Looking for Skeptics

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Pixel42 said:
Flaccon has already asked the spirits my name, despite knowing how I would react to them they were unable to provide it. So we already know they can't or won't give the names of people not present. It's hard to know what information it would be reasonable to expect disembodied spirits to know, but if they can't or won't tell the person they are communicating with the colour of a playing card that's lying face up a few feet away then we're at an impasse.
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I know. We haven't received any specific claim that these spirits can actually do anything.

Personally I would like to hear them speak anything at all but it now appears that they can't be recorded they just speak when flaccon plays back a recording or some thing.

Has anyone really nailed down any specific claims beyond spirit voices?

I only suggested my name because Xterra knows it and I don't think anyone else does.

Eta I suggested my father because he really is dead, he really did say he would try and contact us and he knows that my 21st birthday gift was the most memorable day of my life. I would not be able to confirm or verify flaccon's answer but if she got it right it would seriously freak me out.

Eta2 come to think of it my dad was welsh so I doubt he would willing travel to Chester in this life or the next.
 
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Here's one, if we're going for real names - I'm called something ordinary, but within the next couple of weeks I'm changing my name by deed poll to a nickname I've had since I was three. It is actually a real name (which I didn't know until very recently), but an incredibly unusual one (hence me not knowing it was a real name). My first name is very unusual, middle name less so, and last name not unusual at all. Taken together, however, the middle and last names again become unusual. I have a way of verifying this name over the internet, which I won't disclose just yet, as that might give it away - but this can prove that I go by this name.

If flaccon can tell me that name, then I will be suitably impressed. I don't think it would be entirely impossible to do internet research and find it (I haven't tried it, but I know a method by which it may be possible), but I don't think it would be easy to do so. Certainly harder to find or guess than Pixel's name but, seeing as the spirits couldn't even get "Barbara" for a woman with a picture of someone called Barbara as her avatar, I'm not holding my breath.

In other news, I have my internet back, so will be taking a listen to some of the sound files posted earlier in the thread, despite that ship having sailed.

[Edited to add]I just tried finding my soon-to-be-name using the method I thought might work, and it doesn't. So I'm sure that finding it would be a true demonstration of having access to information that's not easily discovered.
 
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Biscuit said:
I know. We haven't received any specific claim that these spirits can actually do anything.

Personally I would like to hear them speak anything at all but it now appears that they can't be recorded they just speak when flaccon plays back a recording or some thing.

Has anyone really nailed down any specific claims beyond spirit voices?

I only suggested my name because Xterra knows it and I don't think anyone else does.
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There are plenty of specific claims of what the spirits can do, both here and on her website. This includes contact with dead loves ones and healing, explanation of mysteries, messages in full sentences, etc.

Also, from the site: « The spirits willingness to please, is a pleasure to work with. »
 
Mojo said:
Because, in this context, Flaccon claims that they can access information that is otherwise inaccessible.
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And therefore can not be verified except by the spirits themselves... convenient that.


It seems to me that the spirits sound remarkably like Flaccon.
 
Since we have no way whatsoever of knowing what information the spirits might be in possession of, the obvious thing would be to ask them.

Flaccon could simply ask the spirits whether they are able to see and identify a playing card nearby and in plain view, but out of her own sight.

Alternatively, they might suggest another type of verifiable information they can provide.

A test to demonstrate the existence of real intelligent agents behind the voices is really not complicated, and the longer it goes on being danced around and avoided the more it looks like someone is being evasive.
 
Maurice Ledifficile said:
There are plenty of specific claims of what the spirits can do, both here and on her website. This includes contact with dead loves ones and healing, explanation of mysteries, messages in full sentences, etc.

Also, from the site: « The spirits willingness to please, is a pleasure to work with. »
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I guess what I should have said is that there is no claim that these spirits can see into sealed envelopes or reveal hidden information.
 
Donn said:
Clearly, for these ex-people, being dead is a step up.
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I Don't refer to them as "dead" If I've used the word at all, it's due to coming across to your level of understanding.

There's nothing dead about still having the ability to speak, via any method.
 
Going back over the website. This takes care of any thoughts flaccon might have have on claiming only she can hear them now,

The Spirits that are "openly" communicating, have not chosen me to "profit" In fact their main concern was to "clue me up" and have me seek help from the Church hood (I am still working on the latter) In the long run, these spirits are capable of spreading waves of real positivity.
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What are waves of positivity?

This claim is not verifiable.

A Spirits Ability. They have performed some amazing art work in front of my eyes. Each piece of art, ranges from half an inch to 1.5 inch approx. There are just 4 pieces of art, each containing a number of carefully set illusions that are not visible to the naked eye. Nor I believe, constructible by the human hand, given that their "multi-illusioned/rotating" art work, is in millimetres.
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As for this claim,

Direct Conversation. The time is now to speak with our spirit guides AND receive back messages. It's a New Age, and time to realise through "hard evidence" that the spirits are within us, and can communicate. It's "Seeing the truth" that rejuvenates one's spirit, causing a natural growth in spiritual strength through knowledge. There is nothing more healing than the realization of "Eternity"
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No clairvoyance. No ability to tell the future or identify hidden info. Just a call and response.

This is all just vague claims,

Demonstration includes

*Valuable information*
*Spiritual guidance/Cleansing/Healing*
*Guaranteed contact with the spirits every time *
* Messages*
* Explanations of mysteries *
* Demonstration of ability *
* Revealing Destiny *
* Book of Messages *
* Peace of Mind *
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Revealing destiny? WTF does that even mean? As for guaranteed contact every time they are batting a big fat zero on that.

What is an actual specific objective ability that these spirits could demonstrate? Peace of mind and spiritual cleansing don't cut the mustard.
 
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Biscuit said:
I guess what I should have said is that there is no claim that these spirits can see into sealed envelopes or reveal hidden information.
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They're not psychic's, clairvoyant's, mediums etc, they're spirits. "Us"
 
flaccon said:
There's nothing dead about still having the ability to speak, via any method.
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What is one if dead and dumb? Really dead?

Are some of your "spirits" still living persons? If so, do they know when they speak on your tapes? This could assist in testing.
 
flaccon said:
They're not psychic's, clairvoyant's, mediums etc, they're spirits. "Us"
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So they can't reveal the color of a card in a sealed envelope?

What does any of this mean. Be specific.


Demonstration includes

*Valuable information*
*Spiritual guidance/Cleansing/Healing*
*Guaranteed contact with the spirits every time *
* Messages*
* Explanations of mysteries *
* Demonstration of ability *
* Revealing Destiny *
* Book of Messages *
* Peace of Mind *

Eta if they are us then they presumable only know what they knew when they were alive, they have no special paranormal abilities. Is that correct?
 
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Biscuit said:
I guess what I should have said is that there is no claim that these spirits can see into sealed envelopes or reveal hidden information.
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You are correct. The claims are also not as specific as I let on.

If the spirits can hear your questions, they can hear you read out a sentence. You can then write it down and have the spirits repeat it.

You could ask the spirits something as simple as flaccon's real name or what year this is. Except Flocon doesn't know what the question is and is then asked to interpret the response.

It's much too late to claim the spirits can't hear, at this point.
 
Biscuit said:
Going back over the website. This takes care of any thoughts flaccon might have have on claiming only she can hea rather now,



What are waves of positivity?

This claim is not verifiable.



As for this claim,



No clairvoyance. No ability to tell the future or identify hidden info. Just a call and response.

This is all just vague claims,



Revealing destiny? WTF does that even mean? As for guaranteed contact every time they are batting a big fat zero on that.

What is an actual specific objective ability that these spirits could demonstrate? Peace of mind and spiritual cleansing don't cut the mustard.
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Dis-prove it? £100 isn't a lot.

(Alderbank, I have just written out a very good sequence of speps & tests, including if they can see though solid material to identify colours)

PS. Reminder; It's not about the business Biscuit.
 
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Biscuit said:
I guess what I should have said is that there is no claim that these spirits can see into sealed envelopes or reveal hidden information.
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What can they do that flaccon could not do without supernatural help, and which can be independently verified? That's the question that needs to be answered. Until it is we can't begin to construct an acceptable test protocol.
 
The spirits don't draw cats. Or at least, they haven't yet. Even though I care for 3 cats, and 2 of them once belonged to Reg, the spirits don't like cats. Their information on the "Cat" is quite important. The cat is currently under medical investigation, linking a certain cat disease to human brain cancer.

Snip...

It is seriously no coincidence that statistics show, 1 in 3 cats have the disease, whilst 1 in 3 people die from cancer these days.

Snip...


The Cat is referred to in the spirit~world as a Devil's Reject. Satan uses cats, as another silent method to poison Man. Centuries ago we knew this information, we kicked cats on sight. The information wasn't lost over the Centuries either, it was purposefully burned from village to village. Much information fizzled out over time, or became the "Old wives tales" of today.

"We need to burn their orifice" Reg had said. Meaning Extinction of the Cat. As much as I adore my cats, and will continue to do so, I do believe that by returning the Cat species back into the wild, would benefit Mankind immensely, by decreasing the fight against cancer, amongst other unnecessary cat-related diseases.
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Seriously?

Spirits better watch out for caturday.
 
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flaccon said:
Dis-prove it? £100 isn't a lot.

(Alderbank, I have just written out a very good sequence of steps & tests, including if they can see though solid material to identify colours)

PS. Reminder; It's not about the business Biscuit.
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My claim is "Spirits exist" My explanation of their ability, is also a claim. The rest is obvious, that is our destiny.
 
flaccon said:
Dis-prove it? £100 isn't a lot.

(Alderbank, I have just written out a very good sequence of speps & tests, including if they can see though solid material to identify colours)

PS. Reminder; It's not about the business Biscuit.
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The spirits don't need the special ability to see through solid material. They get to see the card before it's put in. Flocon doesn't.
 
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