes me wonder why the defense teams never mentioned it. Did Amanda or Raffaele know about it?

Rudy's appeal is definitely a good idea, though. I'm pretty sure that the ISC will end up convicting Flea Market Guy and Rudy will have no more worries.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

that is what they are paid to do

I would be concerned about both and cover some of the common sense type things. Travel and go out in groups, not alone. If you are questioned by cops don't try to answer, get a lawyer. Yeah, the basic stuff.

Every time a student comes to me and says that he or she is studying abroad the following semester, I reply that if something bad happens, not to talk to police without a lawyer.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

Every time a student comes to me and says that he or she is studying abroad the following semester, I reply that if something bad happens, not to talk to police without a lawyer.

Sound sensible advice, unless of course they are the murder victim.

 

[Desert Fox]

I would be concerned about both and cover some of the common sense type things. Travel and go out in groups, not alone. If you are questioned by cops don't try to answer, get a lawyer. Yeah, the basic stuff.

I think one should teach that as a rule even at home.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Professor Budowle on the negative TMB test and the knife

In a letter requested by the defense Professor Bruce Budowle wrote, "The knife was collected only 12 days after the crime was committed and given the sensitivity of detection of TMB and the stability of hemoglobin in blood, it is peculiar and difficult to reconcile that the TMB was negative. The amount of blood that would have been present if the DNA was from blood should have been sufficient to yield a positive result. This raises some concerns that should have been considered. There are very plausible alternate explanations for the presence of DNA consistent with that of Kercher (the victim). I understand that it was suggested that the knife may have been washed and that is why the presumptive test was negative. However, it would seem extremely unlikely to have been able to wash away all traces of hemoglobin and preferentially left behind solely DNA...Because of this issue of routine handling of items and deposition of DNA a more prudent practice would have been to test several knives in the drawer where item 28669-01-036 was found. In essence a background DNA investigation should have occurred." (highlighting mine) Professor Budowle was previously the director of the research lab at the FBI.

 

[Desert Fox]

Sound sensible advice, unless of course they are the murder victim.

Some things you can kind of protect against while others you cannot

 

[anglolawyer]

In a letter requested by the defense Professor Bruce Budowle wrote, "The knife was collected only 12 days after the crime was committed and given the sensitivity of detection of TMB and the stability of hemoglobin in blood, it is peculiar and difficult to reconcile that the TMB was negative. The amount of blood that would have been present if the DNA was from blood should have been sufficient to yield a positive result. This raises some concerns that should have been considered. There are very plausible alternate explanations for the presence of DNA consistent with that of Kercher (the victim). I understand that it was suggested that the knife may have been washed and that is why the presumptive test was negative. However, it would seem extremely unlikely to have been able to wash away all traces of hemoglobin and preferentially left behind solely DNA...Because of this issue of routine handling of items and deposition of DNA a more prudent practice would have been to test several knives in the drawer where item 28669-01-036 was found. In essence a background DNA investigation should have occurred." (highlighting mine) Professor Budowle was previously the director of the research lab at the FBI.

This is a thoughtless and inconsiderate post, Chris, as it will force the mentally challenged guilters to dust off their well-thumbed manual of internet ad hominem and abuse once more to nail the canard that anyone saying anything remotely pro-innocence from a position of authority could be other than nuts/in the pay of Marriott/wanting to have sex with Foxy Knoxy/in breach of his employment contract/too frightening to contemplate etc etc.

 

[Bill Williams]

The one difference between this piece and the latest from Harry Rag, is that it is in principle possible to find out who Michael Mills is. Mills' thesis is, in principle, unknowable, but it is explanatory as to why (as he points out) Italy has not gone after Amanda Knox (and probably won't) and has only confiscated Sollecito's passport, not detained him precauntionarily.

BTW - has anyone found Edward McCall's bona fides yet? Andrea Vogt and Machiavelli sing off of his song sheet.

http://www.allthingscrimeblog.com/2014/04/11/how-politics-knock-on-amanda-knox/

It may well be that anti-Berlusconi elements within the Italian judicial system saw the decision of the Hellmann court acquitting Raffaele Sollecito as a political victory for the Berlusconi supporters who had backed the appeal, and therefore as a political defeat for themselves. That might explain why the Court of Cassation so readily and completely accepted the appeal by Mignini and the Perugia judicial establishment against the judgment of the Hellmann court, even though that appeal was based solely on the same evidence that had been comprehensively discredited by Hellmann.

It seems this case has long since not been about the evidence, and really hasn't been about Knox and/or Sollecito other than which side the Sollecito's writ large are on in the larger internal political struggle in Italy.

It's clear which side Machiavelli is on, when he posts here.

One thing is sure, CoulsdonUK will be critical of the Italian Supreme Court, because Meredith's memory is way, way, way down the list of things which are important to them.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

The one difference between this piece and the latest from Harry Rag, is that it is in principle possible to find out who Michael Mills is. Mills' thesis is, in principle, unknowable, but it is explanatory as to why (as he points out) Italy has not gone after Amanda Knox (and probably won't) and has only confiscated Sollecito's passport, not detained him precauntionarily.

BTW - has anyone found Edward McCall's bona fides yet? Andrea Vogt and Machiavelli sing off of his song sheet.

http://www.allthingscrimeblog.com/2014/04/11/how-politics-knock-on-amanda-knox/



It seems this case has long since not been about the evidence, and really hasn't been about Knox and/or Sollecito other than which side the Sollecito's writ large are on in the larger internal political struggle in Italy.

It's clear which side Machiavelli is on, when he posts here.

One thing is sure, CoulsdonUK will be critical of the Italian Supreme Court, because Meredith's memory is way, way, way down the list of things which are important to them.

Bill

For me your post demonstrates my point about the PIP\PGP reality bubble, most people don’t know or really care about the likes of Edward McCall, Harry Rag, Andrea Vogt or Machiavelli.

The extraordinary rendition case involving CIA agents had geopolitical implications and we know via wikileaks that American government officials requested their Italian government counterparts to try and stop the case; the Italian judiciary ignored the request and the case went ahead with the trial.

This is a murder case involving two Italians and an American with UK murder victim.