Continuation Part 5: Discussion of the Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito case

[Kaosium]

This would be a very serious crime. The crime would be committed by Vecchiotti and Conti.
If judge-appointed experts have any informal contact with other experts - but especially with experts linked to the defence or who already expressed a view on the case - that would be a very serious crime, and it would cause their report to become trash paper in any Italian trial.

I wonder if maybe I missed something, what are you and Bill talking about regarding an informal contact?

 

[RandyN]

Dan I won't return the favor and call you dishonest you just don't know certain things. Any women could tell you that a blow dry and brush is used to achieve a smooth and styled finish. Bill who do you think is actually obsessed with Amanda?

The hair thing.

Back in the day men wore longer hair styles. Think 70's...I recall spending great amounts of time blowing and brushing my long beautiful hair and getting it perfect. Only to step outside and in one gust of wind my head looked like I stuck my finger into a light socket...and even if I re-brushed it ...the long beautiful hair which was rather thin shaft wise would never respond to a suitable look again...unless I rewashed it and started over...

Others with thicker long beautiful hair didn't suffer so much from this problem...my hair would have the exact look of Knox in the screen captures ...almost as long and the wind blown look was never good for me...

 

[Supernaut]

The hair thing.

Back in the day men wore longer hair styles. Think 70's...I recall spending great amounts of time blowing and brushing my long beautiful hair and getting it perfect. Only to step outside and in one gust of wind my head looked like I stuck my finger into a light socket...and even if I re-brushed it ...the long beautiful hair which was rather thin shaft wise would never respond to a suitable look again...unless I rewashed it and started over...

Others with thicker long beautiful hair didn't suffer so much from this problem...my hair would have the exact look of Knox in the screen captures ...almost as long and the wind blown look was never good for me...

Geezus, tell me about it.

I was a 'biker' in my 'teens and early-twenties (in the late 70's/early 80's), and I just didn't bother with haircuts.

I had to buy helmets at least a size bigger than would have otherwise have fitted my already-large cranium.

Seriously, at the time it was a real challenge finding a 'lid that came in a big-enough size.

 

[Kaosium]

That may be a gift limited to a small portion of the population, so its not a big point. Certainly the purse/no purse through the keyhole contradiction is more important.

Are you talking about how in one recounting Amanda said she looked through the keyhole and could only see a purse, and later that she said that she peeked through looking for Meredith that she couldn't see anything?

Was anything about this ever asked of Amanda when she testified? I don't remember it, but I wouldn't be surprised. I recall Mignini tried to make something out of how at one point Amanda said she turned off her phone to save the battery and so they wouldn't be disturbed, and later when asked just said she turned it off to save the battery, and Mignini tried make a big deal out of that, would you?

Let's see how The Great Purse Issue might have been handled were Amanda allowed to talk to the demented creep the way he deserved:

PM Mignini: 'You said here when you looked through the keyhole that you could see a purse. You said here when you looked through the keyhole you couldn't see anything, which is it? This is evidence you're lying, you're guilty!'

Amanda: 'You moron, of course the purse was still there, I already said that. What I meant when I said the latter was I couldn't see anything of the body of Meredith that was in there. Duh, slug.'

 

[cuki777]

cuki pbs*17

"I kneeled on the floor and squinted, trying to peer through the keyhole. I couldn’t see anything."

 

[Supernaut]

"I kneeled on the floor and squinted, trying to peer through the keyhole. I couldn’t see anything."
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_5221951a285bf4ddbc.jpg[/qimg]
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_5221951a2846bceb7e.jpg[/qimg]

Just to say;

I've always loved The Ramones, and Joey was - to quote some-one else - one of nature's tragic mistakes.

 

[Kaosium]

"I kneeled on the floor and squinted, trying to peer through the keyhole. I couldn’t see anything."
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_5221951a285bf4ddbc.jpg[/qimg]
[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_5221951a2846bceb7e.jpg[/qimg]

Now crop out the bottom half of that picture and what do you see? That would be what Amanda saw through the keyhole, how could she have seen the floor?

 

[Briars]

Are you talking about how in one recounting Amanda said she looked through the keyhole and could only see a purse, and later that she said that she peeked through looking for Meredith that she couldn't see anything?

Was anything about this ever asked of Amanda when she testified? I don't remember it, but I wouldn't be surprised. I recall Mignini tried to make something out of how at one point Amanda said she turned off her phone to save the battery and so they wouldn't be disturbed, and later when asked just said she turned it off to save the battery, and Mignini tried make a big deal out of that, would you?

Let's see how The Great Purse Issue might have been handled were Amanda allowed to talk to the demented creep the way he deserved:

PM Mignini: You said here when you looked through the keyhole that you could see a purse. You said here when you looked through the keyhole you couldn't see anything, which is it? This is evidence you're lying, you're guilty!

Amanda: You moron, of course the purse was still there, I already said that. What I meant when I said the latter was I couldn't see anything of the body of Meredith that was in there. Duh, slug.

Looking through a key hole and seeing your missing flatmates purse on the bed is significant . Deciding to omit that from your memoir makes it perhaps more so. Making up dialogue, which seems to be the new thing around here isn't dealing with the revised stories.

 

[Kaosium]

Looking through a key hole and seeing your missing flatmates purse on the bed is significant.

Why?

Deciding to omit that from your memoir makes it perhaps more so.

Why?

Making up dialogue, which seems to be the new thing around here isn't dealing with the revised stories.

What makes you think there's any significant difference between the two when the important thing was the dead body of Meredith? Purse or no purse she couldn't see Meredith, of what possible interest is the insignificant detail that she peered through the keyhole and couldn't see the body, only a purse on the bed?

 

[MDDVS]

Looking through a key hole and seeing your missing flatmates purse on the bed is significant . Deciding to omit that from your memoir makes it perhaps more so. Making up dialogue, which seems to be the new thing around here isn't dealing with the revised stories.

Why is it significant?

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

How can the PGP not see that this case at best was bungled by the ILE and they are guilty and at worst it was bungled and they are innocent.

This is actually something that has bothered me right from the very start.

The group we've been calling the "pro-guilt people" actually behaves very, very much like the "pro-Perugian police people". The PGP are not only adamant Knox is guilty (of something), but they're also adamant that Mignini is a sane and rational fellow, Stefanoni is a competent and honest lab technician who knows more about LCN DNA analysis than people with doctoral degrees who are leaders in the field, the faked AIDS test results were an honest mistake, Amanda was never struck or yelled at and so on at great length.

There's no necessary logical connection between thinking Knox is guilty and being a cheerleader for the Perugian law enforcement community. As you say, it seems like any minimally rational person would have to see that "this case at best was bungled by the ILE and they are guilty and at worst it was bungled and they are innocent".

Yet expressing that opinion would get you thrown out of guilter forums.

 

[Grinder]

Looking through a key hole and seeing your missing flatmates purse on the bed is significant . Deciding to omit that from your memoir makes it perhaps more so. Making up dialogue, which seems to be the new thing around here isn't dealing with the revised stories.

Why would seeing a purse be significant? Do you think Meredith only had one?

Why would omitting it from her memoirs be of any significance? This is the same non issue as the 12:47 phone call.

As far as I can find there is no mention of her seeing the purse in Massei. I don't find any report of looking through key hole.

The inconsistencies in her book are most clear when passages of Waiting to be Heard are compared with two letters she wrote to her lawyers on 9 November, 2007. In the letters, Knox says that on the day Kercher's body was discovered she looked through the keyhole of the British student's locked door and saw her purse on the bed. In her memoir, Knox says she tried to look through the keyhole, but saw nothing.

As an aside it seems so very odd that a letter to her attorney would be public but that's amore Italy.

I can't find the letter on the wiki or anywhere else. It would be better to actually see what she said but no matter what I don't see the big issue.

Apparently she didn't have copies of her own letters or she questioned her own letter when she wrote her book or the co-author mixed it up.

Briar do you have this letter?

 

[yimyammer]

Looking through a key hole and seeing your missing flatmates purse on the bed is significant . Deciding to omit that from your memoir makes it perhaps more so. Making up dialogue, which seems to be the new thing around here isn't dealing with the revised stories.

how would Amanda know her roommates purse was missing at this juncture? disregard, my bad, I misread your sentence, u meant missing roommate not missing purse

RU saying it was significant because you are assuming the purse would be with Meredith if she wasn't in her room? If so, it would seem pretty likely it wasn't her only purse, so I am still failing to see the significance to be draw from this.

 

[yimyammer]

I assume everyone is aware of Raf's online Q&A and it has already been discussed here?

If not, here's the link: http://ask.fm/RaffaeleSollecito

here's a recent Q&A:

Have you finally figured out how emails work? If you sent any the night you killed Meredith they would have been still on the server.‎ Fredo Corleone

Raf: they are still there, police officers didn't investigate for it

Then why doesn't Raf's attorneys show this at trial???? Seems HUGELY important, amirate?

 

[Grinder]

This is actually something that has bothered me right from the very start.

The group we've been calling the "pro-guilt people" actually behaves very, very much like the "pro-Perugian police people". The PGP are not only adamant Knox is guilty (of something), but they're also adamant that Mignini is a sane and rational fellow, Stefanoni is a competent and honest lab technician who knows more about LCN DNA analysis than people with doctoral degrees who are leaders in the field, the faked AIDS test results were an honest mistake, Amanda was never struck or yelled at and so on at great length.

Me too. They are so pro authority, pro cop and pro system. Barbie talked how the information was coming from the authorities of course they believed them.

When Mignini's history came out I suggest to PGP that they too should hope for a change, but alas not.

When the miracle bra clasp came out after 47 days and no other evidence I thought they would say "oh please" but alas not.

There's no necessary logical connection between thinking Knox is guilty and being a cheerleader for the Perugian law enforcement community. As you say, it seems like any minimally rational person would have to see that "this case at best was bungled by the ILE and they are guilty and at worst it was bungled and they are innocent".

Yet expressing that opinion would get you thrown out of guilter forums.

Thanks for stopping by...

 

[Briars]

The purse on the bed wasn't the only clue if you remember. The front door was open there was blood in the bathroom, a break-in, and a strange deposit in the toilet. Sollecito claimed he even tried to break down the door. The locked bedroom , Meredith not answering her phones, purse on the bed.....really not important? . Amanda's letter to her lawyer November 9 2007 mentions the purse. She forgets that for her edited memoir. Interesting revisiting the Nov 9 letter she writes that she dried her hair first then noticed the toilet contents.

 

[yimyammer]

The purse on the bed wasn't the only clue if you remember. The front door was open there was blood in the bathroom, a break-in, and a strange deposit in the toilet. Sollecito claimed he even tried to break down the door. The locked bedroom , Meredith not answering her phones, purse on the bed.....really not important? . Amanda's letter to her lawyer November 9 2007 mentions the purse. She forgets that for her edited memoir. Interesting revisiting the Nov 9 letter she writes that she dried her hair first then noticed the toilet contents.

he's lucky he didn't knock that door down as they most assuredly would have entered, tracking their footprints and who knows what else inside with them, and the way the PLE perceived them, they would have been toast (& they might be anyway)

 

[Dan O.]

I can't find the letter on the wiki or anywhere else. It would be better to actually see what she said but no matter what I don't see the big issue.

look for "Amanda's email home". (but not the one from October, that's from her Facebook page)

Edit: I found another wiki with the letters to her lawyer here

I can't seem to copy the page source from my iPad.

 

[Kaosium]

As an aside it seems so very odd that a letter to her attorney would be public but that's amore Italy.

I can't find the letter on the wiki or anywhere else. It would be better to actually see what she said but no matter what I don't see the big issue.

Apparently she didn't have copies of her own letters or she questioned her own letter when she wrote her book or the co-author mixed it up.

Briar do you have this letter?

Halides1 linked them recently in this post.

 

[Mary_H]

"Big hair". That always makes me giggle.

ETA >> I'm thankful that the likes of yourself are around to get me to lighten-up occasionally. Thanks, Mary_H.

Any time, Supernaut. I've always thought you have a great sense of humor.

The hair thing.

Back in the day men wore longer hair styles. Think 70's...I recall spending great amounts of time blowing and brushing my long beautiful hair and getting it perfect. Only to step outside and in one gust of wind my head looked like I stuck my finger into a light socket...and even if I re-brushed it ...the long beautiful hair which was rather thin shaft wise would never respond to a suitable look again...unless I rewashed it and started over...

Geezus, tell me about it.

I was a 'biker' in my 'teens and early-twenties (in the late 70's/early 80's), and I just didn't bother with haircuts.

I had to buy helmets at least a size bigger than would have otherwise have fitted my already-large cranium.

Seriously, at the time it was a real challenge finding a 'lid that came in a big-enough size.

I have the same problem with hats. When my son was a baby, his height and weight were in the 25th percentile, and his head size was in the 95th. He got that from me.