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How To Use Bitcoin – The Most Important Creation In The History Of Man

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Tippit said:
Bitcoin isn't even close to completely worthless. I have a friend whose bitcoin stake is now worth ~30 million dollars, and it has a market cap exceeding 10 billion.
...
Half the world is living in abject poverty, the other half is subject to routine political, economic and social crises, and wealth condensation (the gap between rich and poor) is the greatest its ever been.
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So in the same post you're going to complain about how the current system has caused a massive gap between rich and poor, and tell us about your friend who, potentially just from leaving his PC running, has earned more in absolute terms than the average man will earn in 20 lifetimes, and a greater proportion of the global bitcoin wealth than Bill Gates has of US wealth.

And he's hanging onto them because he's not made enough yet?
 
remirol said:
Anyone purchasing Bitcoin right now without the intent of immediately getting out on short-term gains is an idiot, plain and simple. Even the ones who think they'll buy at $1000 and sell at $1100 are fools.
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You are batting zero with every single prediction you have made regarding bitcoin.

Anybody would do well to read what you have to say then do the exact opposite (ie buy all the bitcoins you can get your hands on and never sell any).
 
mhaze said:
According to you, then, internet purchasing and sales of goods does not exist.

.... wait, that's actually happening in pretty much every household....
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No, just not in bitcoin. Let me know when Amazon starts taking bitcoin. I looked on the list of places you can spend bitcoin and I never heard of any of them.

When bitcoin drops back down to $150 it will be you that looks pretty silly. I can't imagine why anyone would buy bitcoin since you can't spend it.

This chart is the perfect picture of an unsustainable bubble.
 

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psionl0 said:
You are batting zero with every single prediction you have made regarding bitcoin.

Anybody would do well to read what you have to say then do the exact opposite (ie buy all the bitcoins you can get your hands on and never sell any).
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I have to admit that I do understand how the recent price changes in Bitcoin have confounded and astonished the JREF community. I have a suggestion to solve this. You know, if it does not seem plausible then it likely isn't. After all, if it walks like a bitcoin and it talks like a bitcoin well, it couldn't possibly be a bitcoin. This confirms the theory that it didn't really happen. Conclusive proof follows.

There has been no Bitcoin price rise. Nobody in this thread suggested that btc should be seriously considered when it was $30. Nobody in this thread suggested that btc should be seriously considered when it was $100. And of course, therefore...QED...nobody could possibly be suggesting that btc should be seriously considered when it is $1200.

It is just exactly the same as the Apollo moon landing. There was no Apollo moon landing. It's just like the World Trade Towers. There were no airplanes fly into the World Trade Towers. It was a Bush cruise missile that hit the Pentagon, launched by Lock Ness monsters bred with Bigfoot, controlled and guided with Ouigi boards, and hidden in Texas bat caves until the time came.

This sort of logic is deliciously inbred on the JREF.

I hope you all feel better now. Would you like some warm milk and cookies before going to beddie-bye?
 
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mhaze said:
I have to admit that I do understand how the recent price changes in Bitcoin have confounded and astonished the JREF community. I have a suggestion to solve this. You know, if it does not seem plausible then it likely isn't. This confirms the theory that it didn't really happen. So you can rest assured there has been no Bitcoin price rise. It is just exactly the same as the Apollo moon landing. There was no Apollo moon landing, and there has been no Bitcoin price rise. And it's just like the World Trade Towers. There were no airplanes fly into the World Trade Towers, and there has been no Bitcoin price rise. This sort of logic is well understood on the JREF forum.

I hope you all feel better now. Would you like some warm milk and cookies before going to beddie-bye?
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I think what is amazing is why anyone would actually spend $1000 of money they actually had to work for to buy a bitcoin that they cannot spend. Any ideas? Do you even know who is buying those bitcoins that are being sold on MTGOX?

Bitcoin is basically a small cap stock. There are 12m bitcoin worth about $1000 each. So the total market cap of bitcoin is $12B, about what some companies are. The total volume of $ far outweighs this as does the total of gold and silver.

Again, who uses bitcoin for anything? Especially now. If it keeps rising, no one will spend it. What merchant can claim to use it? I sure wouldn't take it right now, the probability of it losing 50% in no time is just too great.
 
Why do Bitcoin enthusiasts think it's going to buck the trend of every other investment 'bubble'
Some early investors who cash out before the bust will be the only ones that make anything, just like every other time.

History is against them.
 
wrs said:
....
I looked on the list of places you can spend bitcoin and I never heard of any of them.

When bitcoin drops back down to $150 it will be you that looks pretty silly. I can't imagine why anyone would buy bitcoin since you can't spend it.....
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Man, that just proves it. You confess to ignorance of those places and that proves....wait....

wrs said:
....
Bitcoin is basically a small cap stock. There are 12m bitcoin worth about $1000 each. So the total market cap of bitcoin is $12B, about what some companies are. ....
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Ah, no. Recheck your premises and you will find the conclusion is wrong.

Large cap.

wrs said:
....Again, who uses bitcoin for anything?....
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Like, I bought a year subscription of Hulu + the other day for 10.96 USD equivalent in bitcoin. Delivered to computer in seconds, installed and running Hulu + two minutes later.

Nice!

PSION10: This thread is totally ROFL...

In fact we could sum the entire thread up as follows:
(((ABC? DEF? GHI? JKL?)^2)^MNO*PRST)
Where the three letter phrase is decoded by the first letter of each word:
Where They Frolicked.
And the four letter phrase is decoded by the first letter of each word:
Running On Final Length.

Seriously....Just don't get Zhou Tonged.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z9Jwp2x86o
 
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mhaze said:
I have to admit that I do understand how the recent price changes in Bitcoin have confounded and astonished the JREF community. I have a suggestion to solve this. You know, if it does not seem plausible then it likely isn't. After all, if it walks like a bitcoin and it talks like a bitcoin well, it couldn't possibly be a bitcoin. This confirms the theory that it didn't really happen. Conclusive proof follows.

There has been no Bitcoin price rise. Nobody in this thread suggested that btc should be seriously considered when it was $30. Nobody in this thread suggested that btc should be seriously considered when it was $100. And of course, therefore...QED...nobody could possibly be suggesting that btc should be seriously considered when it is $1200.

It is just exactly the same as the Apollo moon landing. There was no Apollo moon landing. It's just like the World Trade Towers. There were no airplanes fly into the World Trade Towers. It was a Bush cruise missile that hit the Pentagon, launched by Lock Ness monsters bred with Bigfoot, controlled and guided with Ouigi boards, and hidden in Texas bat caves until the time came.

This sort of logic is deliciously inbred on the JREF.

I hope you all feel better now. Would you like some warm milk and cookies before going to beddie-bye?
Click to expand...

When the inevitable crash comes, I will refer to this post.

Tulips, land in Florida, dot-com stocks... irrational exuberance gonna exuberant.
 
mhaze said:
Like, I bought a year subscription of Hulu + the other day for 10.96 USD equivalent in bitcoin. Delivered to computer in seconds, installed and running Hulu + two minutes later.
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This, like your claim of ordering pizza from Papa John's with Bitcoin, is an outright lie. You cannot purchase Hulu subscriptions with Bitcoin -- I am looking at their payment screen right now and the only payments listed are:

American Express
VISA
MasterCard
Discover
Chase "Freedom" card
Paypal

I strongly suspect you do not actually own any Bitcoin yourself, much like all the other proponents in this thread.
 
psionl0 said:
Every time you have made a statement like this the price of bitcoin has soared ever higher. What makes you think you will be right this time?
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If we had been talking about the price of real estate about 7 years ago you could have said the same thing, until the moment you couldn't.

You could have said the same about gold in 2011 and the trend since then has been steadily downward.

You could have said the same thing about beanie babies at one point too.

I'm not saying bitcoin is necessarily a bubble, but the fact that it's in general soaring higher and higher in it's fairly brief time of existence isn't a very good evidence against a bubble, it's entirely consistent with what bubbles look like.
 
remirol said:
This, like your claim of ordering pizza from Papa John's with Bitcoin, is an outright lie. You cannot purchase Hulu subscriptions with Bitcoin -- I am looking at their payment screen right now and the only payments listed are:
.....
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HAHHAHAHAHHA!

So last time you blurted out about pizza, you found you were wrong shortly after. No dif here, friend. Keep looking, you'll see lots of places you can buy hulu +. Then you'll realize you owe me an apology.

Let me know when you are man enough to admit that.

jhunter1163 said:
When the inevitable crash comes, I will refer to this post.

Tulips, land in Florida, dot-com stocks... irrational exuberance gonna exuberant.
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Since I only invest on fundamentals, short term swings do not concern me. Look over the history of the thread, you will see none of the people trying to explain bitcoin have been day traders or exhibit their mentality. It is the opposite - those who have been critical of bitcoin - that exhibit this mentality.

I am not really sure I have enough warm milk and cookies to go around...

Cheers!
 
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Cavemonster said:
If we had been talking about the price of real estate about 7 years ago you could have said the same thing, until the moment you couldn't.

You could have said the same about gold in 2011 and the trend since then has been steadily downward.

You could have said the same thing about beanie babies at one point too.

I'm not saying bitcoin is necessarily a bubble, but the fact that it's in general soaring higher and higher in it's fairly brief time of existence isn't a very good evidence against a bubble, it's entirely consistent with what bubbles look like.
Click to expand...
That's a more rational view than most I have seen on this thread. However, bitcoin is not like anything we have ever seen before and there is no precedent for seeing how it will fare long term. It might go into a prolonged slump or it may run into cycles of increasing then decreasing prices.

There is no justification for giving any time frame in which bitcoin might enter a decline. It is entirely possible that given current trends, the satoshi (10-8 BTC) might end up costing more than a dollar in a few years time. By that time, a lot of cyber-geeks and anarcho-libertarians will be richer than Bill Gates. Ignore that possibility at your peril.
 
psionl0 said:
That's a more rational view than most I have seen on this thread. However, bitcoin is not like anything we have ever seen before and there is no precedent for seeing how it will fare long term. It might go into a prolonged slump or it may run into cycles of increasing then decreasing prices.
Click to expand...

I think the biggest risk is that governments will crack down on it. And I think, given BTC's known use in illegal transactions, that such a crackdown is inevitable.
 
mhaze said:
And no, the shift to transaction fees does not totally suck. Those are very, very low fees.

Excuse me. I earlier made up a term, Uncoin, but erred in my spelling. I meant to write Unicoin, an abbreviation of Unicorn - coin.

Because your idea is in the fairy tale land of Unicorns. But keep it up,you may arrive at the Obamacare of electronic currencies.

:)
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So, bitcoin is useless for micro payments then, eh? Then what good is it? What's the use of that kind of limitation in the information age?
 
psionl0 said:
That's a more rational view than most I have seen on this thread. However, bitcoin is not like anything we have ever seen before and there is no precedent for seeing how it will fare long term. It might go into a prolonged slump or it may run into cycles of increasing then decreasing prices.
Click to expand...

Or it may crash quickly to the point of worthlessness.

Honestly what I haven't seen yet is a real demonstration of its value that matches the value it's gained through speculation. The rising price of bitcoin over its short life has nothing to do with whether it will last, whether its useful or whether large numbers of people want to hold bitcoins for any reason other than self perpetuating speculation. The performance of bitcoin so far, it's generally steep upward trend really doesn't tell us anything about what it will do in the long term.

At the very least, a few people are almost certainly going to get rich off this, although most likely not Bill Gates rich, but I could be wrong. I'm not really in any peril for ignoring it than I am for not being a major Apple investor 25 years ago. A stock can go up, it can go down, so can bitcoin, so can vegas winnings. I don't see any reason yet to think bitcoin will be more reliable than putting the money in stock over a long term. The fact that it's unprecedented is a risk rather than a feature.

It's possible that bitcoin will flourish and we'll be paying for everything in it within five years, and the early miners will walk as gods among men. It's also possible that lack of real things to do with bitcoins and novelty wearing off will resign it to the tinfoil hat and bunker set, or that an unexpected rise in computing power from a marvelous breakthrough will undermine the artificial scarcity, or that a competitor who uses similar structure but fixes some of the flaws will usurp the digital currency market.
 
Cavemonster said:
Honestly what I haven't seen yet is a real demonstration of its value that matches the value it's gained through speculation.
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Wait... what's that definition... it's coming to me...

"An economic bubble (sometimes referred to as a speculative bubble, a market bubble, a price bubble, a financial bubble, a speculative mania or a balloon) is "trade in high volumes at prices that are considerably at variance with intrinsic values. It could also be described as a situation in which asset prices appear to be based on implausible or inconsistent views about the future."

What's Bitcoin's intrinsic value again?

It's possible that bitcoin will flourish and we'll be paying for everything in it within five years, and the early miners will walk as gods among men. It's also possible that lack of real things to do with bitcoins and novelty wearing off will resign it to the tinfoil hat and bunker set, or that an unexpected rise in computing power from a marvelous breakthrough will undermine the artificial scarcity, or that a competitor who uses similar structure but fixes some of the flaws will usurp the digital currency market.
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This. There are a few ways this can happen, but the most obvious of which would be for the existing banks/gubmint to co-opt Bitcoin's technical positives and innovations and simply fix its value to the USD; say, one Buckcoin == one hundred USD. Once it is chained to something that is a reliable store of value, it becomes no different than a credit card # is today -- except it's probably a lot harder to steal.
 
Tyke said:
So in the same post you're going to complain about how the current system has caused a massive gap between rich and poor, and tell us about your friend who, potentially just from leaving his PC running, has earned more in absolute terms than the average man will earn in 20 lifetimes, and a greater proportion of the global bitcoin wealth than Bill Gates has of US wealth.

And he's hanging onto them because he's not made enough yet?
Click to expand...

To my knowledge, he hasn't mined a single bitcoin. He started doing some transactions on silk road when it was around $4, and then invested $350k+ when it was around $10-11, which was about 30% of his net worth at the time. We still debate the merits of bitcoin vs. gold all the time. I haven't made a single dime on bitcoin, and he even sent me 5 bitcoin as a lure to get me interested, which I failed to redeem, which are now worth over $5,000 (he since reclaimed them). So I am more than a little envious of him, but at the same time I recognize that he was right, and I was wrong, and I am very happy for him. He took an enormous risk based on his knowledge of the monetary and banking system (for which he credits me). He isn't connected to the Wall Street free-money-for-insiders machine, so he had everything to lose with this, and now he has come out smelling like roses.

I'm not surprised people like you can't distinguish between healthy and unhealthy speculation, and between the unlimited, unmerited theft that counts for Wall Street/bank profits from the Federal Reserve counterfeiting scam, and people risking their hard-earned savings and real wealth on a potential investment opportunity of a lifetime. He is also working directly in the field as a brilliant software engineer, although I'm not going to mention specifics about where he works or what he does. Watching all the haters, and the pseudo-skeptics whine about the rise of bitcoin is pretty entertaining to me, I have to admit, but it's somewhat bittersweet considering the realization that I probably could have and should have been one of the bitcoin millionaires.

As it is I will have to settle for the enormous profits I've made in precious metals.
 
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