• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Conservatives and climate change

Status
Not open for further replies.
If AGW was a firmly grounded in facts as is the Theory of Evolution no skeptics of AGW alarmism deniers would exist.
ftfy


The Theory of Evolution is exactly as firly grounded as the Theory of Evolution and yet deners still exist there too.

At the end of the day if nearly 100% of published the thousands of published papers and every major science body in the world isn't enough to convince you of the science, then no amount of science is going to convince you of anything.
 
It's silly that these deniers still think there's a discussion to be had with "sides". Do the creationist people in the US also still think this?
If there are no sides, to whom does the label "denier" apply? Others have referred to "partisan" climate blogs. The root of "partisan" is "part".
 
There's no better word for them. They deny hard evidenced science. The are deniers. No, that's not a problem for the AGW theory. If you'd know anything about the science you are trying to deny you would know this. No, that's not going to stop because that's the only way to describe the people thus labeled.
Matt Ridley, Richard Lindzen, Willy Soon, and Freeman Dyson hardly deny "evidenced science". This gross misrepresentation of the opposition says a lot.
 
So if I link to a study that corroborates the evidence for climate change, you think the fact that I include the word denier in my post discredits the science that I refer to?
No. It discredits your voice that you use pejoratives to characterize your opposition. Link all you like. That's not the problem.
 
Me too. That's why I say it must be the sources. I tend not to peruse pseudo-scientific blogs like WhatsUpHisButt.org and ClimateAudit.org. You?

Or RealCrapClimate or SoCalledSkepticalScience, none of them.I stick to journals. Anyone linking those sites is obviously caught up in the pseudoscience of proving their own political agenda.


Glad you agree. Why did you claim differently before?

Your claim that bodies like The House of Commons Science and Technology Committee are engaging in a witch hunt is laughable. I thought that's what you were agreeing with but I see you've flip flopped.:rolleyes:

Didn't you understand my question? Let me rephrase. How many independent investigations exhonerating the accused scientists will it take for you to accept that there is no merit to the accusations?

Which accusations? Who made them? Be specific please, because as far as I can tell you're just spouting rhetoric about witch hunts.

Yes. The reason being that it would (in the investigators minds) limit the impression of the climate scientists as corrupt by the stupid parts of the population.

They are corrupt, just no more than anyone else. Unfortunately, we usually hold scientists to a higher standard.
 
There's no better word for them. They deny hard evidenced science. The are deniers.
.

Who are "they"? What "hard evidenced science" did "they" "deny"?

Please be as specific as possible. I'm inclined to believe you're fighting phantom strawmen. :p
 
Or RealCrapClimate or SoCalledSkepticalScience, none of them.I stick to journals. Anyone linking those sites is obviously caught up in the pseudoscience of proving their own political agenda.

I hear this all the time from science deniers. It's the standard fall back line for anyone who can't refute those websites and thinks that if they denigrate them enough, call the "pseudoscientific" enough times, and eventually people start to believe it.

Hack argument is hack.
 
Last edited:
Or RealCrapClimate or SoCalledSkepticalScience, none of them.I stick to journals. Anyone linking those sites is obviously caught up in the pseudoscience of proving their own political agenda.

Oh, you mean the blogs created by actual climate scientists dedicated to climate science? No, who would ever read such a thing.

You stick to journals. Once in a while, maybe you could read one on science.

Your claim that bodies like The House of Commons Science and Technology Committee are engaging in a witch hunt is laughable. I thought that's what you were agreeing with but I see you've flip flopped.:rolleyes:

I'm not claiming that. Why do you feel the need to lie about my claim?


Which accusations? Who made them? Be specific please, because as far as I can tell you're just spouting rhetoric about witch hunts.

The denialosphere's ridiculous accusations of foul play with regards to the hacked emails. Don't pretend you didn't get that. I know you're not that dumb.


They are corrupt, just no more than anyone else. Unfortunately, we usually hold scientists to a higher standard.

Well then, let's throw out all science. Everyone's corrupt so we can't trust anyone. Right?

Typical science denier.
 
Who are "they"? What "hard evidenced science" did "they" "deny"?

You are apparently one of them. Others in this thread include Malcolm and Mhaze. Then there's chaps like Anthony Watts, Monckton, McIntyre etc.

The hard science you guys deny is the hard science showing AGW to be real and a real problem with serious consequences unless acted upon now.

Please be as specific as possible. I'm inclined to believe you're fighting phantom strawmen. :p

Specific enough for you?
 
(bit_pattern): "Denier = Truther. Same mentality, same logic."1. Really? I remember some statistic that found more truther Democrats than truther Republicans (maybe it was self-identified "liberals" and "conservatives".


Yes, really, I don't care what side of the political divide you find yourself on, whether you subscribe to either AGW denial or 9/11 Twooth then you've gone down the same rabbit-hole.

2. Tell you what, find the least integer t such that 205t gives a remainder of 12 when divided by 43 and a remainder of 27 when divided by 53 and get back to me. Or prove that p|(p-1)!+1 <=> p is prime (Wilson's theorem). No fair looking it up. Then we can talk, okay, genius?1. Opponents of the AGW theory are hardly "climate change deniers".

Ah, yes, that old trick. Try to complicate the issue to a degree that the plebes will be fooled into thinking its just soo complicated that only self-professed geniuses like you can see through the lies and expose those dastardly and duplicitous scientists. it's the internet version of the Wizard of Oz bedazzling the poor peasants by talking in Latin.

One problem with the evidence for the AGW theory is precisely the abundant evidence for dramatic changes in climate before widespread burning of fossil fuels. Pulling a CO2 signal out of very noisy data is trickey.

It's not a "problem" at all, it actually is very instructive in calculating things like climate sensitivity. We can see how the planet has responded to increasing CO2 in the past. We know what causes climate to change, there are only a few fundamental forcings in the system and we can see how they have interrelated throughout history. Past climate changes are a problem for deniers more than anything because they can't explain most of them unless the calculations on sensitivity in the climate system are about right (and which have remained essentially unchanged since they were first calculated in the 19th century). Past climate change is a huge problem for any science deniers prepared to honestly assess and understand the actual evidence we have.

2. For starters, stop applying pejorative labels like "denier" to the opposition. It reinforces the impression that advocates for the AGW hypothesis must rely on intimidation rather than evidence.

If you feel intimidated by having your anti-science denial labelled as such then stop denying science. Pretty simple, I would have thought.
 
Last edited:
If AGW was a firmly grounded in facts as is the Theory of Evolution no skeptics of AGW alarmism would exist.

Physics? Check. Chemistry? Check. Models? Who knows how well partial differential equations and boundary conditions are implemented, why H2O & clouds aren't modelled, and what grid sizes are appropriate versus what is implemented, and what 'magic parameters' are toyed with.

Evolution and AGW have comparable strong concencus in their fields. far above 90%. but both scientific theories are being denied by alot laymen and some scientists outside their field.
and sceptics don't deny science.
 
Matt Ridley, Richard Lindzen, Willy Soon, and Freeman Dyson hardly deny "evidenced science". This gross misrepresentation of the opposition says a lot.

in any field of scinece you will find a fringe group of scientists that do indeed deny scientific theories wthout bringin a alternative theory to the table.
 
in any field of scinece you will find a fringe group of scientists that do indeed deny scientific theories wthout bringin a alternative theory to the table.

Not to mention that only two of those scientists have ever actually done any climate research, most of which has been abysmally bad and has been thoroughly deconstructed in the PR literature.
 
I'm inclined to believe you haven't been paying attention.

I'm inclined to say "Dodge noted".

Of course you can't, it's a strawman. There's nobody actually "denying" Global Warming or the science. When alarmists fail to generate alarm they cry "denier".
 
Oh, you mean the blogs created by actual climate scientists dedicated to climate science? No, who would ever read such a thing.

lol.

You stick to journals. Once in a while, maybe you could read one on science.

Oh snap!

I'm not claiming that. Why do you feel the need to lie about my claim?

Yes, that's exactly what your vapid claim amounts to. Deal with it.:cool:


The denialosphere's ridiculous accusations of foul play with regards to the hacked emails. Don't pretend you didn't get that. I know you're not that dumb.

Boring rhetoric. Who said what exactly? The "denialsphere" is no less meaningless than "they"and "them".

Well then, let's throw out all science. Everyone's corrupt so we can't trust anyone. Right?

Strawman.
Typical science denier.

Boring rhetoric.

An alarmists chasing ghosts.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom