Merged Lockerbie bomber alive after 9 months

Rolfe said:
My complaint is that Megrahi seems to have been pressurised into abandoning his appeal, which could legally have been continued even after he was released, and more so that the entire Lockerbie investigation was a shambles that went after the wrong modus operandi and in the end convicted an uninvolved passer-by.
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I think he also was pressured into abandoning his appeal but what was the carrot that was dangled in front of him? The widespread belief was to die shortly afterwards at home with his family. Three months of misery then to die a convicted mass murderer? Hmmm, now I'm not so sure. What if (and yes, this is just a theory) that it was abiraterone that he was promised? Any competent onocologist specializing in prostate cancer knew in the summer of 2009 that abiraterone was very promising in clinical trials.

News reports now say he has been taking abiraterone, I've read no other reason for his continuing to live with such a nasty cancer without it. Just where has he been getting this drug from? It's only approved for clinical use in England and only approved for general use in the U.S (and only since April). He appears to be getting it on the black market either from the UK or the U.S.

I think abiraterone is a much bigger story than just being a great new drug to treat prostate cancer.
 
Rolfe said:
Thataway --------> :D

Rolfe.
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Sometimes conspiracies are true (eg. Watergate, Lincoln's assassination). So where do you think he's getting abiraterone from? Do you think there is another explaination for his longevity other than abiraterone?

Let's see what happens three months after Gaddafi's fall when the big bucks to buy abiraterone aren't around anymore. The rebels aren't going to foreget seeing al-Mergrahi at last month's pro-Gaddafi rally.
 
You think the (recently ex) government of Libya can't get an anti-cancer drug on the open market? You think whatever oncology specialists have been treating Megrahi couldn't just write whatever script they wanted?

Megrahi was desperate to get home to his wife and children (not to mention his elderly mother) before he died. That was an open secret. Why you should imagine that he was prepared to sit in Greenock jail until he croaked, until Kenny came along and said "drop that appeal and we'll get you a new miracle drug", I don't know.

Rolfe.
 
Rolfe said:
You think the (recently ex) government of Libya can't get an anti-cancer drug on the open market? You think whatever oncology specialists have been treating Megrahi couldn't just write whatever script they wanted?
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I think all the oncology specialists on Gaddafi's payroll are now more concerned with fleeing the country then they are with making sure they get black market Zytiga.
 
And I think you're right. However, that has precisely nothing to do with what I said, or with what you said previously.

ETA: Black market? Why would it be black market? Why would the manufacturer not simply sell to an appropriate purchaser, which would include a hospital treating cancer patients, even if it was in Tripoli?

Rolfe.
 
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Rolfe said:
ETA: Black market? Why would it be black market? Why would the manufacturer not simply sell to an appropriate purchaser, which would include a hospital treating cancer patients, even if it was in Tripoli?

Rolfe.
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Because a pharmaceutical company can't legally sell a drug in a country where that nation's health authority (eg. The Food & Drug Administration in the U.S.) hasn't approved it for use in humans. Have you ever been to Tijuana? Every third shop is a pharmacy where Americans go to get pharmaceuticals they legally can't get in the U.S.

As far as I can tell, currently Zytiga is only availabe for prescription legally in the U.S. and Canada. If you had a relative in Scotland dying of prostate cancer and the doctor said Zytiga was his only hope you would have to hit the black market too.
 
Alt+F4 said:
Because a pharmaceutical company can't legally sell a drug in a country where that nation's health authority (eg. The Food & Drug Administration in the U.S.) hasn't approved it for use in humans. Have you ever been to Tijuana? Every third shop is a pharmacy where Americans go to get pharmaceuticals they legally can't get in the U.S.

As far as I can tell, currently Zytiga is only availabe for prescription legally in the U.S. and Canada. If you had a relative in Scotland dying of prostate cancer and the doctor said Zytiga was his only hope you would have to hit the black market too.
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This is the same drug you said the doctors should have known Megrahi could have been treated with (even though it was still under trial), yet it's not available officially, according to you, in either Scotland or Libya?
 
zooterkin said:
This is the same drug you said the doctors should have known Megrahi could have been treated with (even though it was still under trial), yet it's not available officially, according to you, in either Scotland or Libya?
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Yes, not available officially....but available for those with the right connections/money I'm sure. If you were dying of cancer and were told that this was your only hope and it's quite promising wouldn't you take the deal too? As far as I know Zytiga is still not available officially in Libya but he's getting it.
 
I don't think Alt+F4 has much of a clue about this. The drug is properly licensed. It's not available on the NHS in Britain, that's the thing.

This idea that the manufacturers would refuse to sell it to a Libyan hospital on the prescription of a bona fide oncology specialist to treat a bona fide cancer patient is simply ludicrous.

The sad thing is, I doubt very much if Megrahi will continue to get the drug now, whatever else does or doesn't happen to him.

I'm sure it all seemed so easy in 1988 when John Orr said "it is almost certain the bomb did not originate at Heathrow." And it was easy in 1989 to say, let's pretend the bomb came from Malta, because that lets both Heathrow and Frankfurt off the hook, and Malta security is bound to be leaky too.

But the end result of that is that an innocent man's life was ruined. Maybe more than one, I suspect Kurt Maier who was saddled with the blame for letting the bomb through security at Frankfurt also had his life ruined over the same thing. Even though it was hardly his fault he didn't see a bomb that wasn't there.

This is one of the most shameful episodes in my country's history, and we're right in the middle of it.

Rolfe.
 
Rolfe said:
I do feel desperately sorry for al-Megrahi.
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Excellent post. I hope you also feel sorry for the majority of Libya's people (somewhere between one and two million, from a nation of six, publicly demonstrated the same day against NATO and the rebels and for the government (tottering regime) as recently as July 7) who've had their wishes for their country smashed by brute force so their country can be taken over by the West.

From what we know of rebel behavior, some of these green flag wavers may well be slaughtered for supporting the old regime. Hundreds, thousands? Tripoli is a big city. We won't hear much about it, likely. Focusing on reconstruction from the blown up buildings, economic upheaval, and mass death that resulted from this last six months of Gaddafi's 'brutal 42-year rule.'

As for Megrahi, what next is a good question. I could well see his racked frame rolled onto the tarmac at JFK, where his bomb never landed, to decline quickly and expire in some American jail.

It's sad, but he's just one guy.
 
Rolfe said:
I don't think Alt+F4 has much of a clue about this. The drug is properly licensed. It's not available on the NHS in Britain, that's the thing.
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Please provide evidence that Zytiga is properly licensed for sale in Libya and that any Libyan doctor, hospital or governement agency has a contract with Johnson & Johnson to supply them with Zytiga. And "properly licensed" with who? Where out the U.S. does the FDA have authority? Where out Canada does Health Canada have authority?

This idea that the manufacturers would refuse to sell it to a Libyan hospital on the prescription of a bona fide oncology specialist to treat a bona fide cancer patient is simply ludicrous.
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Please provide evidence that a bona fide oncologist can get Zytiga legally today anywhere outside the U.S. and Canada. You just stated above that is it's not on the NHS so it's not available Britian even with a prescription of a bona fide onocologist!

The sad thing is, I doubt very much if Megrahi will continue to get the drug now, whatever else does or doesn't happen to him.
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What's even sadder is that thousands of men won't get this drug...maybe ever.
 
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Caustic Logic said:
Excellent post. I hope you also feel sorry for the majority of Libya's people (somewhere between one and two million, from a nation of six, publicly demonstrated the same day against NATO and the rebels and for the government (tottering regime) as recently as July 7) who've had their wishes for their country smashed by brute force so their country can be taken over by the West.

From what we know of rebel behavior, some of these green flag wavers may well be slaughtered for supporting the old regime. Hundreds, thousands? Tripoli is a big city. We won't hear much about it, likely. Focusing on reconstruction from the blown up buildings, economic upheaval, and mass death that resulted from this last six months of Gaddafi's 'brutal 42-year rule.'

As for Megrahi, what next is a good question. I could well see his racked frame rolled onto the tarmac at JFK, where his bomb never landed, to decline quickly and expire in some American jail.

It's sad, but he's just one guy.
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The whole thing is one complete and total cluster:rule10. At the moment, my sympathies are with Megrahi, because it's kind of personal. That one person should have that much crap happen to his life, is just insane.

Everyone else - yeah, of course. And in all the other trouble spots around the globe. But I don't know their names.

Rolfe.
 
Alt+F4 said:
Please provide evidence that Zytiga is properly licensed for sale in Libya and that any Libyan doctor, hospital or governement agency has a contract with Johnson & Johnson to supply them with Zytiga.

Please provide evidence that a bona fide oncologist can get Zytiga legally today anywhere outside the U.S. and Canada.

What's even sadder is that thousands of men won't get this drug...maybe ever.
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No, why don't you provide evidence that laws applicable to the situation were broken by anyone in order to get this drug for Megrahi. You're big on the conspiracy theorising, not so hot on the actual evidence.

The drug is still going through the approval process for the NHS. Look up Herceptin some time. If you think this process should be faster, then go complain on the appropriate thread.

Rolfe.
 
Rolfe said:
No, why don't you provide evidence that laws applicable to the situation were broken by anyone in order to get this drug for Megrahi. You're big on the conspiracy theorising, not so hot on the actual evidence.
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That's not how it works. You are the one making the claims, it's you that needs to back them up with evidence.
 
Caustic Logic said:
As for Megrahi, what next is a good question. I could well see his racked frame rolled onto the tarmac at JFK, where his bomb never landed, to decline quickly and expire in some American jail.
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There are already some lawmakers making noise about getting this mass murderer back in custody.
 
I think America and Britain are planning and want to get the "mass murderer" Gaddafi into custody the same way they tried soooooo hard to get Osama bin Laden into custody
 
Alt+F4 said:
Please provide evidence that a bona fide oncologist can get Zytiga legally today anywhere outside the U.S. and Canada. You just stated above that is it's not on the NHS so it's not available Britian even with a prescription of a bona fide onocologist!
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So, are you now admitting you were wrong when you earlier stated that it should have been considered as a treatment option when estimating Megrahi's prognosis? It's still not available on the NHS, so he could not have been given it if he'd remained in prison.
 
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