"Ron Paul racist rant caught on tape!" (note, in quotes)

[crimresearch]

http://www.fallacyfiles.org/tuquoque.html

Don't be in such a hurry to trip over your own fallacies... no such defense is being made, except apparently in your own mind.

The poster I was quoting has crafted a very narrow definition that excludes Ron Paul from being associated with racist rants unless a specific statement by him can be found.
I was merely asking if the same standard applied for everyone.

 

[332nd]

I get the feeling based on my personal experience that all you people are white. And so you might not really know what real racism looks like.

& what gives you that feeling?

I don't think so. I can imagine a black guy who is a passionalte and narrow minded anti-communist to say the exact thing about MLK whilst ignoring all the good King did for the world. And I am pretty sure everyone would just let it slide.

You think wrong.

 

[Alan]

Don't be in such a hurry to trip over your own fallacies... no such defense is being made, except apparently in your own mind.

The poster I was quoting has crafted a very narrow definition that excludes Ron Paul from being associated with racist rants unless a specific statement by him can be found.
I was merely asking if the same standard applied for everyone.

It would be good if you made that clear in your previous post.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

The attempt at defending the views expressed in Ron Paul's newsletter by claiming the quotes were taken out of context is one of the weakest that the Ron Paul has put forward.

If someone takes something you have said out of context, the most obvious (and best) defense is to put forward the full statement so that people can see the original and compare it to what has been excerpted. If the apparent meaning of the excerpted version differs significantly from the apparent meaning of the full version, that should be readily obvious -- and you have cleared yourself.

But it doesn't appear to be Ron Paul who has been eager to make public copies of the newsletter pages on which these quotes first appeared. Rather, it has been the critics of Ron Paul who have been doing so.

This^ No sense repeating what was already clearly stated. Go ahead, Ron, Bill, anyone, anyone? What do these statements mean in context. Cause I missed that part.

 

[Foolmewunz]

No. Not by a long shot. This guy was running for office when I was a teenager. And lots of other stuff. Lots.

It is true that Ron Paul's message is fairly tame by standards of the 1960's, but then, the US has mostly grown out of this now. Racists are now deeply undercover and use a lot of "politically correct" terminology rather than actually coming out and calling people the "n-word". That doesn't mean we can't tell it when we see it though. Ron is not going to get a pass on this unless he comes out and admits that he used to be a racist, but has now repudiated it, ala George Wallace and Robert Byrd.

Sorry for derail. (But a fairly on-topic derail.)
Those of us who were active in civil rights in the 60s may recall (I do, but only from reading a bio of him later - I was only eight at the time) that he was a moderate. His infamous statement that he'd "never be out-Nworded again" indicates that he made a calculated political decision to be a racist in order to get elected in Alabama.
Talk about your cynical politicians! I still look back at that and wonder if you can ever believe a word any of them, on either side, ever says.

ETA: I see MaGZ has arrived. Probably the only person here who wants to stop Ron Paul because he's a danger because of his liberal/progressive attitudes.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

...

ETA: I see MaGZ has arrived. Probably the only person here who wants to stop Ron Paul because he's a danger because of his liberal/progressive attitudes.

Jew Kirchick got the newsletters from the ADL.

 

[Giordano]

Bill,

I thank you for your willingness to re-evaluate Ron Paul, and for your overall respect for MLK! We may disagree about a lot of stuff, but I'm always pleased to see areas of agreement. I believe that many politicians seek to divide people against one another on "hot button" topics just to make them easier to exploit. Racism, in particular, has been used for that purpose many, many times.

 

[Oliver]

Still, for most hilarious Paul quote yet (at 2:45): "It's impossible for libertarians to be racist, because racism is a collectivist idea." (!)
When he says stuff like this, I just kinda sit and stare at the screen, and think: "WOW...you actually do believe all this stuff, don't you?!?"

Actually he said:

"It's impossible for libertarians to be racist, because racism is a collectivist idea. You see people in Groups."

Question: Do libertarians see people as groups or individuals?

 

[Axiom_Blade]

Actually he said:

"It's impossible for libertarians to be racist, because racism is a collectivist idea. You see people in Groups."

Question: Do libertarians see people as groups or individuals?

You don't see people in groups unless you're a collectivist, communist socialist. Everybody is a unique and beautiful snowflake.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Actually he said:

"It's impossible for libertarians to be racist, because racism is a collectivist idea. You see people in Groups."

Question: Do libertarians see people as groups or individuals?

Oh, libertarians see them as individuals - it's part of their credo and they're all so upright that they stick by those beliefs. Just look at the examples quoted from St. Ron of Paul.

He's not talking about blacks in general. He's talking about a specific purse snatcher. And he's not tarring (pun intended) all black youths as gang members and carjackers (who we should shoot on sight). Why, that would be racist! He's talking about specific individual gang members and carjackers.
[/deranged libertarian apologist mode off]

 

[Oliver]

Sorry, but that does not answer the question. Is the libertarian philosophy all about the individual or about people as groups as well? I honestly don't know, do you guys?

 

[Foolmewunz]

Sorry, but that does not answer the question. Is the libertarian philosophy all about the individual or about people as groups as well? I honestly don't know, do you guys?

Oliver, frankly I don't take libertarians serious enough to have ever listened to whether they have any sort of group concientiousness. They lose me at the free market judicial system....

 

[SezMe]

So if Texas has the death pentalty and most Texans like it, the Federal government should tell them they cannot have it?

Sorry for being late...just discovered this thead.

Bill, there is the Constitution which includes the Bill of Rights and subsequent amendments. As part of the Union, Texas cannot pass laws that violate those documents. That is so obvious, simple and clear, I have no idea why you need recitation of the matter.

 

[SezMe]

Joe Biden said that Obama was articulate for a black guy.

That's an lie. A despicable, ugly lie.

I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy," Biden said. "I mean, that's a storybook, man.

That carries a TOTALLY different meaning than what you said.

BTW, I haven't read this whole thread. Sorry if this has been covered.

 

[mkelvin]

RON PAUL IS NOT A RACIST. If you view the video which begins this thread (with the tongue in cheek title "Ron Paul's Racist Rant"), you will see that he is the OPPOSITE of a racist. He strongly opposes the current government policies that incarcerate blacks at a higher rate than whites. All the other GOP candidates, and President Obama, support these policies. So who are the real racists here?

On the subject of the newsletters, which were published monthly for quite a few years, there were only a very small number that had racially offensive passages in them. Dr. Paul did not write them, nor was he editing the newsletters at the time. In fact, he was only a minority owner of the publication. But he has publicly taken responsibility for what went out and he has expressed regret for not more carefully reading and approving all of the content. During this time he was not in Congress and had a very busy OBGYN practice, delivering babies. I know a lot of people will say that's a poor excuse, but I'm sure those moms and dads are glad that he was giving all of his attention to delivering their babies.

Anyone who has listened to Ron Paul's speeches and interviews or read his books knows that he has never made racist statements like those newsletter passages that are at issue. He never said that ML King Day was "Hate Whitey Day," for instance. In fact, he has stated on many occasions that Martin Luther King was one of his heroes.

He has certainly never commented on Barack Obama's "Negro dialect," as Democrat Senator Harry Reid recently did. And he was certainly never a recruiter and leader in the Ku Klux Klan, as the late Democrat Senator Robert Byrd was.

A CNN poll which just came out found that Ron Paul has more support among non-whites than any of the other GOP candidates. If he is a racist, how could this be? I think that as his views become better known, his support among non-whites will increase.

This issue of the 20-year-old newsletters will continue to be brought up by people who hate Ron Paul for all kinds of other reasons, but ultimately I predict that it will not hurt him. The continual bringing up of this issue only reveals the desperation of people who want to continue our current policies of endless war and welfare which are bankrupting our nation and destroying our liberties.

 

[mkelvin]

Biden says about Obama: "'I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy,' Biden said. 'I mean, that's a storybook, man.'"

So Biden thinks that prior to Obama, mainstream African-Americans were inarticulate, dumb, dirty, and ugly. I wonder what they would have done to Ron Paul if he had made this statement?

 

[Oliver]

Welcome to the forum mkelvin.

Actually I doubt that anyone in here really believes that Dr. Paul is a racist, although many think he's crazy. That's probably just due to the liberal majority in here and thus - the general view that the debt rocks the way it is. ;"p

 

[Chaos]

Actually he said:

"It's impossible for libertarians to be racist, because racism is a collectivist idea. You see people in Groups."

Question: Do libertarians see people as groups or individuals?

The irony of this is that with this statement, he proves himself not a libertarians, because he shows that he sees libertarians as a group.

 

[SezMe]

So Biden thinks that prior to Obama, mainstream African-Americans were inarticulate, dumb, dirty, and ugly.

That's a really dumb conclusion.

 

[Oliver]

The irony of this is that with this statement, he proves himself not a libertarians, because he shows that he sees libertarians as a group.

That made me laugh. Fröhliche Weihnachten, indeed. :">