"Ron Paul racist rant caught on tape!" (note, in quotes)

[Triterope]

We have a late-breaking bulletin:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011...paul-plots-idUSTRE7BM03320111223?feedType=RSS

WASHINGTON | Thu Dec 22, 2011 8:35pm EST

(Reuters) - A direct-mail solicitation for Ron Paul's political and investment newsletters two decades ago warned of a "coming race war in our big cities" and of a "federal-homosexual cover-up" to play down the impact of AIDS.

The eight-page letter, which appears to carry Paul's signature at the end

Guess he didn't approve that either. Gosh darn those loose cannon staff writers!

 

[Pardalis]

He was too busy at the time looking up ladies' *****.

 

[Pardalis]

So yes, Libertarian to the extreme allows for all the racism any proprietor chooses to hand out. Private property is God. They claim no right of the community to act in its interest, there is only the individual's rights. And when you ask what they believe about one person exercising their rights that hurts someone else's rights, both the Pauls change the subject.

That's what I thought. That's what happens when one let's their ideology take over everything else.

Private property in this case has become more important than people.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

In college a professor, who is sometimes called by the police to identify someone based only on bones, told a class i was in that different races have different bone proportions. He said that the shin bone was proportionally longer in black people. He said that that can help them be faster runners.

Was that a racist thing for him to say?

It was definitely ignorant. Racist would depend on other variables that suggested the basis for his ignorance.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

My apologies; I did not read carefully enough.

I skimmed your post, saw the conclusions the person you quoted gave, but didn't click the link to read more so didn't know the person you were quoting had located and read actual copies of the newsletter. I was curious about finding a primary source, so I went to WorldCat, looked to see where copies might be, was able to find the actual newsletter titles, and through that stumbled on Kirchick's piece. I did a hasty search thread for the word Kirchick, didn't see it, and incorrectly assumed no one had posted the article yet.

No worries, I just wanted to brag.

 

[Triterope]

In college a professor, who is sometimes called by the police to identify someone based only on bones, told a class i was in that different races have different bone proportions. He said that the shin bone was proportionally longer in black people. He said that that can help them be faster runners. Was that a racist thing for him to say?

Please pick up the red courtesy phone, Al Campanis is holding on line one for you.

 

[daredelvis]

Technically, a drop gun is an unregistered weapon that one plants on a shooting victim to make it appear that the person was armed when you shot him. The author is recommending throw-away guns.

You are correct. Obviously I need to watch more crime dramas.

Daredelvis

 

[Giordano]

Bill,

I'd give on this one, if I were you. Your arguments only come off as desperate attempts to rationalize the indefensible. It was the Ron Paul newsletter with his name across the top, owned by his organization, with the express purpose of stating his views. All written in the first person. Politicians may use ghost-writers, but they use them to express the politician's position, not the ghost-writer's.

But why are you surprised? It appears to me that most of the Republican candidates for the presidency are competing for the nomination by trying to say more hateful things about more people than the next candidate.

 

[trvlr2]

Are you saying he printed these things up himself alone in his basement or something?

The comments in question does not sound like the ideas of an educated man. Ron Paul is an educated man.

Lots of foods are sold with name Betty Crocker on it. That does not mean there was a Betty Crocker who invented that recipe. Sander's image is on KFC but there are foods sold there that he never approved when he was alive. In fact, he hated the mashed potatoes gravy.

Bill Thomas: The Right-Wing-Nut Patron Troll of Lost Arguments........

 

[332nd]

In college a professor, who is sometimes called by the police to identify someone based only on bones, told a class i was in that different races have different bone proportions. He said that the shin bone was proportionally longer in black people. He said that that can help them be faster runners.

Was that a racist thing for him to say?

Its a basis for racism.

 

[Greediguts]

Here is a video of Ron in 1995 from C-span. He mentions the newsletter around the 1:52 mark:


No "racist smoking gun here", but he obviously was aware of the newsletter and seems to express some pride in it being published.

Paul's camp seems to be trying to spin the story differently:

http://www.dailypaul.com/194188/the...perspective-and-open-letter-to-james-kirchick

 

[Ladewig]

In college a professor, who is sometimes called by the police to identify someone based only on bones, told a class i was in that different races have different bone proportions. He said that the shin bone was proportionally longer in black people. He said that that can help them be faster runners.

Was that a racist thing for him to say?

Hmmm. Let me think about that. Is a forensics professor saying that there are physiological differences between races which could account for differences in average physical performance the exact same thing as someone saying “if you have ever been robbed by a black teen-aged male, you know how unbelievably fleet-footed they can be"? Yeah, give me a couple of days to consider that question.

 

[Nova Land]

... Paul's camp seems to be trying to spin the story differently:

http://www.dailypaul.com/194188/the...perspective-and-open-letter-to-james-kirchick

One of the attempted defenses given by Kathleen Gee in that Daily Paul article is:

I'm sure you've heard the phrase, "the views expressed on this program are not necessarily the views of staff, advertisers and/or management of this media outlet."

Well, yes. When NBC runs a Sunday morning show such as Meet The Press, it makes sense to have a disclaimer that the views expressed are not necessarily those of the owners of NBC or the sponsors of the program.

But a disclaimer that the views expressed by Ron Paul in this newsletter are not necessarily the views of Ron Paul? Wow!

 

[brodski]

Let's say that Ron Paul is not racist, does not support or condone and has never supported or condoned racism, and that racism is totally contrary to his political views. This is Ron Paul's stated position. So lets take him at his word for the sake of argument.
If we believe him then he is, by his own admission, hopelessly ignorant and negligent on a level comparable only to James Murdoch.
He let someone ghost-write for him for years expressing opinions which were (according to him) 180 degrees out of phase with his own, and send these letters, using Paul's signature, to his supporters- and he didn't notice, and seemingly none of his supporters or staff brought the issue to his attention.
As president,. as he hopes to be, this lack of oversight would be disastrous.

 

[Triterope]

In college a professor, who is sometimes called by the police to identify someone based only on bones, told a class i was in that different races have different bone proportions. He said that the shin bone was proportionally longer in black people. He said that that can help them be faster runners. Was that a racist thing for him to say?

In the context of identifying corpses for a forensic investigation: no.

In the context of why you should buy a gun to prevent carjackings: yes.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

No, but he said they run fast. If that was racist, was the college professor racist?

You're repeating yourself, so I'll repeat myself. What a forensic anthropologist said about skeletal remains is irrelevant to the discussion of the remarks Ron Paul made.

I notice you haven't done the courtesy of answering the questions I've asked.

Do you find his changing defense of the content of his newsletter not at all problematic? How does the fact that he's asserting someone ghost wrote articles as Ron Paul say anything better about him?

ETA: If you see a disconnect between Ron Paul who is running for the GOP nomination in 2012 and the Ron Paul of his newsletter for decades, doesn't it suggest he's at least trying to re-make his public image? At the very least, he was OK with his image as a racist conspiracy theory nut to the audience of his newsletter for many years.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

Its a basis for racism.

But whether or not Bill Thompson had a racist professor in college [eta: based on his own recollection of what that prof said] is irrelevant.

He's just trying to avoid discussion of the problem Ron Paul has wrt to his newsletter and other statements that he doesn't even deny having made himself.

ETA: Or, Bill Thomspon, are you trying to argue that the following statement is not racist? “If you have ever been robbed by a black teenaged male, you know how unbelievably fleet of foot they can be.”

 

[madfoot]

Paul also has very extreme views on state's rights, and (if I'm not mistaken) has said that he would end the Drug War but would allow each state to decide on their own what their drug laws would be. I wonder if he feels the same way about the death penalty?

Still, for most hilarious Paul quote yet (at 2:45): "It's impossible for libertarians to be racist, because racism is a collectivist idea." (!)
When he says stuff like this, I just kinda sit and stare at the screen, and think: "WOW...you actually do believe all this stuff, don't you?!?"

(Oh, and a little bit earlier, he says that "civil disobedience/non-violence" are "libertarian principles". That's news to me.)

He tends to be bad at phrasing things. It may sound ridiculous the way he said it, but the point is sound. Libertarians don't like generalizing people into groups (be it by race, religion, age, what have you), and as an ideology, libertarianism is essentially incompatible with nationalism. I wouldn't say that it's "impossible" for libertarians to be racist, but it's a position based in individual rights and libertarians generally see people as individuals.

 

[BStrong]

So listening to a rant is the same as writing the rant? Do you have any evidence Obama's views mirror Wright's? Because there is evidence Rand has deeply held racist views.

If an individual sits through a KKK meeting more than once, it's safe to say they might hold the same views of the speaker.

 

[brodski]

He tends to be bad at phrasing things. It may sound ridiculous the way he said it, but the point is sound. Libertarians don't like generalizing people into groups (be it by race, religion, age, what have you), and as an ideology, libertarianism is essentially incompatible with nationalism. I wouldn't say that it's "impossible" for libertarians to be racist, but it's a position based in individual rights and libertarians generally see people as individuals.

In which case, why were these letters sent by staff working for a libertarian to libertarian supporters for years, without these libertarians kicking up a massive fuss?
Did nobody notice that they were promoting collectivist propaganda?