Founder of Sea Shepherd Arrested in Germany

[Seismosaurus]

I'm sorry, but if you can't see the Shonan Maru turning HARD towards the Ady Gil, you really need glasses.

Actually I do need glasses, and indeed wear them. And was wearing them when I looked at the footage. Which is how I could see that the Ady Gil accelerated into the side of the whaling ship.

In a broader sense, as the far faster and far more manoeuvrable ship the Ady Gil is responsible for not putting itself into that position in the first place.

And of course in an even broader sense the Sea Shepherds are a terrorist organisation that exists to break the law, and they should even have been there in the first place.

Any way you look at it, it was their fault.

Personally I honestly wish that the Japanese government would send one of those nice little Hayabusa class patrol boats along to protect their ships. Would love to see what one of those 76mm cannon would do. It'll never happen, the Japanese are far too civilised to treat the Clowns of the Sea the way they deserve to be treated. But a man can dream, dammit. A man can dream!

 

[NoahFence]

Links?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17312460

The whaling ships headed home from the Antarctic Ocean this week with 266 minke whales and one fin whale, falling short of its quota of about 900.

The agency blamed "sabotage" by anti-whaling activists for the shortfall.

 

[Seismosaurus]

The quota is a limit, not a goal, you know.

 

[NoahFence]

Actually I do need glasses, and indeed wear them. And was wearing them when I looked at the footage. Which is how I could see that the Ady Gil accelerated into the side of the whaling ship.

In a broader sense, as the far faster and far more manoeuvrable ship the Ady Gil is responsible for not putting itself into that position in the first place.

And of course in an even broader sense the Sea Shepherds are a terrorist organisation that exists to break the law, and they should even have been there in the first place.

Any way you look at it, it was their fault.

Personally I honestly wish that the Japanese government would send one of those nice little Hayabusa class patrol boats along to protect their ships. Would love to see what one of those 76mm cannon would do. It'll never happen, the Japanese are far too civilised to treat the Clowns of the Sea the way they deserve to be treated. But a man can dream, dammit. A man can dream!

Oh.
my.
GOD.

***Some potty-mouth language and I would recommend turning your volume down due to the LRAD at about 2:00.



Look how far away the Shonan Maru was. There is no way the captain of that ship should have closed to the Ady Gil from that distance. At the beginning, the Ady Gil is underway, at a very slow speed. Then Captain Bethune tells the helmsman to slow down. Around 2:00 it is painfully clear that they are barely even moving. You can also see the Shonan Maru turn hard toward the Ady Gil.

There simply is no other way to intepret this. I would think by now I've shown that I can be reasonable, and that I do my research. I'm not a "throw it against the wall and hope it sticks" storyteller like our truthers are.

The Shonan Maru intentionally rammed the Ady Gil. That is what happened. Any other interpretation is flat-out false. The only reason you see the Ady Gil increase speed from (from the view of the Japanese ship) is to get out of the way. You can't see this from the Ady Gil view because the cameraman was too busy trying to not be murdered.

 

[Checkmite]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17312460

Japan's whaling activities are contrary to international law. That is why Australia commenced and will continue legal action in the International Court of Justice. New Zealand has announced its intention to intervene in support of Australia's case. Our efforts are aimed at ending Southern Ocean whaling for good.

The Australian Government has and will continue to call on all parties to exercise restraint and to ensure that safety of human life at sea is the highest priority. With the Japanese fleet returning home, Australia will continue its efforts to achieve a permanent end to whaling in a calm and measured manner, through the International Court of Justice.

Hey, look - there's anti-whaling folks in the southern ocean who aren't acting like penises or wrecklessly assaulting people with deadly weapons like multiton ships. Imagine that! I thought "nobody else was doing anything"?

 

[NoahFence]

Hey, look - there's anti-whaling folks in the southern ocean who aren't acting like penises or wrecklessly assaulting people with deadly weapons like multiton ships. Imagine that! I thought "nobody else was doing anything"?

No there arne't. There's a ton of suits trying to placate the Japanese because their economy depends on Japan. They're afraid of Japan. Who else is IN the Southern Ocean doing anything about it? I see no names in that quote of yours.

Again, SSCS never said they were anything but an action-oriented organization. They're not pretending to be nice guys.

 

[Seismosaurus]

Oh.
my.
GOD.

***Some potty-mouth language and I would recommend turning your volume down due to the LRAD at about 2:00.

Nothing in that changes what I saw happening; the Ady Gil rammed into the side of the whaling ship.

Did the whaling ship manoeuvre up close to them in the first place? Sure. So what? That has nothing to do with anything. In the last ten seconds or so up to the impact, the Ady Gil accelerates forward and into the side of the whaling ship.

The only reason you see the Ady Gil increase speed from (from the view of the Japanese ship) is to get out of the way.

They accelerated their boat towards the side of a ship... to try and get out of the way? I know these people certainly come across as frequently incompetent, but I'd have thought even they would know that backing up would be the way to go on that one.

Still, I do concede that the collision might be a result of their utter incompetence rather than a deliberate attempt at martyrdom.

 

[NoahFence]

Did the whaling ship manoeuvre up close to them in the first place? Sure. So what? That has nothing to do with anything.

Um...what?



I'm no mariner, but I think that if your ship is hardly moving, it's difficult to ram a larger ship almost a mile away. Tell me, how do you ram a ship coming at you when you're not moving? The full report makes this quite clear that the Shonan Maru #2 is the ship that was overtaking the Ady Gil, and as such was the ship responsible for safety.

Yea, yea, I know....

LINK! (This is a direct link to a PDF. I can't it on a normal website)

They accelerated their boat towards the side of a ship... to try and get out of the way?

The Ady Gil was about as maneuverable as a life jacket unless it's got speed on its side. How do you get speed? I dunno. Maybe speed up? They only accelerated after Shonan was almost literally on top of them! They were reacting to the situation.

 

[DC]

Actually I do need glasses, and indeed wear them. And was wearing them when I looked at the footage. Which is how I could see that the Ady Gil accelerated into the side of the whaling ship.

In a broader sense, as the far faster and far more manoeuvrable ship the Ady Gil is responsible for not putting itself into that position in the first place.

And of course in an even broader sense the Sea Shepherds are a terrorist organisation that exists to break the law, and they should even have been there in the first place.

Any way you look at it, it was their fault.

Personally I honestly wish that the Japanese government would send one of those nice little Hayabusa class patrol boats along to protect their ships. Would love to see what one of those 76mm cannon would do. It'll never happen, the Japanese are far too civilised to treat the Clowns of the Sea the way they deserve to be treated. But a man can dream, dammit. A man can dream!

LOL terrorists.....
comedy pure.

 

[Wildy]

One is commercial and one isn't. One is in international waters and one isn't. One is for personal use and one is for sale to the highest bidder.

So what about the people of Lamalera and Lamakera in Indonesia? They hunt whales for "personal use", and are legally permitted to do so, but they also trade the meat for other goods. Are they acting in a commercial or non-commercial fashion?

If the Japanese want to commercially fish their own waters that's their right I suppose, but if they want to harvest marine mammals in international waters they should get 'international' permission. It just seems right.

Which they technically have done with the research permits. The problem is that there is nothing in the regulations that says that Japan isn't allowed to sell the meat afterwards.

 

[Sam.I.Am]

As someone who has spent a few years at sea I have to say that the SS are at best irresponsible seamen. What's worse is that they know it and are doing it on purpose. They regularly take on a substantial number of crew members who have never been to sea and it shows in some of the boneheaded things that they do (and that's just what we see on a one hour show so you know that there's a lot more boneheaded stuff that we don't see).

Then there's the danger that they seemingly have no problem placing others in. Prop fouling for example. Intentionally causing another ship to lose power in the middle of a notoriously rough ocean is, in my opinion, attempted murder. What's really funny is that in the latest iteration of Whale Wars (in the islands northwest of Scotland) one of their small boats was prop fouled by the "Whalers" and they were crying about that tactic being illegal (and they were in nowhere near as dangerous waters as the Southern Ocean).

In the case of the Ady Gil they intentionally created a situation where they stood a good chance of causing a collision (much like how someone looking to collect on car insurance might slam on the brakes in the middle of a highway in order to get rear ended because the other car was following "Too closely"). While they may have been borderline correct in their actions as per the international rules of the road they were still clearly held at least half of the blame in that incident and I believe that's what a few different international courts found as well.

I used to listen to whales at sea (in the sonar shack and sometimes I could hear them in my bunk through the pressure hull) and I don't think that they should be hunted yet I too couldn't help but start to root for the whalers only because of the SS actions. I read some of the Animal Planet forums a few years back when Whale Wars was first airing and the overwhelming response was pro whalers (not pro whaling, there is a difference). The following seasons they cut back on the boneheaded stuff being shown but I have no doubt that it was still going on. Idiots like that don't just stop being idiots all of a sudden.

In my opinion they are eco-terrorists and I'm not alone in that conclusion. They have a very hard time getting their vessels flagged (several nations have pulled their previously granted flagged status from the Sea Shepards solely due to their illegal actions).

 

[NoahFence]

So what about the people of Lamalera and Lamakera in Indonesia? They hunt whales for "personal use", and are legally permitted to do so, but they also trade the meat for other goods. Are they acting in a commercial or non-commercial fashion?

Are they doing it in a protected sanctuary under the guise of "research"?

(AKA Lying their asses off about it?)

 

[Seismosaurus]

I'm no mariner, but I think that if your ship is hardly moving, it's difficult to ram a larger ship almost a mile away.

At the point the Ady Gil accelerates towards it the ship is only about 20 yards away. I think it's quite easy to do it from that distance myself.

Tell me, how do you ram a ship coming at you when you're not moving?

You don't. You do it by moving, which the Ady Gil did.

The full report makes this quite clear that the Shonan Maru #2 is the ship that was overtaking the Ady Gil, and as such was the ship responsible for safety.

I agree that the Shonan Maru 2 was overtaking and disagree that this means they are responsible. If I'm overtaking somebody and he suddenly veers into me as I go past, it's his fault.

The Ady Gil was about as maneuverable as a life jacket unless it's got speed on its side. How do you get speed? I dunno. Maybe speed up? They only accelerated after Shonan was almost literally on top of them! They were reacting to the situation.

So gee, ya think maybe it would have been a good idea to speed up earlier? And maybe in a direction that wasn't straight at the nearby ship? Like a crew that were not incompetent morons might have done?

These lunatics openly admit that they want to be out there to get in close and get in the way. What happens as a result is their fault.

 

[RandFan]

Collision from the Shonan Maru's perspective

 

[Seismosaurus]

Yup. The Ady Gil CLEARLY runs into the side of the ship.

 

[Howie Felterbush]

I like how water cannon guy keeps spraying the Andy Gibb even after his ship performs a radical rhinoplasty on it.

 

[NoahFence]

I agree that the Shonan Maru 2 was overtaking and disagree that this means they are responsible. If I'm overtaking somebody and he suddenly veers into me as I go past, it's his fault.

You don't get to "disagree" I wasn't offering an opinion. I was stating a fact.

The Shonan Maru was overtaking the Ady Gil, it was their responisibility to steer clear.

 

[NoahFence]

Yup. The Ady Gil CLEARLY runs into the side of the ship.

In the very beginning of that video, the Ady Gil is not moving. AT ALL. It's in idle. It was that way more than a minute. Each and every second of that minute the Shonan Maru was turning hard to intercept and ram the Ady Gil. It was the Shonan that closed onto the Ady Gil, not the other way around. Only when it was too late did the helmsman of the Ady Gil figure out what the hell was going on, and that's when you see the propwash of the Ady Gil as they attempt to get out of dodge.

I'd also like to find where Pete Bethune orders the helmsman to ram the Shonan Maru. Where's the order? He's outside the ship, as a matter of fact, all you can hear him say in the video taken from the Ady Gil is an order to slow down.

 

[Sam.I.Am]

And you can clearly see the prop wash from the Ady Gil increase from idle (almost imperceptible) to ahead speed (white foam) just as the bow of the Maru approached them. If they hadn't had done that then they wouldn't have been hit. Like I said, both were held at fault for the collision. The Maru for being so close and the Gil for crossing the path of an approaching ship. The Gil was there to harass and cause problems to the whalers and that's what they did until they forgot that fifty tons of steel will always win over 3 tons of carbon fiber and fiberglass.

There was some speculation at the time by others that the Ady was near the end of her operational cycle due to cracks in her framing and so on and that the repairs were going to cost more than what the ship was originally built for and that's why they took so many risks with her. She was expendable.

 

[Sam.I.Am]

I like how water cannon guy keeps spraying the Andy Gibb even after his ship performs a radical rhinoplasty on it.

I think that it was unmanned at the time. It's easier to keep a pump running than to prime it up and start it several times a day (which can take a few minutes or more). The SS are doing the same thing in their latest show.