Continuation Part Six: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[MDDVS]

raffe's dna on the bra, worse place possible

victim's dna on tip of knife found in raffe's house, worse place possible

Knox's dna on knife with Meredith's dna found in raffe's house, worse place possible.

All resulting from contamination. some pretty rotten luck for our two brave heroes

I think we have to argue the cops planted the dna at this point, b/c random contamination can't explain all 3

"too low"

It's not like the idea of police corruption in Italy is a radical idea. But not really needed in this case to explain the contamination events. Police incompentence is enough. Just look at the picture of Stefanoni holding the bra clasp with dirty gloves.

 

[LondonJohn]

raffe's dna on the bra, worse place possible

victim's dna on tip of knife found in raffe's house, worse place possible

Knox's dna on knife with Meredith's dna found in raffe's house, worse place possible.

All resulting from contamination. some pretty rotten luck for our two brave heroes

I think we have to argue the cops planted the dna at this point, b/c random contamination can't explain all 3

Ummmm...... nobody's arguing contamination for Knox's DNA on Sollecito's kitchen knife.

As for the other two, perhaps you should have a word with not-a-real-doctor Stefanoni regarding her flagrant breaches of pretty much every single protocol pertaining to the collection, handling, storage, testing and interpretation of forensic evidence - particularly in relation to low-template DNA samples.

While you're asking her that, maybe you could also ask her why she stored the bra clasp in liquid buffer solution in a plastic vial, thereby ensuring that it rusted and rotted; oh, and why she stored the bloody towels found around Meredith's body in a heap, thereby ensuring that they rotted and moulded.

As you might say: LOL.

 

[Rolfe]

Have you even experienced sex? Somehow, I think not.

Hmmm, about that vibrator. Geoffrey seems to think it indicates that Knox was/is some sort of raving nymphomaniac. Maybe he doesn't realise that one of the commonest reasons for getting one of these is the absence of a consensual sex life.

Not that I'm suggesting that Amanda was a frustrated virgin, just pointing out the non-sequitur nature of yet another of his assumptions.

Rolfe.

 

[acbytesla]

i don't have to prove she is a sex addict. It is just part of my motive theory. I think I have a good read on Miss Knox. I am bit of a psychiatrist in my spare time. I am familiar with the medical literature.

I think people who look for sex but not relationships are sex addicts and/or have some mental problems. Sex should be a feature of a healthy relationship , not an end to itself. I feel like Dr. Phil. lol

Ok, there is no way raffe's dna got on that bra clasp without him touching it at some point. nobody is that unlucky, as you must believe, if you cry contamination

You apparently don't have to prove anything. You just run your mouth.

You have never spoken to Amanda, you have never spoken to anyone who knows Amanda, you have done nothing but read crap on the internet. This makes you qualified to determine that Amanda is a sex addict?

You're a bit of psychiatrist? That must make you a bit of Doctor. Which medical school did you attend? What hospital did you do your residency? Do you always make a diagnosis base on tabloid fodder without actually meeting the patient?

Please enlighten us. Tell us the articles in the New England Journal of Medicine or from the American Psychiatric Association that shows how Amanda is a sex addict.

Or are you just a moron who dropped out of high school?

 

[Poppy1016]

Hmmm, about that vibrator. Geoffrey seems to think it indicates that Knox was/is some sort of raving nymphomaniac. Maybe he doesn't realise that one of the commonest reasons for getting one of these is the absence of a consensual sex life.

Not that I'm suggesting that Amanda was a frustrated virgin, just pointing out the non-sequitur nature of yet another of his assumptions.

Rolfe.

Wasn't this vibrator actually a miniature gag gift ?

 

[Bill Williams]

Emerging from my exile - responding to someone who's made 190 posts in two days... I thought I was bad! Whoever this person is, he/she does not understand at all what is wrong with this case. Fortunately the Nencini court is getting the idea as to what is wrong.

raffe's dna on the bra, worse place possible

Technician Stefanoni at trial could not rule out that she'd touched the bra-hook in question with an obviously contaminated glove.

victim's dna on tip of knife found in raffe's house, worse place possible

The Ris Carabinieri folk, appointed by the Nencini court, will be reporting (I think) in two days that there is no indication of Meredith at all on the knife. There is no reason to think that knife ever left Raffaele's apartment. Oh yes, Stefanoni claims she found the Meredith sample in a grove on the knife, not the tip, a groove that no one now can find.

Knox's dna on knife with Meredith's dna found in raffe's house, worse place possible.

Knox's DNA on a knife she cooked with at Raffaele's is hardly suspicious, exp. now that it is ruled out as the murder weapon (anticipating the Nencini court).

All resulting from contamination. some pretty rotten luck for our two brave heroes

Well, the "Meredith DNA" would have only been suspicious if it had been proven to be Blood related. Stefanoni could only do one test, the sample was so small, so elected to do the test that id'ed the owner, rather than a separate test that id'ed its composition. It was perhaps the only sound choice she made - but now, it seems, even the Carabinieri, appointed by Nencini's court, are challenging that. So the "Meredith DNA" was more than likely "misidentification" by Stefanoni, rather than contamination. It now leaves a rather large question as to why Stefanoni would report the way she did, all the while not releasing the EDF's which show the raw data.

Some pretty rotten luck for Stefanoni that the prosecutors took that knife to trial as the now debunked murder weapon.

I think we have to argue the cops planted the dna at this point, b/c random contamination can't explain all 3

But alas misidentification can.

Back to my regularly scheduled ignore list. Go ahead, mock me for a moment of weakness.....

 

[Poppy1016]

lol

well i don't think any of you guys are qualified to say Stef wasn't qualified and didn't follow proper protocol. the defense was forced to argue that given the DNA is where it is and it isn't probable that the defense is right about that. it is your typical desperate defense that all guilty people have to try.

Dr. Stef = intelligent, competent, beautiful woman

Geoff= ????

 

[MDDVS]

lol

well i don't think any of you guys are qualified to say Stef wasn't qualified and didn't follow proper protocol. the defense was forced to argue that given the DNA is where it is and it isn't probable that the defense is right about that. it is your typical desperate defense that all guilty people have to try.

Dr. Stef = intelligent, competent, beautiful woman

"too low"

 

[snook1]

"Lol" seems to be the quite popular lately in this thread.

Can we please move on from Goeffrey?

 

[Poppy1016]

"Lol" seems to be the quite popular lately in this thread.

Can we please move on from Goeffrey?

Yes please

 

[MDDVS]

This is a falsity. They would just be proving there is no indication of Meredith in that specific sample they looked at, which was closer to the handle of the knife.

The other trace of Meredith still stands.

Apologize, kind sir.

There was never atrace of Meredith on that blade.

"too low"

 

[acbytesla]

you don't have to prove motive.

I am not the prosecuter on this case. I can see why you get confused because I am so eloquent it seems like I should be one. lol

I was just giving my personal theory about the motive of Miss Knox. So what if it is "tabloid" fodder? Why is this is so serious for you.

No, it helps if you can prove anything. So far, you said, that Amanda flew off in a rage. Then you said that Amanda is a sex addict. You said that a judge in Seattle warned Amanda when she in fact never appeared in court. You've been very good at lying.

Now, back to lying ...Where did you go to university or medical school? I thought you said you were a psychiatrist? You do know that psychiatrists are actual medical doctors?

 

[Bill Williams]

"Lol" seems to be the quite popular lately in this thread.

Can we please move on from Goeffrey?

Yes please

I'm trying, believe me, I'm trying. But people keep quoting him.... in the meantime, just to get myself out of this situation, I may have to temporarily ignore everyone who replies.... it's nothing personal....

 

[theaudioengine]

ok, I am ok with letting the lurkers in the audience decide that point. we just kept repeating our previous points and I wanted to end the cycle.

Hi - lurker here. You got your ass kicked, Goeffrey.

 

[snook1]

I'm trying, believe me, I'm trying. But people keep quoting him.... in the meantime, just to get myself out of this situation, I may have to temporarily ignore everyone who replies.... it's nothing personal....

 

[Poppy1016]

This is a falsity. They would just be proving there is no indication of Meredith in that specific sample they looked at, which was closer to the handle of the knife.

The other trace of Meredith still stands.

Apologize, kind sir.

Isn't it a phenomenal coincidence that that knife, selected randomly, miraculously had MK DNA on it. Why were no other knives tested, from RS kitchen or the kitchen at the cottage? Pure psychic abilities, I suppose.

 

[MDDVS]

Even if the DNA was actually there, which it wasn't, that would still be irrelevant because that knife is not the murder weapon.

 

[Supernaut]

i think this forum would at least be 50-50 but most people in America don't care about this case.

If she had done this in America and accused a innocent black man of murder and then ANOTHER black man ends up in jail but she and the other rich white person are still free, I think everybody would think she is guilty. lol

most Americans don't know about this aspect of it.

"Goeff", that's truly special! lol.

 

[Rolfe]

Wasn't this vibrator actually a miniature gag gift ?

Yes, I think so. A key-ring fob or something, I heard. I doubt if it even vibrated - a miniature novelty dildo, I think.

I wouldn't have one on my own keyring I have to say, but it's hardly something a sexually adventurous girl like Meredith would have been likely to find offensive or annoying.

Rolfe.

 

[Planigale]

Thank you for your contributions, I've found them of great interest. I do have a question for you: what specifically do you suppose might be Stefanoni's reason for refusing to turn over the electronic data files?



Perhaps having 'faith' (or more accurately hope!) in the power of human reason means guys like me resemble little gerbils running around the wheel in my cage to the amusement of others, but some of us can't resist the impulse to try to see if their dis/misinformation is corrected if they might even change their minds.

Laboratories tend to be quite introspective. Their nature is that they accumulate 'occult' knowledge, they have their own ways of doing things. This can be good, but also bad. For research labs, your rivals will validate your research by replicating your results, but for commercial / service labs this does not happen. I imagine that being a state lab there were financial pressures, one would try to be economical with reagents, cut corners. A phrase I learned recently is 'normalisation of deviancy'. Ideally the lab is part of some form of external quality review process. External experts come into your lab, review your SOP, protocols, check your maintenance logs look at your QC. This stops the drift into bad habits, idiosyncratic practice.

I suspect that corners were cut, why do controls every run, just do them at the beginning of the day. If you are careful to avoid contamination, they are not really necessary. This is all fine until someone asks to see them. I think Steph was well intentioned, but things had slipped. She pulled out all stops to get the results to get the evidence needed for a conviction. Now they have a mess. If they admit they have cut corners and results are not certain in this case, lawyers may start questioning other results for other cases.