JFK Conspiracy Theories: It Never Ends II

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Regarding my references to Brading using an office in New Orleans that was next to the office of Carlos Marcello's attorney, I'm assuming everyone here knows who Marcello was and that you're aware of the evidence that has surfaced about Marcello's role in the JFK assassination.

We know from the 1985 FBI prison files that bugs placed in Marcello's cell recorded him saying in reference to JFK, "Yeah, I had the son of a bitch killed. I'm glad I did. I'm sorry I couldn't have done it myself!" The released FBI cell microphone transcripts also reveal that Marcello stated that that he used Jack Ruby to kill Oswald.

All of this information on Marcello is discussed in detail in Lamar Waldron's book Legacy of Secrecy: The Long Shadow of the JFK Assassination, published in 2009. (The trade paperback version has three new chapters, an expanded photo-document section, and updated text throughout.)

Of course, there was substantial evidence that tied Marcello to the JFK assassination before the 1985 FBI files were released, but those files make the case against Marcello even stronger.
 
bobtaftfan said:
Regarding my references to Brading using an office in New Orleans that was next to the office of Carlos Marcello's attorney, I'm assuming everyone here knows who Marcello was and that you're aware of the evidence that has surfaced about Marcello's role in the JFK assassination.

We know from the 1985 FBI prison files that bugs placed in Marcello's cell recorded him saying in reference to JFK, "Yeah, I had the son of a bitch killed. I'm glad I did. I'm sorry I couldn't have done it myself!" The released FBI cell microphone transcripts also reveal that Marcello stated that that he used Jack Ruby to kill Oswald.

All of this information on Marcello is discussed in detail in Lamar Waldron's book Legacy of Secrecy: The Long Shadow of the JFK Assassination, published in 2009. (The trade paperback version has three new chapters, an expanded photo-document section, and updated text throughout.)

Of course, there was substantial evidence that tied Marcello to the JFK assassination before the 1985 FBI files were released, but those files make the case against Marcello even stronger.
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I guess that answers the question about whether you would be honest enough to say whether you believe Brading shot JFK or not. I was going to go visit your website if you had been honest.
 
JayUtah said:
And I think that has mostly to do with the palatability of the "crazy guy shot the President" theory. We like to think the most powerful man in the world can't be brought down by a lone nut with a rifle. So instead we think there has to be something bigger and more sinister, and we confirmation-bias our way into... whatever.



You mean even a mole-hill of physical evidence, eyewitness testimony, documentary evidence, and forensic evidence that some other person killed Kennedy?
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You got it. And when all you have is (at best) a mole-hill, the only way to make it look like a mountain is to tear down the other guy's; this explains why so many CTists spend so much time and effort pecking away at the LHO mountain and so little building their own.

I'd like to know how Carlos Marcello managed to set Oswald up as the patsy by getting him the job at the School Book Depository. Evidently, it involved that well-known Mafia figure, Linnie Mae Randle, neighbor of Ruth Paine, sister of Wesley Frazier, and the one who suggested, at a neighborhood coffee-klatsch, that Lee might check there for work- from her WC testimony:

Mr. BALL. Was there some conversation at that time about her husband Lee Oswald?
Mrs. RANDLE. Well, they had--it was just general knowledge in the neighborhood that he didn't have a job and she was expecting a baby. Of course. I didn't know where he was or anything. And of course you know just being neighborly and everything, we felt sorry for Marina because her baby was due right away as we understood it, and he didn't have any work, so they said, so it was just--
Mr. BALL. Mrs. Paine told you that Lee didn't have any work?
Mrs. RANDLE. Well, I suppose. It was just in conversation.
Mr. BALL. Marina didn't take part in the conversation?
Mrs. RANDLE. No. She couldn't. So far as I know, she couldn't speak.
Mr. BALL. You and Mrs. Roberts and Mrs. Paine talked about it?
Mrs. RANDLE. Yes.
Mr. BALL. Was there anything said then about the Texas School Book Depository as a place he [Oswald] might get a job?
Mrs. RANDLE. Well, we didn't say that he might get a job, because I didn't know there was a job open. The reason that we were being helpful, Wesley had just looked for a job, and I had helped him to try to find one. We listed several places that he might go to look for work. When you live in a place you know some places that someone with, you know, not very much of an education can find work.
So, it was among one of the places that we mentioned. We mentioned several others, and Mrs. Paine said that well, he couldn't apply for any of the jobs that would require driving because he couldn't drive, and it was just in conversation that you might talk just any day and not think a thing on earth about it. In fact, I didn't even know that he had even tried any place that we mentioned.
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(Probably, though, the WC redacted the part where Mrs Randle said something like "of course, all this was on the orders of Mr Marcello.")

CTists apparently just cannot handle the idea that the assassination was, essentially, an accidental intersection of the trajectories of two lives- JFK's and LHO's; there just has to be some deeper meaning to it. Not to beat the CTist/creationist analogy drum too much, but the parallel here is striking.

ETA- just took a look at taftfan's website- there's a reason he reasons like a creationist.
 
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RoboTimbo said:
I guess that answers the question about whether you would be honest enough to say whether you believe Brading shot JFK or not. I was going to go visit your website if you had been honest.
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I meant to answer it when I first read it, but then got busy and forgot about it.

Do I believe Brading shot Kennedy? No, I suspect that he was functioning as a spotter or lookout and/or that he may have been set up to be a type of diversionary lead if things went wrong with the Oswald frame-up.
 
bobtaftfan said:
I meant to answer it when I first read it, but then got busy and forgot about it.

Do I believe Brading shot Kennedy? No, I suspect that he was functioning as a spotter or lookout and/or that he may have been set up to be a type of diversionary lead if things went wrong with the Oswald frame-up.
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Did Oswald need a spotter in the Dal-Tex building to point Kennedy out in the presidential limousine 60 yards away?
 
bobtaftfan said:
I meant to answer it when I first read it, but then got busy and forgot about it.

Do I believe Brading shot Kennedy? No, I suspect that he was functioning as a spotter or lookout and/or that he may have been set up to be a type of diversionary lead if things went wrong with the Oswald frame-up.
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You suspect Braden may have been an alternate patsy? Well, I suppose suspicions are all well and good when they're all you have, but you know what would be better? (Hint- starts with an "e" and ends with "vidence")

Just for fun, though...where do you "suspect" the actual shots came from?
 
JayUtah said:
When everybody's a suspect you need to invent roles for them.
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Yeah it is getting complicated, you wonder how many times they practice this so it could be done without any way to communicate during the event....
 
Hans said:
Yeah it is getting complicated, you wonder how many times they practice this so it could be done without any way to communicate during the event....
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That was my next question, how did Brading communicate with Oswald. By pointing his finger and mouthing the words, "That one's the President!"?
 
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bobtaftfan said:
We know from the 1985 FBI prison files that bugs placed in Marcello's cell recorded him saying in reference to JFK, "Yeah, I had the son of a bitch killed. I'm glad I did. I'm sorry I couldn't have done it myself!" The released FBI cell microphone transcripts also reveal that Marcello stated that that he used Jack Ruby to kill Oswald.
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OMG, you actually believe what one inmate brags to another in prison? That's priceless!
 
RoboTimbo said:
That was my next question, how did Brading communicate with Oswald. By pointing his finger and mouthing the words, "That ones the President!"?
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No, he probably had to yell really, really loud. The Dal-Tex building is north of the depository. Oswald set up his shot out of the east window, but the only view factor from that floor to the Dal-Tex building would have been out the north window -- behind Oswald's back in his sniper's nest.
 
turingtest said:
But it was in an official FBI memo! That's what makes it true
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Which, of course, is why the FBI filed additional charges against Marcello for ordering the hits on Kennedy and Oswald, and why Jack Ruby testified at Marcello's trial that Marcello ordered him to do it.

until it's a memo that says something CTists don't like it, when it becomes part of the cover-up.
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Gee, I wish I were a conspiracy theorist and could tell implicitly when the FBI was reporting something truthful and when they were laying a smokescreen to maintain the cover story.

Or maybe I could just, you know, interpret the FBI as a real law enforcement agency that dutifully reports things up the chain of command but, from long experience, is fairly good at distinguishing between actual evidence and jailbird bravado.

One of my good friends and workout buddies here is a sheriff's deputy. The stuff he overhears from the county jail is priceless. Every guy that's brought in on drug charges, for example, is quick to tell everyone on the cell block how he's the biggest drug dealer in the state.
 
JayUtah said:
Jack Ruby catered the whole assassination too. He brought Oswald a sub sandwich in a long brown paper bag.
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I think CTs underestimate just how difficult it is to coordinate the actions of people who cannot communicate.

Oh, and LHO went for the kasha and bling special
 
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bobtaftfan said:
We know from the 1985 FBI prison files that bugs placed in Marcello's cell recorded him saying in reference to JFK, "Yeah, I had the son of a bitch killed. I'm glad I did. I'm sorry I couldn't have done it myself!" The released FBI cell microphone transcripts also reveal that Marcello stated that that he used Jack Ruby to kill Oswald.
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So do you have anything other than this claim made by a criminal to impress other criminals?
 
JayUtah said:
I know right! Oswald distinctly asked for no tomatoes.
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Yeah it was a slow day at the job and LHO had brought his rifle, just to clean it, and then you get tomatoes! Well you then just have to shoot someone
 
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