Trayvon Martin, Vigilante Justice

[This is The End]

Interesting. therealgeorgezimmerman.com is now down.

1. Was the website never legit in the first place?
2. Or did his lawyer (wisely) tell him to shut it down?

From the AP:

The website that George Zimmerman set up to help raise money for his legal defense in Trayvon Martin's shooting has been disabled, a spokesman for his lawyer said Wednesday.

"It was taken down at Mark's request and he will not have any future online presence unless authorized in advance by Mark," Woods said in an email.

It looks like option 2.

If only the lawyer could make it not have ever happened. I guess it won't show up at the trial anyway, a few people in this thread have me convinced that basically nothing can be discussed in a trial.

 

[This is The End]

So no one can shed any light on Gilbreath saying about "running around the car?"

TM went up to GZ's car to confront him first. TM knocks on GZ's car window.


<snip>

Or not.

Weird how Z didn't mention any of that in the call to the police.

ETA: Oh I get it, that supposedly happened "after" the call...

 

[Cylinder]

If only the lawyer could make it not have ever happened. I guess it won't show up at the trial anyway, a few people in this thread have me convinced that basically nothing can be discussed in a trial.

Huh? What possible relevance does a fund-raising site published to raise funds for a legal defense have to a murder trial? I mean, this is one of our core protections in the United States.

Amendment VI:

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.

 

[This is The End]

Huh? What possible relevance does a fund-raising site published to raise funds for a legal defense have to a murder trial? I mean, this is one of our core protections in the United States.

Amendment VI:

It wasn't sarcasm. I didn't mean to imply I thought it would come up at trial.

Though I also don't think it is in question that the site had some very "odd" content. It was one of several things we know that make Z look bad. As for being brought up in court? No telling.

I'm not sure why you bring up that just because it is fund raising for his trial that it can't be brought up in the trial? What if he was selling "I murdered that boy" t-shirts?

O'Mara to disclose over $200,000 in donations to Zimmerman at tommorow's hearing

Well at least he got enough for the bail.

 

[Cylinder]

I'm not sure why you bring up that just because it is fund raising for his trial that it can't be brought up in the trial? What if he was selling "I murdered that boy" t-shirts?

I'm not saying it would be somehow protected - it just wouldn't be relevant. Selling confession shirts OTOH....

My apologies for reading sarcasm, BTW.

 

[Rare Truth]

So no one can shed any light on Gilbreath saying about "running around the car?"

So we have Mr. Martin and Det. Gilbreath seemingly stating that TM came up to GZ in his car/truck. And GZ might or might not have said that, we don't have his entire statements.

I thought this would be way more relevant than a screwdriver, and whether it was a flat head or phillips.

It has not been transcribed anywhere, because this is a portion in the CNN transcription where they broke away to commercial. It was described as "circling" his car.

I transcribed it myself.

DE LA RIONDA: Did he, Mr. Zimmerman, the defendant, at one point claim to the police that he was scared because Mr. Martin started circling his car?

GILBREATH: Yes.

DE LA RIONDA: According to Mr. Zimmerman he was so scared he still got out of the car and chased Mr. Martin? Correct?

GILBREATH: He went after him,Yes.

DE LA RIONDA: And isn't it true, based on the evidence, Mr. Zimmerman had two flashlights with him?
GILBREATH: Yes.
<snip /tactical flashlight description>

DE LA RIONDA: Mr. Zimmerman never claimed that he chased - in terms of 'ran after' - Mr. Martin, is that correct?

GILBREATH: No.

DE LA RIONDA: But you still have, is it not true, a witness who describes someone chasing another person from the area where they ended up... in other words, from where, near where Mr. Martin lived to the area where the murder happened?

GILBREATH: Yes.
... ...
O'MARA; You had mentioned, the prosecutor had questioned you about Mr. Zimmerman saying that he was having his head hit on the back, correct?

GILBREATH:Yes.

O'MARA; I thought you said the evidence was inconsistent with that?

GILBREATH: No, I don't believe that was his question.

O'MARA; Oh, then let me ask you. Is the evidence inconstant with the suggestion by Mr. Zimmerman that he was his having his head hit or bashed on the ground?

GILBREATH: His injuries are consistent with trauma to the back of his head, yes.

O'MARA;Ok. What are those injuries?

GILBREATH: There's two lacerations to the back of his head

O'MARA; OK. Did you identify what caused those lacerations?

GILBREATH: No.

O'MARA: Could it have been having his head bashed on the ground as he testified to?

GILBREATH: He suggested, I don't know about testified to, he mentioned that his head was being physically bashed against the concrete sidewalk, and that he...this was just prior to him firing the shot, and that he managed to scoot away from the concrete sidewalk, and that is at that point is when the shooting subsequently followed. That is not consistent with the evidence we found."
​

From the video testimony here: George Zimmerman bond hearing :: WRAL.com - Starts at about 1:46:39 (this portion)

 

[Cylinder]

George Zimmerman: Prelude to a shooting

A pit bull named Big Boi began menacing George and Shellie Zimmerman in the fall of 2009.

The first time the dog ran free and cornered Shellie in their gated community in Sanford, Florida, George called the owner to complain. The second time, Big Boi frightened his mother-in-law's dog. Zimmerman called Seminole County Animal Services and bought pepper spray. The third time he saw the dog on the loose, he called again. An officer came to the house, county records show.

"Don't use pepper spray," he told the Zimmermans, according to a friend. "It'll take two or three seconds to take effect, but a quarter second for the dog to jump you," he said.

"Get a gun."

I did not know that Zimmerman's neighbor suffered a home invasion robbery in August 2011.

 

[Dancing David]

And I don't doubt there are legitimate reasons to bring a gun to the store. Just like I don't doubt that there are legitimate reasons to have a screwdriver in your backpack.

My objection is that we must assume the most innocuous of motives for Zimmerman, but the most nefarious motives for Martin.

The screwdriver and the gun are not the same, that is false parity.

TM was not in kindergarten or first grade, therefore he knew the expectations of school. Many acceptable objects from the past (clasp knives, pointed sticks) are totally banned from most schools. As any parent who sends their child to school with regular table ware knives will find out.

In most schools having a screwdriver on you would be a violation of a well known school policy. So in the case of TM, there is no legitimate reason to have the screwdriver.

 

[Dancing David]

Consistency would be nice. But then you and I might not be true skeptics.

Sigh, did you forget to wear your kilt and go to Atheist church again?

 

[Dancing David]

Tommorow Judge Lester will hear the motion from The Miami Herald, et al. to unseal all discovery materials provided to the defendant.

In order for the records to remain sealed, the court must find:

1. Closure is neccessary to prevent a serious and imminent threat to the administration of justice.

2. No alternatives are available, other than a change of venue, which would protect a defendant's right to fair trial; and

3. Closure would be effective in protecting the rights of the accused without being broader than neccessary to acomplish this purpose.

I will be surprised if the judge opens the record.

 

[Dan O.]

Gilbreath appeared to have kept himself out of the loop on a couple of issues. I saw that O'Mara did the same thing when it came to the family financial situation. How difficult would it have been to find out if there was equity in the home or to lookup the contributions George had received from his web site?

O'Mara to disclose over $200,000 in donations to Zimmerman at tommorow's hearing

Shouldn't the attorney for the defendant know as much about his client as a few armature sleuths on the Internet? It will be interesting to see how O'Mara explains to the judge that he didn't know.

 

[Dancing David]

One of the items was supposedly a wedding band. So someone had their house broken into and - among other things - had a wedding band stolen. And they apparently didn't report it. I suppose it's possible, but seems unlikely, especially when Occam's Razor is being invoked to "prove" other aspects of this story.

You do know that all items classified as wedding bands may not be actual objects worn by an individual at their wedding?

 

[Dancing David]

Very true. My neighbors next door are from S. California, and wonder why we have guns in the house, and cars. They've asked us in the past. My father carries one damn near everywhere, as does my mom, and they're from.....Kentucky and Tennessee.

Maybe it has something to do with "Southern" states?

Not really, many people carry in Illinois, despite our laws.

My wife's grandfather used to drive everywhere with a pistol under the front seat of his car. Loaded even.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

It has not been transcribed anywhere, because this is a portion in the CNN transcription where they broke away to commercial. It was described as "circling" his car.
From the video testimony here: George Zimmerman bond hearing :: WRAL.com - Starts at about 1:46:39 (this portion)

Thanks again!
I figured it might have been during a commercial. I guess I shouldn't fault CNN, as at least they provide transcripts for their shows.

 

[Dancing David]

I hilited the part you seem to have missed.

Yup, I agree, especially at a large high school they are likely to be School Resource Officers, who are sworn members of the local force.

 

[Dancing David]

No, I saw it. I also saw the word that comes before it. If you want argue that the school police are completely unaffiliated with the school, and impounded the jewelry some other place besides the school, I suppose you can.

Otherwise, it seems to me that the school police kept the jewelry at the school as opposed to turning it over to the actual police. You know, the guys who have the authority and resources to investigate the felony Martin supposedly committed.

You are silly and getting sillier, the SRO's in my schools are not security guards they are sworn members of the local department.

 

[Dan O.]

In most schools having a screwdriver on you would be a violation of a well known school policy. So in the case of TM, there is no legitimate reason to have the screwdriver.

In a recent decission, possession of a screwdriver was found not to be a violation and the school officials themselves were remanded for over reacting.

 

[Skepticemea]

Did TM have a bundle of unexplainable jewellery and a screwdriver upon him at the time he was shot? Did GZ know of TM being questioned at his school about his possession of these items? If the answer to both of these questions is no, I cannot see what relevance they have.

 

[WildCat]

No, I saw it. I also saw the word that comes before it. If you want argue that the school police are completely unaffiliated with the school, and impounded the jewelry some other place besides the school, I suppose you can.

Otherwise, it seems to me that the school police kept the jewelry at the school as opposed to turning it over to the actual police. You know, the guys who have the authority and resources to investigate the felony Martin supposedly committed.

I don't know where exactly the police keep the jewelry, but Miami-Dade schools have their own police force, and they are "actual police".

So the police have the jewelry, not the school. I doubt it's being kept in the school Martin attended.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

In a recent court decission, possession of a screwdriver was found not to be a violation and the school officials themselves were remanded for over reacting.

This case is relevant why ?

1) From World Net Daily
2) the Maryland Board of Education reversed the suspensions of two students and ordered their records cleaned.
3) penknife and a lighter. Both items were part of their kit used to maintain their athletic equipment.