The Incredible odds of fulfilled bible prophecy

Akhenaten said:
DOC, it quite clearly says:

Amasis was able to defeat an invasion of Egypt by the Babylonians under Nebuchadrezzar II.
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The word defeat is relative (many times) according to who writes the history. The other Wiki article on Nebuchadnezzar II used the wording "he finished with the campaign in Egypt".

We could have blown Vietnam off the map with nuclear bombs. After causing incredible devastation to the land, and killing hundreds of thousands of people we finally realized is wasn't worth the trouble anymore and chose to leave. We could have won if we really wanted to go all out 100%, whose to say Nebuchadnezzar didn't feel the same way. He had a nice big palace with palm trees and hanging gardens back in Babylon. And we really don't know how much devastation and death this man, who also destroyed the Jewish temple in Jerusalem, caused in Egypt.
 
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DOC said:
The word defeat is relative (many times) according to who writes the history. The other Wiki article on Nebuchadnezzar II used the wording "he finished with the campaign in Egypt".

We could have blown Vietnam off the map with nuclear bombs. After causing incredible devastation to the land, and killing hundreds of thousands of people we finally realized is wasn't worth the trouble anymore and chose to leave. We could have won if we really wanted to go all out 100%, whose to say Nebuchadnezzar didn't feel the same way. He had a nice big palace with palm trees and hanging gardens back in Babylon. And we really don't know how much devastation and death this man, who also destroyed the Jewish temple in Jerusalem, caused in Egypt.
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And that makes the bible prophesy more correct how?

Hans
 
TimCallahan said:
I should note that, of the cities listed above most are in the Nile delta, with the exceptions of Memphis, which was located a bit further south than the delta, and Thebes, which was in Upper Egypt. Had there been evidence of devastation in Thebes at this time in history, that would be emphatic evidence in favor of Ezekiel's prophecy. That there is no such devastation there is strongly disconfirming evidence.
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I've been looking for a place to bung this in. This seems as good a spot as any.

Now as the ruler of all Egypt, Amasis took on the traditional role of builder, and is attested to by quarry inscriptions at Tura and Elephantine, and with building projects at Memphis (including two granite colossi and a temple of Isis), Philae, Elephantine, Edfu, Sohag, Abydos, Koptos, Karnak and any number of Delta sites, including his tomb at Sais. While we have never discovered this tomb, Herodotus steps in to describe it for us:


(It is) a great cloistered building of stone, decorated with pillars carved in the imitation of palm-trees, and other costly ornaments. Within the cloister is a chamber with double doors, and behind the doors stands the sepulchre.​

This was really a very prosperous time for Egypt. We are told that agriculture, always the backbone of Egypt, met a spectacular level of success, and Herodotus again tells us that the number of inhabited cities in Egypt reached as high as 20,000.


Amasis, the Last Great Egyptian Pharaoh by Jimmy Dunn
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So much undevastation!


CartoucheAmasis.png


Khnem-ib-re Ahmose (Amasis)​
 
DOC said:
Akhenaten said:
DOC, it quite clearly says:

Amasis was able to defeat an invasion of Egypt by the Babylonians under Nebuchadrezzar II.
Click to expand...


The word defeat is relative (many times) according to who writes the history. The other Wiki article on Nebuchadnezzar II used the wording "he finished with the campaign in Egypt".
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Forget your beloved bloody Wiki for a minute and hunt us up something from Nebuchadnazzer himself about the invasion.

Surely he must have had heaps to say about such a colossal victory? Monuments to himself erected all over the conquered lands and at home? Epic poems commissioned to commemorate the event?

Anything?

And don't bother repeating that bilge about him having successfully invaded and then deciding to just abandon the place without leaving a trace because that's nothing like what the prohecy said.


DOC said:
<drivel>

And we really don't know how much devastation and death this man, who also destroyed the Jewish temple in Jerusalem, caused in Egypt.
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Then why, as I've asked you repeatedly, are you insisting that it was any at all?
 
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DOC said:
The word defeat is relative (many times) according to who writes the history. The other Wiki article on Nebuchadnezzar II used the wording "he finished with the campaign in Egypt".

We could have blown Vietnam off the map with nuclear bombs. After causing incredible devastation to the land, and killing hundreds of thousands of people we finally realized is wasn't worth the trouble anymore and chose to leave. We could have won if we really wanted to go all out 100%, whose to say Nebuchadnezzar didn't feel the same way. He had a nice big palace with palm trees and hanging gardens back in Babylon. And we really don't know how much devastation and death this man, who also destroyed the Jewish temple in Jerusalem, caused in Egypt.
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So why didn't the prophecy say that he could have won but will opt to not do so instead of saying that he will devastate and conquer the place?

Why are the prophecies always REINTERPRETED in attempts for cramming them up the malodorous bodily crevice of Jesus instead of just admitting that they are pure twaddle.

If I foretell that it will rain tomorrow and it does not would you accept my slimy excuses that it ALMOST rained as an acceptable salvage of my prognosticating abilities? I bet not...unless I am some religious nut for Jesus!
 
Leumas said:
So why didn't the prophecy say that he could have won but will opt to not do so instead of saying that he will devastate and conquer the place?
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Because maybe he did devastate it like he did Jerusalem. I don't recall the word conquer in the verses, though they talked of spoils. Maybe he chose to leave Egypt for other reasons.

Here is what TimCallahan said in this thread:

"Nebuchadrezzar was on the point of invading Egypt, but had to hasten back to Babylon to secure his accession when he got word that his father, King Nabopolasser, had died. He never did invade Egypt."

I don't know where Tim got that from so there are a lot of accounts out there. Wiki on Nebu. said he invaded Egypt then said he finished the campaign and returned to work on temples, canals, etc.
 
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Let's just review the story so far, shall we, DOC?

Here are some highlights of the prophecy of Ezekiel:



Ezekiel 29:19-20

19Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will give the land of Egypt unto Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon; and he shall take her multitude, and take her spoil, and take her prey; and it shall be the wages for his army.

20I have given him the land of Egypt for his labour wherewith he served against it, because they wrought for me, saith the Lord GOD.​



Ezekiel 30:10-13

10Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also make the multitude of Egypt to cease by the hand of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon.

11He and his people with him, the terrible of the nations, shall be brought to destroy the land: and they shall draw their swords against Egypt, and fill the land with the slain.

12And I will make the rivers dry, and sell the land into the hand of the wicked: and I will make the land waste, and all that is therein, by the hand of strangers: I the LORD have spoken it.

13Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will also destroy the idols, and I will cause their images to cease out of Noph; and there shall be no more a prince of the land of Egypt: and I will put a fear in the land of Egypt.​
​


And your evidence for this prophecy having been fulfilled is:

DOC said:
The other Wiki article on Nebuchadnezzar II used the wording "he finished with the campaign in Egypt".
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Not looking too flash, are you?
 
DOC said:
Leumas said:
So why didn't the prophecy say that he could have won but will opt to not do so instead of saying that he will devastate and conquer the place?
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Because maybe he did devastate it like he did Jerusalem.
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Then why did neither he nor the Egyptians mention it?

Why is there no evidence of any kind that it happened?


You are beyond wrong about this DOC.


DOC said:
I don't recall the word conquer in the verses, though they talked of spoils. Maybe he chose to leave Egypt for other reasons.
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Just as Napoleon chose to leave New Zealand? Without leaving a trace?

Tell us DOC, why do we find no artefacts from Egypt in the time of Ahmose II turning up at sites in the former Babylon? What happened to all the spoils?
 
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How do you explain this last bit of the prophecy, DOC?

Ezekiel 30:25-26

25But I will strengthen the arms of the king of Babylon, and the arms of Pharaoh shall fall down; and they shall know that I am the LORD, when I shall put my sword into the hand of the king of Babylon, and he shall stretch it out upon the land of Egypt.

26And I will scatter the Egyptians among the nations, and disperse them among the countries; and they shall know that I am the LORD.​


Make sure that your answer properly addresses the inconvenient fact that Egypt is still there but Babylon was captured by the Persians 2½ thousand years ago.
 
Akhenaten said:
You don't say.

How long did it take you to arrive at this breakthrough?
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And without the ancient civilisations of Mesopotamia there would be no O/T. Goat roasters sitting around a fire at night telling tall tales that DOC now thinks are the revealed words of gawd.
 
Akhenaten said:
How do you explain this last bit of the prophecy, DOC?

Ezekiel 30:25-26

25But I will strengthen the arms of the king of Babylon, and the arms of Pharaoh shall fall down; and they shall know that I am the LORD, when I shall put my sword into the hand of the king of Babylon, and he shall stretch it out upon the land of Egypt.

26And I will scatter the Egyptians among the nations, and disperse them among the countries; and they shall know that I am the LORD.​


Make sure that your answer properly addresses the inconvenient fact that Egypt is still there but Babylon was captured by the Persians 2½ thousand years ago.
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Maybe they were scattered, but only for like a week or so, and then everyone grew sick of that, and went home? And forgot to write it down, or didn't have any paper, so they couldn't be bothered?

I mean, come on now, can you be absolutely sure that it didn't happen like that?
 
DOC,

I have a simple question that you can answer simply.

If I foretell that it will rain tomorrow and it does not would you accept my slimy excuses that it ALMOST rained because it was cloudy as an acceptable salvage of my prognosticating abilities.... would you say that my prognosis was correct?​

Please do not obfuscate and wriggle.....just answer the question.
 
Helen said:
Maybe they were scattered, but only for like a week or so, and then everyone grew sick of that, and went home? And forgot to write it down, or didn't have any paper, so they couldn't be bothered?

I mean, come on now, can you be absolutely sure that it didn't happen like that?
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Curses! I never thought of that.

I shall convert to Christianity immediately.
 
Akhenaten said:
Curses! I never thought of that.

I shall convert to Christianity immediately.
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No...No.... by applying a similar illogic you should be converting to Dream Time aboriginal religion and in a 1000 years not immediately at all.
 
Why the Egypt stuff? Look at the Tyre prophecy. This didn't happen! Nebu never took Tyre. Alexander took it. (So he existed, DOC; the remains of his siege causeway still connect Tyre island to the mainland.) Then it was at once rebuilt, insofar as it had been damaged. And it still exists. Prophecy refuted.
Ezekiel 26:7 For this is what the Sovereign LORD says: From the north I am going to bring against Tyre Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, king of kings, with horses and chariots, with horsemen and a great army. ... 14 I will make you a bare rock, and you will become a place to spread fishnets. You will never be rebuilt, for I the LORD have spoken, declares the Sovereign LORD ... 19 This is what the Sovereign LORD says: When I make you a desolate city, like cities no longer inhabited, and when I bring the ocean depths over you and its vast waters cover you ... 21 I will bring you to a horrible end and you will be no more. You will be sought, but you will never again be found, declares the Sovereign LORD.
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Of course it might be argued that some future ruler also called Nebuchadnezzar will arise in, say, the 22nd century, and finally destroy the city. Is that what DOC proposes?

By the way, cities can disappear. Where is Sparta? Where is Sybaris? Where are the cities listed in the "Catalogue of the Ships" in the Iliad? Later commentators strove to identify these places, prominent in Bronze Age, but then abandoned. Palmyra a ruin. Nineveh was unknown for many centuries until resurrected by the archaeologists' trowels. The prophecy against Tyre was therefore possible of achievement: but it was not fulfilled!
 
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