Moderated Obama birth certificate CT / SSN CT / Birther discussion

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Tomtomkent said:
Why is Lord Luncheonmeat still discussing photoshop layers? There is no relevance discussing programme that was not used to create the PDF and offers no viable analysis of the data. Shove any PDF or anything but a vanilla image file in and it will convert objects into whatever format it uses. So what? Who cares?
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OMG we found computer artifacts in a document we downloaded from the web.
 
I vote for

a140%2520whtney2005%2520150-1.jpg


And as an aside I thought JayUtah's post provided one of the clearest and most interesting descriptions of this issue that I have seen on the web.

Here's a link to his post RP in case you missed it or would like to reread it:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8575901&postcount=7124

Bonus issue: If anybody figures out where this picture was taken within the next week or so I'll donate $25 bucks to the JREF.
a140%2520whtney2005%2520150-1.jpghttp:
 
davefoc said:
Pretty good.

I'll make the donation but can you be more specific as to where. Did you actually recognize it or did you trace the photo through other means?
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Well the photo is named "a140 whitney2005 150-1.jpg" Dave.
 
I vote for Jay. Robert, as in his other threads, dishonestly ignores any information he is given that he cant explain away or shrug off.
 
Ausmerican said:
Well the photo is named "a140 whitney2005 150-1.jpg" Dave.
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Yes it is, I thought Picasa just made up their own names for an image that wasn't the full size image. Still, give sts60 some credit, he had to right click on the image and figure out that the Whitney in the title referred to Mt. Whitney and not Whitney Houston or some such.

So again, sts60, I say pretty good, although with a little less sincerity than when I said it the first time.
 
Tomtomkent said:
Why is Lord Luncheonmeat still discussing photoshop layers? There is no relevance discussing programme that was not used to create the PDF and offers no viable analysis of the data. Shove any PDF or anything but a vanilla image file in and it will convert objects into whatever format it uses. So what? Who cares?
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I mentioned this before, but I believe he is trying to promote the view that the birth certificate was created out of whole cloth using Photoshop and converted to PDF later. That is why he keeps returning to the Photoshop meme.
 
davefoc said:
Yes it is, I thought Picasa just made up their own names for an image that wasn't the full size image. Still, give sts60 some credit, he had to right click on the image and figure out that the Whitney in the title referred to Mt. Whitney and not Whitney Houston or some such.

So again, sts60, I say pretty good, although with a little less sincerity than when I said it the first time.
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*chuckle* Sorry, Ausmerican nailed it. I thought it was a trick quesiton when I looked at the URL.

I've lived around mountains a good part of my life, and also lived in Houston, but I have been to neither Mt. Whitney nor Whitney Houston.
 
With Birthers, everything seems to be based on misinterpretation, half-truths and outright falsehoods.

Even when the President goes out of his way to release his Birth Certificate, they cry fake, when the issuing state confirms the authenticity of the document, and confirms that Barack Hussein Obama II is indeed a natural born citizen. They still want more, and blame Obama of covering up when it is the law that prevents them from having a look-see for themselves.

But they still want more. "We want to see x records, but the President has had them sealed, and must be hiding something.", conveniently ignoring the fact that most of their demands that aren't met are covered by State and Federal laws that prevent these being made public, as is the case for everyone else. Obama could release them, but how many other Presidents have released their school records, or other records that the Birthers believe it is their right to see?

Their list far and away exceeds what has been asked of before for any other Presidential candidate, and if Obama did give them what they wanted, she'd still want more. I could easily get to the stage where they'll be looking for the toys he wanted at Christmas as a kid, his favourite comic book in 3rd grade and whether or not he ate up all of his Wheaties.

The law that protects the privacy of we mere mortals extends all the way up to the President, and it is his right to decide what he does or does not want to make a matter of public record.

Even some of the things they want to see are either lost or no longer exist. The magical Thesis seems to have gone forever, and even his former professor, Michael Baron tried to find his copy, but admitted to probably tossing it out.

We have the celebrity Birthers, such as Sheriff Joe Arpaio, and his campaign against Obama. The Birthers look to him as providing a beacon of 'truth' for them, while the good Sheriff uses it to enhance his media persona and as a smokescreen to his long list of failures, incidents and personal 'mistakes'. For them, a corrupt County Sheriff's word is greater than a State Official.

Then there are the many false claims and actual fake documents that they leap upon immediately and pronounce as proof of Obama being foreign born without making any checks into whatever it is. They still peddle April Fools jokes as truth and believe every "factual" chain about Obama that drops into their inbox, without looking into any of the citations made. As long as it feeds their brand of crazy, they'll believe anything.

Even when every expert, claim and alleged fact they introduced is debunked, and normally in the case of the experts, by their own words, they refuse to see the light and accept the facts. It's off to their next installment of crazy and another expert, and the dance begins again.

The Democratic Party accepts that Obama is a natural born citizen, and would have vetted all of the information carefully before he was suggested as a Presidential candidate. The Republican party accept that Obama is a natural born citizen, and I'm sure they would have loved it to be otherwise. The State of Hawaii have confirmed it being the case, and The State Of Hawaii are probably the best experts in the field of things that happen in Hawaii. Foreign governments who would have checked out every aspect of Obama accepted the facts, even those who would have loved to mess up the government.

Obama was born there, and sooner or later you'll have to accept the fact.

Here's one crumb of comfort for you Birthers. Obama will be out of Office in 2017.
 
Straw Man said:
With Birthers, everything seems to be based on misinterpretation, half-truths and outright falsehoods.

[snip]
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I agree with every line of your post except:
Straw Man said:
Obama was born there, and sooner or later you'll have to accept the fact.
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No. Some people will go to their graves insisting that President Obama is a foreigner.


..............................
Straw Man said:
Here's one crumb of comfort for you Birthers. Obama will be out of Office in 2017.
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If one is irrational enough to believe that Obama violated the Constitution to gain power, then one is almost certainly irrational enough to believe that Obama will not step down at the end of his second term.
 
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Ladewig said:
If one is irrational enough to believe that Obama violated the Constitution to gain power, then one is almost certainly irrational enough to believe that Obama will not step down at the end of his second term.
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Yes and that brings up the great question, if he is that evil and the threat that dire - why are the birthers not in armed revolt?

Robert will keep dodging that question and the follow on - what WOULD cause you to rise up?
 
If one is irrational enough to believe that Obama violated the Constitution to gain power, then one is almost certainly irrational enough to believe that Obama will not step down at the end of his second term.
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Like Bush didn't.
 
It's a tough choice, but I guess I'll have to vote for Jay ;)

Jay's posts are well thought out, based on facts, and frequently draw from his own real world experience and expertise. And his facts virtually always (no one is perfect, not even Jay) check out.

Robert's posts are excellent fodder for Jay (and others) to poke holes through, shred, and then burn to the ground.

About half the reason I enjoy coming to this forum is the free education I receive from folks like Jay. The other half of the enjoyment comes from watching the CTists, psuedoscientists, and other woo peddlers get their virtual butts handed to them by people like Jay.
 
Straw Man said:
....
Even when every expert, claim and alleged fact they introduced is debunked, and normally in the case of the experts, by their own words, they refuse to see the light and accept the facts. It's off to their next installment of crazy and another expert, and the dance begins again.....
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Here's a question: Do the birthers really believe their own claims, or are they just throwing red meat to their (dimwitted) base? I'm no fan of Donald Trump, but he's not dumb, and he certainly knows how to read legal documents. And Trump doesn't even lie outright; he just spreads innuendo, like "Well, a lot of people think it was forged... " or "A lot of questions haven't been answered...." Is all this really a way to avoid saying "Presidents aren't supposed to look like this guy?"
 
Robert Prey said:
Object Groups versus Layers. The problem is, they are one and the same.
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That's odd. A few posts ago you said they were called layers, and now you seem to be saying that they're called Object Groups but that it doesn't matter because it's the same as layers. That doesn't sound like the same thing.

Also, no.
 
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