Continuation Part 5: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[codyjuneau]

.
Ergon is a nut case.

Sue me!
.

 

[Bruce Fischer]

Whats this translation of the SC idiocy Monday? We have had it translated for weeks if not months. Or is it that the PGP version will be translated Monday?
LOL

Ergon who is a member here has his own web site. On it he claims to be the Messiah...Jesus and God. He tells stories about killing people with his mind and having the ability to control the weather.

Ergon also claims to have been in contact with Mignini... who in no way qualifies as or should be referred to as a Doctor, as in Dr Mignini...that is a lie. Italy may wish to call pigs as saints...but that wish cant change the status of the pig.

The fact that Mignini and Ergon have a relationship says more than enough. As confirmation Mignini also had a relationship with a nutty spiritualist who channeled a dead priest...her name was Carlizzi.

This topic of RS calls to police is old old old...what is news about this? I have heard these recordings at least 4 years ago. RS phones police...and gives random minor details. Nothing suspicious or nefarious about them...especially if you claim to be God!

Ergon whos real name is known is also an astrologist...which seems an odd interest for God to be involved with...or is that just me?

Look this is turning into too much of a freak show to waste any more honest topic time on. Briars is free to believe in and honor any God she wishes...I happen to find it disturbing to do so in this thread if she wishes to do that in a serious manor. I happen to think someone claiming to be Jesus is nuts! And if it is true that this "God" and the prosecutor share case details then that should be investigated because it is improper, corrupt, and crazy...but then again it fits into the legal case that Mignini has made so far...so maybe that is the way Italy does things...

I hope that Ergon comes here and explains his reasoning for claiming to be God. I suggest he do so on his own thread though...which should be obvious.
A link has been provided that leads to Ergons site...his name is Nasser something or another...if you have a child suffering from Autism I hear he has a cure...10 or 20 thousand IIRC. wwooooooooooo........

As it turns out, we agree completely on this topic. In fact, I figure that we agree on most topics. We should probably agree to disagree on the few we can't seem to meet in the middle on and realize we have been on the same side all along.

 

[codyjuneau]

.
Anybody know when the police realized they had a knife imprint on the bed sheet? Was it before or after the ERGONomic cop divined the knife at Raf's?
.

 

[JREF2010]

.
Anybody know when the police realized they had a knife imprint on the bed sheet? Was it before or after the ERGONomic cop divined the knife at Raf's?
.

I would hope the answer is Nov2-3.... but in this case, its amazing they didn't destroy that too.

 

[RoseMontague]

Both sites are eager for the translation of the SC Monday. I believe that is the work of .org. Hard to imagine people unlikely to ever meet to welcome news from either site is it? Entertain yourself nonsense along with Bill.

I for one am looking forward to it and I will place it in context with Luca's analysis here...

http://wrongfulconvictionnews.com/c...aggregation&fb_aggregation_id=288381481237582

There are a lot of things that are deserving of attention in this article but here is one quote from the ruling I found particularly interesting.

...an alternative reconstructive hypothesis on the basis of the fact that since the victim did not repeat the call home after 8:56 pm, it would be necessary to suppose the intervention of a ominous event: the first missing answer by her relatives could have induced the young girl to remember some evening engagement of theirs which could stretch till late and hence it is totally reasonable to think that the young Englishwoman gave up, for reasons not necessarily connected with the fate she shortly after met.

What we have here is the ISC coming up with an alternative hypothesis dealing with Meredith's phone records and TOD. Employing a "could have" worthy of Massei with no basis in fact or testimony, something the ISC is not supposed to do. Instead they dismiss the theory that she was killed shortly after she arrived home, they dismiss Guede's indications of TOD, they dismiss the later phone evidence as well in favor of the Miracle Ear lady and the other lady that heard two people arguing in Italian. Go figure.

 

[Mary_H]

<snip>What we have here is the ISC coming up with an alternative hypothesis dealing with Meredith's phone records and TOD. Employing a "could have" worthy of Massei with no basis in fact or testimony, something the ISC is not supposed to do. Instead they dismiss the theory that she was killed shortly after she arrived home, they dismiss Guede's indications of TOD, they dismiss the later phone evidence as well in favor of the Miracle Ear lady and the other lady that heard two people arguing in Italian. Go figure.

Like most children, the judges are highly suggestible. Here is Massei:

Nothing compels [us], among the circumstantial evidence available, to consider that the assault took place in the minutes between 21.58 and 22.00 of 1.11, and not rather merely moments of relaxation during which Meredith Kercher, still alone in the house and probably just lying on her own bed, was absent-mindedly playing with the mobile phone in her hand. (p.333)

Now where would he get an idea like that?

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/Meredithphone.jpg

 

[RoseMontague]

What reporting? That he emailed with Mignini or that he knew him in a previous life? The 112 recording isn't new.

I think people that think they are god or the messiah et al. are mentally disturbed and their "reporting" can rightfully be questioned as they clearly have issues with reality.

If Mignini is feeding such a person with official evidence that hasn't been made public that brings question to his judgment and character.

Btw, I also believe that Frank has diminished his standing as a reliable reporter.

I agree with you on both Ergon and Frank. I have seen people focus on the fact that Ergon exchanged e-mails with Migi rather than the content of the e-mail quoted by Ergon. For those who lost it in the trees, here it is....

Posso confermare che il 6 novembre prossimo si terrà a Firenze l’udienza preliminare contro Francesco Sforza (alias Frank Sfarzo), imputato del delitto di diffamazione aggravata a mezzo stampa (art. 595 c.p. e legge n. 47/1948), in mio danno. Il Pubblico Ministero che ha chiesto il rinvio a giudizio dello Sforza è il Procuratore Aggiunto Dr. Pappalardo. Il GUP (Giudice dell’udienza preliminare) mi pare che si chiami D.ssa Limongi. Io potrò costituirmi parte civile e chiedere il risarcimento a Sforza. Il mio avvocato, come persona offesa, è l’Avv. Marco Rocchi, del Foro di Firenze.
Cordiali saluti.
G. Mignini



Roughly translated:

"I can confirm that on November 6, Florence will be a preliminary hearing against Francesco Sforza (aka Frank Sfarzo), who is accused of the crime of aggravated defamation in the press (art. 595 Criminal Code and Law no. 47/1948), to my detriment . The prosecutor who asked for the indictment against Sforza is the deputy prosecutor Dr. Pappalardo. The GUP (preliminary hearing judge), I think his name is Dr. Limongi. I may costituirmi plaintiff and seek compensation from Sforza. My lawyer, for the injured party, is Marco Rocchi, of the Court of Florence.
Sincerely.
G. Mignini"

This is interesting. First, Frank is given the status as being a member of the press (as that is what he is being charged with), and second, Mignini is the injured party here showing his involvement in the prosecution. IIRC, the thing that got Frank in trouble was saying something about how Mignini relies on the testimony of drug dealers. Curatolo comes to mind immediately. This tells me how restricted the press is in Italy, being subject to a lawsuit every time a criticism of a judge is made. I would hope other members of the press are watching the outcome of this carefully.

 

[Mary_H]

<snip>This is interesting. First, Frank is given the status as being a member of the press (as that is what he is being charged with), and second, Mignini is the injured party here showing his involvement in the prosecution. IIRC, the thing that got Frank in trouble was saying something about how Mignini relies on the testimony of drug dealers. Curatolo comes to mind immediately. This tells me how restricted the press is in Italy, being subject to a lawsuit every time a criticism of a judge is made. I would hope other members of the press are watching the outcome of this carefully.

As I understand it, this quote from Perugia Shock appears in the complaint:

Mignini and his loyalest are by now barricaded in the bunker, whose walls are Nazione dell’Umbria, Giornale dell’Umbria, Corriere dell’Umbria… anything dell’Umbria… (Even cops dell’Umbria, tramps dell’Umbria, pushers dell’Umbria…)."

And Mignini claims that, by writing this, Frank compared Mignini himself to tramps and pushers. Mignini also names these "persons informed of the facts" as his supporters in the lawsuit: Monica Napoleoni, Francesco Maresca, Francesca Bene (Giornale dell'Umbria) and Erica Pontini (Nazione dell'Umbria).

It doesn't strike me as a positive thing for Frank, to have these other journalists on Mignini's side. They may claim not to be of the opinion that the press is restricted.

 

[RoseMontague]

As I understand it, this quote from Perugia Shock appears in the complaint:

Mignini and his loyalest are by now barricaded in the bunker, whose walls are Nazione dell’Umbria, Giornale dell’Umbria, Corriere dell’Umbria… anything dell’Umbria… (Even cops dell’Umbria, tramps dell’Umbria, pushers dell’Umbria…)."

And Mignini claims that, by writing this, Frank compared Mignini himself to tramps and pushers. Mignini also names these "persons informed of the facts" as his supporters in the lawsuit: Monica Napoleoni, Francesco Maresca, Francesca Bene (Giornale dell'Umbria) and Erica Pontini (Nazione dell'Umbria).

It doesn't strike me as a positive thing for Frank, to have these other journalists on Mignini's side. They may claim not to be of the opinion that the press is restricted.

Thanks, Mary_H. I had not seen the full quote. Very interesting. The press in the Kercher case certainly helped deliver super witnesses into Migi's hands almost as if they were working as a team.

 

[Bill Williams]

Thanks, Mary_H. I had not seen the full quote. Very interesting. The press in the Kercher case certainly helped deliver super witnesses into Migi's hands almost as if they were working as a team.

There's a film coming out based on Barbie Nadeau's book. It will not be about "the case" really, apparently they're not casting people to even play Amanda Knox or Raffaele Sollecito.

Supposedly it's about the life of a journalist trying to cover this... I wonder if they'll include the way the prosecution tried to reel in journalists - rewarding cooperative ones, and starving out critical ones?

 

[Grinder]

Now where would he get an idea like that? (Meredith playing with phones)

http://www.injusticeinperugia.org/Meredithphone.jpg

Well, I'm sure they produced a history of similar action on her phone after arriving in Perugia. I sympathize with the difficulty of writing a motivations report in a case like this and have more tolerance than others for could haves and probables; however, on this specific issue, without a history of similar behavior, this is just plain dumb.

I agree with you on both Ergon and Frank. I have seen people focus on the fact that Ergon exchanged e-mails with Migi rather than the content of the e-mail quoted by Ergon. For those who lost it in the trees, here it is....


This is interesting. First, Frank is given the status as being a member of the press (as that is what he is being charged with), and second, Mignini is the injured party here showing his involvement in the prosecution. IIRC, the thing that got Frank in trouble was saying something about how Mignini relies on the testimony of drug dealers. Curatolo comes to mind immediately. This tells me how restricted the press is in Italy, being subject to a lawsuit every time a criticism of a judge is made. I would hope other members of the press are watching the outcome of this carefully.

I'm sure there an EnglishLawyer that coiuld explain more fully but it appears this is both a civil and a criminal case. IIRC when one defames officialdom in Italy it is a crime against the state.

Some please save me time and give me the link to all the various charges in this case. Is there a list of threatened charges?

 

[Grinder]

.
Ergon is a nut case.

Sue me!
.

Thank you! The conversation about him isn't about religion it's about either a mental issue or a con man. In either case I wouldn't trust his "reporting" or even how he portrayed himself to Mignini or others. When he produces a recording we have had the content of for years and claims it is a breakthrough, I move to con man as my opinion.

I'm one that agrees with Marx on religion "Opiate massarum" or more likely "Opium für die Massen"

Dan O brought up an interesting point (yes we are paying attention) about his first call to a policeman, his sister, that she might have said call 112 and not to touch anything. While calling 112 that might have been why Raf asked what she was doing as he now was sensitive to touching things.

IIRC there was an explanation as to why the first call ended and why he called back. Does someone have that readily available? It is not an area I focused on because I never thought it was at key to solving the case.

 

[Grinder]

Thanks, Mary_H. I had not seen the full quote. Very interesting. The press in the Kercher case certainly helped deliver super witnesses into Migi's hands almost as if they were working as a team.

IIRC correctly it was one young cub reporter responsible for most all of the witnesses. I certainly have no issue with a witness or two being discovered by the press, but when almost no witnesses were found by the police and those utilized not only came from the press but months after the fact, then there are issues. When those very witnesses, by and large, were interviewed by the police contemporaneously to the crime and had nothing...if it walks like a duck...

The cub reporter should be put on the stand.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

a request

I speak up when the Kercher's are bashed here as well.

Please provide evidence of this, or please do not bring up innuendo.

 

[Briars]

Please provide evidence of this, or please do not bring up innuendo.

What innuendo? Accusing the Kerchers of being interested in money only in their pursuit of the defendants comes to mind off hand, Supernaut shared that sentiment a few times.

 

[Grinder]

What innuendo? Accusing the Kerchers of being interested in money only in their pursuit of the defendants comes to mind off hand, Supernaut shared that sentiment a few times.

Haha - and when was the last time you "spoke up"? Supernaut has been criticized here harshly for various statements and the posters here have no control.

Do you speak up when the ad hominem attacks against anybody and everybody not PG over at your PMF sites? Didn't think so?

Do you question why Jools attempts to out people? Do tell them not to mock the looks of everybody on the other side? Do you object to the photo shopped pictures of Preston?

 

[Chris_Halkides]

What innuendo? Accusing the Kerchers of being interested in money only in their pursuit of the defendants comes to mind off hand, Supernaut shared that sentiment a few times.

Supernaut speaks only for himself, which of course is true of any commenter here.

 

[Briars]

Supernaut speaks only for himself, which of course is true of any commenter here.

When comments like those go by unchallenged you have some responsibility , that's why I speak up.

 

[Bill Williams]

When comments like those go by unchallenged you have some responsibility , that's why I speak up.

.... which is why people ask you why you remain silent when stuff is hurled at FOA supporters at other places.

Supernaut and I have crossed swords over comments about the Kerchers. For some reason you believe it is all right to be nasty to FOA supporters. I will retract this if you can provide one example otherwise.

 

[CoulsdonUK]

Continuation Part 5: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case?

ETA:- Not sure what is happening with posts but the above is the name of this thread.